Nikon D780, $300 Trade-Up Program

Recall that Nikon briefly discounted the D750 to $999 during Black Friday two months ago, I was a bit surprised that they announced the D780 at the same $2300 initial price as the D750 over 5 years ago, since IMO the improvements are fairly limited on the still-capture side. Hence I thought Nikon needs to discount the D780 quite soon, probably to $2000 first and later on $1800. Such discount has begun already. The first step is that between February 3 and March 29, 2020, Nikon is providing a $300 trade-in discount for the D780, similar to what they did for the Z6 and Z7 a year ago.

See this link for more details: Nikon D780 Trade-Up Program | Sell & Save with Upgrade

The trade in can be any working camera from any brand. You get the "regular" trade in value for that camera plus an additional $300 towards the purchase of a D780 or a D780 with lens kit. And for those who have already purchased a D780, this discount can be applied retroactively.

P.S. Nikon's fiscal year ends on March 31.

I wonder if Nikon will do the D750 for $999 again.

That could be bad for my wallet.

P.S. Nikon's fiscal year ends on March 31.

Trying to balance the books & cashflow?

I wonder if Nikon will do the D750 for $999 again.

That could be bad for my wallet.

They had that sale for four days from Black Friday through Monday last year. Apparently Nikon managed to sell enough of them or they no longer have that many in stock, such that they never had that sale again for the rest of the holiday season.

I don’t think they are still manufacturing the D750 any more. If they have any remaining stock to dump, it should be in March before the end of the fiscal year. It will be brief so that you need to catch it quickly.

I wonder if Nikon will do the D750 for $999 again.

That could be bad for my wallet.

Just thought to let you know - a quick check at eBay shows new ones for even less. These may be Gray market (I don't know) - but I normally don't care if it is or not. Used ones are even less. But why get back to DSLR? I am getting away from it. I will be selling my DSLRs when I have the time to deal with it.

Just thought to let you know - a quick check at eBay shows new ones for even less. These may be Gray market (I don't know) - but I normally don't care if it is or not. Used ones are even less. But why get back to DSLR? I am getting away from it. I will be selling my DSLRs when I have the time to deal with it.

You are right.

I have been thinking REALLY HARD about the D750 vs Z6.

My gut reaction is to go for the new system and the Z6. Cut the dSLR line and go for the future.

But as you know m4/3 is my primary system, so the D750 would have been a specialty use camera, for low light sports.

I have to wonder how genuine the offer is when reading comments like this on dpr: "The problem with these trade up programs is they give you nothing for your camera. They offered me $350 for my D750 (this assumed good working condition). I could have sold it for parts for a little less than that. They were selling for $800-850 used at the time" If the camera to be offered in trade is literally worth nothing then it makes sense, but otherwise it is good to investigate alternative options.

For indoor sports, a camera like the D7x0 would work quite well. I guess the only thing is that the AF sensor array in the D750/780 is narrow in the center of the image so it might not be ideal when working with shallow depth of field. But the continous focusing on the D750 works well and early user reports suggest the D780 is much-improved. Newer processor and algorithms must be doing their work.

I don't think a Z would be a good choice for indoor sports. There are no native teles except the 85/1.8 (70-200 is delayed). With adapter, F mount teles seem to struggle a bit in low light when I did some testing but it depends on the lens and how low the light is. A D750 with existing (previously paid-for) F mount lenses would be cheaper than getting a Z6 and all-new 70-200/2.8 S etc. Of course, Nikon are working on the AF but what I've seen isn't very convincing in low light (even with native lens the focus can struggle with dark skin). In a bit brighter light such as daylight through window, the Z's seem to focus fine though. I would at least test the camera and lens in the application intended before spending that much money.

Why buy a DSLR? One can buy what one wants, finances permitting. Personally when testing portraits with the Z7, I loved the 50/1.8 S's image quality but the captured expressions did not match my memory of what I remembered seeing in the viewfinder and that to me is a good enough reason to avoid a camera. I guess the problem is the delay in the VF and the blackout meant I couldn't see what was being captured in the way I am used to. I know DSLRs go dark during the capture but still I usually end up with what I am aiming for. I guess it is a learning experience. For me the most important skill I have in photography is the anticipation and capture of a moment based on what I see through the viewfinder. If there is a disruption to that process, then it's a too deep and wide a canyon to jump over for me.

