Jump to content

No sharp images


peterridding

Recommended Posts

Ater weeks and weeks of homework, I have just purchased the 450D and 17-55 f2.8 IS USM, as well as the 70-300 f4/5.6.  I have taken about 700 shots using every combination that comes with the camera and 17-55 lens.  I am absolutely disappointed in the results.  Blurred, soft, some over exposed, but even on a tripod, faster shutter speed, I still do NOT have a sharp image at 100%.  My S5 IS takes a better image.  Obviously I thought it was driver error, but after reading all the advice and experimenting, with no better result, I may have a bad camera body.  Is this possible?  Could it be the 17-55 lens?  I am totally at a loss what to do, and the combination was expensive in AUD. I have been into photography for years, film slrs and compact digital, now dslr.  It comes down to driver error or equipment error - any help will be greatly appreciated, preferably before I hang myself.
Link to comment
Share on other sites

<p>There are several differences in the way dSLRs work (compared to P&S cameras)</p>

<ul>

<li>dSLRs do a much less aggressive internal postprocessing (leaving more room for human processing). This often leads to the (wrong) assumtion that the images are less sharp. The aren't ... in fact, they are less sharpened. Play with the sharpness parameter in you camera menu and see whats happening. Also, try to play with the image in postprocessing a bit.</li>

<li>Same applies for saturisation.</li>

<li>Depth of field is a very important difference. While P&S (due to their tiny sensor) usually show the whole picture (from foreground to background) sharp, dSLRs do NOT! There is a technical reason for this, and the photographer should be aware of it when taking the shot.</li>

</ul>

<p>The other thing is, that having so much money spend, one usually expects immediate and enormous improvements. But very often there isn't. The S5 IS wasn't a bad camera (by the way) ... but compare two lowlight shots taken at 800iso ... just to give you something immediately visible.</p>

Link to comment
Share on other sites

<p>Peter,<br>

My suggestion is to "take a step back" and work through a few tests to help identify the cause of the issue. First up, I would suggest taking a shot of something contrasty and well defined (eg black writing on a white page). Mount the camera on a tripod - use manual focusing with liveview set to 10x, and preferably with a remote release or self timer.<br>

If you get a good result then repeat the test, but with the AF switched on to see if it's an AF issue.<br>

Be aware that when shooting RAW, it's essential to apply sharpening in post processing; Canon recommend amount = 300%, Radius = 0.3, and threshold = 0 as an excellent starting point - this makes BIG difference when viewing pixels at 100%. If you're shooting jpeg then default sharpening is typically smaller amounts and larger radiuses, which make an image printed at a typical size more defined, but don't improve it the same way when examining pixels at 100%.<br>

Other things that enter in to it are AF mode (1-Shot or Servo) - AF point selection - Depth of Field - shutter speed (in relation to camera shake) - filters - subject.<br>

I'd suggest trying the above, and let us know how you get on.<br>

Cheers,<br>

Colin<br>

 </p>

Link to comment
Share on other sites

<p>I also couldn't get a sharp image (with the 50D). I sent it back to Canon 2X for correction but the result was "no improvement" each time. I returned it to the camera store. They replaced it with another faulty camera so they replaced it again. Now, I think that I have a camera that works.<br>

 </p>

Link to comment
Share on other sites

<p> Peter, I have the exact same set up as you and have noticed similiar results. I have noticed a few things that may be of some help. First is, as stated above, the results can be improved dramatically in post processing and there is a menu function to increase sharpening. Most of my soft shots in retrospect have been traceable to me by some error. For instance forgetting to stop back down after shooting at f2.8. I have also occasionally forgoten to turn off image stabilization when shooting on a tripod. I have also noticed that what looks a little soft on the monitor looks sharp as a tack  printed and could be an issue regarding screen resolution.</p>

<p>Having said that however, I still am often disapointed in the results with this combination of lens and body. I often get images I feel are unacceptably soft when there is no apparent reason. For insance shooting at f11 at a 500 shutterspeed on a bright sunny day. I'm not sure if this is true but I have noticed that when shooting objects up close or within say 50 ft. I get very sharp results. When shooting landscapes at wide angles the horizon line and things around the edges are soft, especially any details in trees. I can usually get the results I want but I have to check and adjust constantly, for what seem like very normal and unchallenging situations. This is with the 17-55 EFS IS I am refering too. The 70-300 seems pretty sharp except fully zoomed at 300mm. Always a little soft there.</p>

<p>My biggest complaint with the camera is the sensitivity to highlights. I have found it necessary to underexpose a stop or two in <em>any</em> outdoor situation to keep the highlights from blowing out. This is a constant struggle that requires extremely close attention to preserve detail. I'd rather underexpose and adjust in post processing than lose highlight detail that is impossible to recover. I have enabled the highlight tone priority function but to little avail. My other big complaint is a lot of noise at any exposure longer than a second. Any shot taken at night seems to have a ton of noise that looks like orange snow. I have poured over the manual and enabled noise reduction, but it seems to do little and it is so severe  I am unable to eliminate it  in post- proccesing. I have considered upgrading to a 50D or a 5D, because I want a camera that handles these issues more effectively. I have to do some homework though, to make sure it doesn't have the same sensor. I'd consider trying Nikon but I don't want to buy new lenses.</p>

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Peter -- I'm actually in a similar position, but I haven't ruled out operator error [in my case] just yet. I have yet to try a few things, but I also posted a thread (http://www.photo.net/canon-eos-digital-camera-forum/00RhyT -- just a day before yours, incidentally!). I haven't been getting many blown highlights, but I'm not sure if my issues could be fixed by calibration.