, Nikon are working on the AF but what I've seen isn't very convincing in low light

It's not so easy to compare the AF specs. of the DSLRs with the new Z cameras. My D7200 for example quotes AF down to -3 EV at ISO 100 without stating an aperture. The implication here is that it's f/5.6 or (even f/8 in the centre) since the design of the system means that the light from wider apertures is essentially lost. The Z cameras are different; IIRC they quote AF at an aperture of f/1.8, so that if the Z camera quoted AF at -3 EV ISO 100 with a f/1.8 lens then you are better of with the DSLR if your lens has an aperture slower than f/1.8.

I have to wonder how genuine the offer is when reading comments like this on dpr: "The problem with these trade up programs is they give you nothing for your camera. They offered me $350 for my D750 (this assumed good working condition).

As I mentioned in my opening post, on last Black Friday, Nikon was selling a brand new D750 for $999, and as Mary says, gray D750 is even cheaper. Used ones are probably $500-600. It is very normal that they give you 50% of what they can sell it for a trade in. Therefore, $350 is totally appropriate. The camera store has a lot of overheads: they need to provide a short warranty, they need to pay for credit card charges .... You are always much better off selling it yourself and cut off the middle-person.

But this $300 trade in deal is just Nikon's way to quickly admit that they priced the D780 too high initially so that they need to discount it immediately. You can probably buy a $10 disposable camera and still quality for the trade in. Some stores would completely find a trade it for you and handle that part. What they and Nikon really want to do is to sell you a D780 for $2000. Wait a few more months and this entire "trade in" part will be gone. Nikon will simply discount the D780 outright. It was this same game they played with the Z7 and Z6 last year.

I loved the 50/1.8 S's image quality but the captured expressions did not match my memory of what I remembered seeing in the viewfinder and that to me is a good enough reason to avoid a camera. I guess the problem is the delay in the VF and the blackout meant I couldn't see what was being captured in the way I am used to.

For all mirrorless cameras, there will always be some EVF latency. Apparently it is shortest on Sony's A9 and A9 II at this point. Based on my rough measurement, it is about 0.04 second. Jim Kasson measured the Z7's latency to be 22.3 millisecond; he rounds that up to 0.03 second, give or take. I was using 14-bit capture. I understand the lag is shorter with 12 bit:

• My thread: Nikon Z6, Early Impressions
  
• Jim Kasson's thread: Z7 EVF latency: Nikon Z Mirrorless Talk Forum: Digital Photography Review
  

Such latency could still be a bit of a problem for action photography. It really shouldn't be an issue at all for portraits.

After a year and half, so far Nikon has introduced eight Z-mount, S lenses. All of them are very good/excellent. The catch is that while we can use our F-mount lenses on the mirrorless Z bodies via the FTZ adapter, those excellent Z lenses are useless on the D780 and all Nikon SLRs. That is just yet another reason DSLR sales will continue to decline.

I loved the 50/1.8 S's image quality but the captured expressions did not match my memory of what I remembered seeing in the viewfinder

Yes. It's called 'reaction time'. It's been scientifically shown that everyone's brain is about 1/10th of a second behind reality. Then add muscle activation time on to that.

...the blackout meant I couldn't see what was being captured in the way I am used to.

I wonder what sort of DSLR you're using that doesn't black out the viewfinder while the picture is being captured?

Nothing stops you from actually leaving the camera tripod-mounted and actually looking directly at the subject while you press the button. Face to face communication often results in better portraits too. As is often shown in films where the photographer is looking at and directing the model while the inevitable 'blad 500c sits atop a tripod and fires at an unrealistic rate with little apparent human intervention. The movie version is fictional fantasy, but direct subject interaction is definitely a good idea.