 

I'm waiting for the weather to clear up a little bit before I try some shots with the 17-55 outside; I've been shooting with the 50 prime and the results aren't ideal, operator error or not.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

<p>Hi again, I noticed I have 8 responses, and thank you to those people.  It was extremely hard to read as they don't show up as my answer above does, but in some word pad with all the heiroglyphics associated with it.  Wonder what happened?  But can read enough to take the advice on board.  It was interesting to read about the difference between my S5 with the smaller sensor and the 450D with larger sensor.  I can understand why the S5 pics look better.  Thanks.  I have tried the 1 shot, AI focus AF, AI servo AF, with the automatic and manual AF point selection and evaluative metering, but again the landscape features are not just soft, but more like blurred.  I used higher shutter speeds handheld with higher ISO to try and get a little depth of field, no good.  I used the tripod (a good one) but did not turn the image stabilizer off - the manual says to to save battery power - so I will do that.  I have noticed that even with the 2.8 lens I need really strong light so I can use 100 ISO and get some depth of field, so have to have a fairly low shutter speed 30th to 60th sec but consider the IS would handle this.  I'm into landscapes and will be tramping around NZ early next year so won't be carriyng a tripod with this rather heavy setup.  I haven't put any post processing into the pics, and taken them all on large jpeg (highest setting).  I'm getting desperate as I just can't get my pics sharp.  Would it be possible to post the comments again so I can read them properly and print them out?  I know I'm asking a lot!  To be fair, I did capture a few decent pics of a seagull on sports mode with the 300 lens, and a few decent evening shots with the 17 lens, but again at 100% they show some softness.  I captured one sharp shot yesterday, indoors, handheld, of a bauble on the Xmas tree.  Not bad out of 700 shots!  So this must be driver error, if 5 in 700 come out clear?  I won't even go into the blown out highlights this time, just the exposure/sharpness.  I wait patiently for those good people to rewrite their comments.  Thank you so much.</p>
Link to comment
Share on other sites

<p>2 things peter, is `IS` on or off? if on when you focus the IS takes time to settle, if you clic too quick t

he lens will still be moving internally, if `IS` is off, when you focus  the USM is very quiet have h

ear d of the MF/AF switch not on right so move it back & forth, then when you focus on a close object

(book) by half press the shutter then something in the backyard, half press again (1 shot mode) does it move th

e elem ents and look sharp in the viewfin

Link to comment
Share on other sites

<p>Hi Chris, I did wait for the IS to settle in and yes, the lens automatically focuses near and far, I can hear it, and the images look sharp in the viewfinder.  Is it best, for landscape say, to have the automatic (9 dots trying to focus) or the manual setting of using one dot better?</p>
Link to comment
Share on other sites

<p>there is a huge difference bewteen a dslr and a p&s. first, in a p&s it supplies all the thinking it is setup, from the factory to give good to very good pics straight  from the box. and does. a dslr will not do this YOU have to supply all the thinking; or it is very likely that the dslr shots will be worse than the p&s.<br>

i can give you some general guidelines-<br>

shutter speed. keep it at 1/125sec or faster(you can get away with 1/60sec if you have to). this depends on subject movement. 1/125 will stop a person walking or running but not a car.<br>

fstop. use f5.6 to f11.0 if possible. below f5.6 you will get a pic ok but the lens will begin to get soft and the dof will drop off. above f11.0 you run into diffraction distorsion. thius is what light does when it passes through a small hole. does this mean at f12.0 the pic is fully distorted? no. but it is beginning. max IQ and performance is between about f5.6 and f11.<br>

IS and tripod. turn IS off when the camera is on a tripod. it has nothing to do with the battery. it is because the IS will continually check for shake, and that check will actually cause shake when there was none there. so it is best to turn it off alltogether.<br>

kit lens. it is not the best but certainly capable of give  reasonable pics.<br>

be sure to use proper stance and han dholding technique. what you can get away with with a p&s is not what you can do with a dslr. the dslr demands better technique or it will show in the pics.<br>

iso. use the lowest iso you can that gives a reasonable shutter speed and fstop. the lower the iso the bettter the IQ.<br>

exposure. if you know how to use a histogram try not to let the histoine hit the right side of the hisrogram box before it hits the bottom. if you do the highlights will be blown.<br>

below is some prewritten remarks on dslr and p&s.</p>

<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 5pt 0in; mso-pagination: none; mso-layout-grid-align: none;"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: Times New Roman;">i wrote the following posts some time ago, they may be of interest. <br /><br />no matter which dslr you buy. <br style="mso-special-character: line-break;" /><br style="mso-special-character: line-break;" /></span></p>

<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 5pt 0in; mso-pagination: none; mso-layout-grid-align: none;"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: Times New Roman;">heavily consider the following. there are NEW DSLR owners' writing in all over these forums on this subject.</span></p>

<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 5pt 0in; mso-pagination: none; mso-layout-grid-align: none;"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: Times New Roman;">when changeing from a p&s to a dslr, there is a huge difference. <br style="mso-special-character: line-break;" /><br style="mso-special-character: line-break;" /></span></p>

<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 5pt 0in; mso-pagination: none; mso-layout-grid-align: none;"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: Times New Roman;">when you take p&s out of the box add a memory card and a fully charged battery you can now shoot and take very good pics.</span></p>

<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 5pt 0in; mso-pagination: none; mso-layout-grid-align: none;"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: Times New Roman;">BUT, you cannot do this with dslr. the camera HAS TO BE SETUP first. you have to adjust the contrast/saturation/sharpness/shooting modes(color style or whatever it is called) to your likes. if you don't it is quite likely you will disappointed with results. your p&s will likely outshoot the dslr. </span></p>

<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 5pt 0in; mso-pagination: none; mso-layout-grid-align: none;"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: Times New Roman;">to setup-you have shoot a test shot make ONE adjustment reshoot check pc screen readjust, until you are satisfied. and you do this with each of the adjustment types. then you have all the custom adjustments in the menu to check and if wanted change.</span></p>

<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 5pt 0in; mso-pagination: none; mso-layout-grid-align: none;"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: Times New Roman;">when done you can put the camera into AUTO or PROGRAM and get reasonably nice shots. i would advise at first staying with jpeg. as you learn about the camera and photography you can then go to the other shooting modes and try RAW if you wish.</span></p>

<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 5pt 0in; mso-pagination: none; mso-layout-grid-align: none;"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: Times New Roman;">dslrs are made to see the shot through the optical viewfinder not through the lcd. this is true of almost all dslrs including the k10d. </span></p>

<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 5pt 0in; mso-pagination: none; mso-layout-grid-align: none;"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: Times New Roman;">dslrs and color. <br style="mso-special-character: line-break;" /><br style="mso-special-character: line-break;" /></span></p>

<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 5pt 0in; mso-pagination: none; mso-layout-grid-align: none;"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: Times New Roman;">if you mean heavy saturated colors then no dslr is going to do that. they are not made to give strongly saturated colors. they are made to give ACCURATE COLORS. not heavy saturated colors.</span></p>

<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 5pt 0in; mso-pagination: none; mso-layout-grid-align: none;"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: Times New Roman;">this is not the same thing at all. too many people who come from a p&s are very disappointed in the dslr colors, because they are not bright and saturated. this is because they are and have been using a p&s which has been giving them saturated and incorrect colors for so long that they think it is the right look. nothing could be further from the truth. the p&s colors are wrong, wrong. the camera manufactures know that the public buys high megapixel and heavy saturated colors and is what they make and sell to the public.</span></p>

<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 5pt 0in; mso-pagination: none; mso-layout-grid-align: none;"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: Times New Roman;">but the slr/dslr is a whole different world. for the dslr accuracy of the scene in terms of view and color is a religion rpt religion. you want accurate color that is what you are going to get with dslr. but they will not be the bright saturated colors of a p&s. ytou can with adjustments in the menus up the color is dslr, but it will not look the INACCURATE CARTOON COLOR of the p&s.</span></p>

<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 5pt 0in; mso-pagination: none; mso-layout-grid-align: none;"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: Times New Roman;">if you are wishing to buy a dslr for more and brighter color, save you money the p&s is what you want.</span></p>

<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 5pt 0in; mso-pagination: none; mso-layout-grid-align: none;"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: Times New Roman;">not too long ago a new owner of a dslr was on these forums talking about the poor color of his new dslr. it seems as if he was shooting on an overcast day. many many people replying to him told him that cloudy day shots give the most accurate color, which they do. he couldn't believe and get over that idea. he also owned a p&S previously.</span></p>

<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 5pt 0in; mso-pagination: none; mso-layout-grid-align: none;"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: Times New Roman;">you might be interested in this; which i posted a while back. <br /><br />http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1036&message=23677257; <br /><br /><br /><br style="mso-special-character: line-break;" /><br style="mso-special-character: line-break;" /></span></p>

<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 0in 0in 0pt; mso-pagination: none; mso-layout-grid-align: none;"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial;"> </span><br>

 

<p> </p>

</p>

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
×
×
  • Create New...