Nothing stops you from actually leaving the camera tripod-mounted and actually looking directly at the subject while you press the button. Face to face communication often results in better portraits too. As is often shown in films where the photographer is looking at and directing the model while the inevitable 'blad 500c sits atop a tripod and fires at an unrealistic rate with little apparent human intervention. The movie version is fictional fantasy, but direct subject interaction is definitely a good idea.

That is how I remember my childhood studio portraits being shot.

LF view camera on a dolly, photographer on the side of the camera holding a bulb release, and looking at and talking directly to the subject/me.

I always thought that was better than a voice coming out from behind the camera.

Why buy a DSLR? One can buy what one wants, finances permitting. Personally when testing portraits with the Z7, I loved the 50/1.8 S's image quality but the captured expressions did not match my memory of what I remembered seeing in the viewfinder and that to me is a good enough reason to avoid a camera. I guess the problem is the delay in the VF and the blackout meant I couldn't see what was being captured in the way I am used to. I know DSLRs go dark during the capture but still I usually end up with what I am aiming for. I guess it is a learning experience.

There is a difference between a dSLR blackout and a mirrorless blackout.

With a dSLR, as the mirror goes up/down, the image in the viewfinder gets darker/lighter. So there is a gradual but fast reduction in the brightness of the viewfinder, before it goes black.

With a mirrorless, the blackout is binary. There is no gradual darkening/lightening. So the blackout is visually more jarring to the eye.

But with a mirrorless, there is always the option to use the e-shutter, and NOT even have a blackout. And you can still be able to shoot using the viewfinder.

When I shoot basketball with my Olympus, I use the e-shutter.

As for EVF delay, yes that exists, and is different by brand and camera model. Some are worse than others.

But in the end, if a mirrorless does not work for you, don't use one.

When I was shooting sports with the Olympus EM1-mk1, the EVF was so frustrating to use, that I gave up and switched back to my Nikon D7200.

The EM1-mk2 however, fixed all the issues that I had with the mk1, to such a degree that I can and do use it to shoot sports.

So don't count out a camera/technology based on version 1 of an item.

if you do not "need" the absolutely newest of the newest, i think it is much more economical to wait 2 years before buying the "new"model, i did a "trade up"oncefor the D500 and still have regrets to walk into the trap ...

Right now that D500 is around 700 euro's cheaper and i still would have my previous 2 camera's , so never again a trade up for the newest model for me...

if you do not "need" the absolutely newest of the newest, i think it is much more economical to wait 2 years before buying the "new"model, i did a "trade up"oncefor the D500 and still have regrets to walk into the trap ...

Right now that D500 is around 700 euro's cheaper and i still would have my previous 2 camera's , so never again a trade up for the newest model for me...

I'd definitely endorse the 'wait and see' approach.

With so many of Nikon's cameras showing teething troubles, I don't think it pays at all to be an early-adopter.

Not just with Nikon, but so much of bleeding-edge technology proves flawed in the early stages, or just plain fails to live up to its promise.

The general population of consumers seems to have become the Beta-test group in the eyes of many manufacturers. And instead of fixing any flaws for free, the offending model is simply replaced with an updated one 6 to 12 months later.

Abes of Maine selling D750 at below $999. I bought from them before. One bonus: There is no local tax unless you live in their state (NY or NJ?).

Mary, that is a Gray Market camera. It is described as a "Brand New Factory Fresh Import Model " (emphasis added).

Mary, that is a Gray Market camera. It is described as a "Brand New Factory Fresh Import Model " (emphasis added).

I did see that too. I will not understand why there is such a "status symbol" when every bit of the camera is the same. We do know that they can be repaired anyway by some Nikon repair shops - should such service is needed.

I did see that too. I will not understand why there is such a "status symbol" when every bit of the camera is the same. We do know that they can be repaired anyway by some Nikon repair shops - should such service is needed.

Nikon is cutting off independent repair shops. There have been several articles about that and posts in this forum.

Nikon Shuttering Their Authorized Repair Program

Keep Independent Nikon Repair Service

Nikon is cutting off independent repair shops. There have been several articles about that and posts in this forum.

Fate uncertain but I believe unlikely. They said the same thing in 2012 but nothing much happened.

See: Nikon Authorized Repair Stations . That shop in Morton Illinois is still listed.