Nikon d7000 shutter disabled

Discussion in 'Nikon' started by shantanu_b, Feb 2, 2014.

  1. Hi,

    I am using a nikon d7000. I noticed that after 5 shots, the shutter is disabled for sometime till i can start taking pictures again. The green
    led at the back is constantly on when the shutter is disabled.

    I am using RAW lossless but when i change to jpeg, it works fine without any problems.

    I think that the buffer is exhausted and photos are being written on the card. I am using sandisk 16 gb class 4 cards in both slots with card
    2 in backup mode.

    Should i buy the class 6 card if that is the problem?
     
  2. Try changing from lossless to compressed. The difference is almost impossible to notice. And yes, a faster card will drain the buffer more quickly. Class 10 cards are so cheap these days, there's no reason to buy slower ones - and when you pull the card and use it in a reader to transfer files to your computer, it will be that much faster.

    You should be able to get more like 10 shots in a burst, not just 5.
     
  3. No, due to the limitation of D7000's SD card interface (According to a test of SD card performance on D7000 ), you are not likely to get 8 or more continuous shot even with the best card.
    Class 6 cards are around 10-15MB/s, which means maybe you won't even have the 6th.
     
  4. Thanks for the response.
    I tried with compressed and got similar results :(
    Actually, I was not shooting in the burst mode, just shooting successive single shots. Will buying the class 10 card atleast reduce the time it takes for shutter to be enabled again?
     
  5. You need a memory card much faster than class 6 or 10.
    Here is a reputable speed test of various memory cards in a D7000
    http://www.robgalbraith.com/camera_wb_multi_page8e34.html?cid=6007-12454
    We normally don't really need a very fast card, except at the card reader at the computer (reading a few hundred files will want a fast card and a fast reader). But for continuous write duty such as you describe, then the camera needs about the fastest one.
    The fastest on in the above report is the 95 MB/second Sandisk. 95 is a read speed, at the computer (if in a USB 3.0 reader). It says write speed is 27 MB/second. Your compressed Raw files are about 13 MB, so that might write about two files per second. If you run off more pictures quickly, that will need more seconds.
     
  6. A class 10 card only means that it can manage 10 megabytes per second.
    A D7000 raw file can be around 18-19 megabytes so only 0.5 images per second could be written to the card.
    BTW, successive single shot is the same as using the burst mode.
    A class 4 card only need to be able to handle 4 megabytes per seconds. That's way to slow for a D7000 if you want to shoot a few frames quickly.
    I got a couple of the 45 MB/second Sandisk cards as the best value for money and speed.
     
  7. Actually, I was not shooting in the burst mode, just shooting successive single shots. Will buying the class 10 card atleast reduce the time it takes for shutter to be enabled again?​
    Yeah. Most class 10 cards can do around 20-30MB/s, which is 1.5 to 2 images per second.
    Sandisk Extreme 30MB/s or 45MB/s is good enough for D7000.
    The fastest on in the above report is the 95 MB/second Sandisk. 95 is a read speed, at the computer (if in a USB 3.0 reader). It says write speed is 27 MB/second.​
    The 95MB/s is read speed for sure, but write speed can be up to 90MB/s, too, athough no camera can make the most of it.
     
  8. ShunCheung

    ShunCheung Administrator

    I just checked my D7000. Even at 14-bit, lossless compressed RAW, its RAW buffer shows 10 frames. Therefore, even though your memoy card is extremely slow, you should be able to capture at least 10 frames before the D7000 slows down.
    Do you have Active D Lighting and high-ISO noise reduction on? I am a bit surprised that your D7000 slows down after merely 5 frames.
     
  9. Thanks - I will report back with my findings.
    Shun Cheung,
    High iso noise reduction is turned on. AD lighting is off.
     
  10. With a gentle half-press on the shutter, (in Shun's case) you get the r10 message meaning that, AFAIK, with the settings currently set, you can shove 10 frames into the buffer before anything bad happens. There is some interpretation that says that's not actually true as it assumes some have been/are being written to the card before the final frame is taken. That assumes a card speed of x and not an actual buffer capacity unless that 10 frames is a minimum. Now of course as soon as an image is taken it goes to the buffer, that's fine.
    If it says r10 and it can't get 10 frames into it's buffer something's wrong. It shouldn't depend on the card, 'cos that's the last step. Sure it will write them quicker with a faster card, but it SHOULD allow 10 frames to be taken...No?
    In this case Shantanu's getting an r5 result.....and that's wrong.
    I remember a similar low buffer problem on a 7*** series a while ago, maybe just before Christmas. Maybe Shun can locate it.
    As a last question, does the camera not know the card speed? I don't think the r** number is different from a 4 speed to a 10 speed card, but I'm not near my camera at the moment.
    EDIT.
    Do you have Active D Lighting and high-ISO noise reduction on?​
    This means that the Buffer isn't the first port of call for the image data. It gets processed first before even getting to the buffer and that takes time? Who thought up that workflow? It sounds like the buffer is the last step before writing to the card. That's not ideal.There must be a good reason to do it that way, but seems a bit 'unfortunate'!
     
  11. Shantanu.
    Auto distortion control reduces usable buffer too as does long exposure noise reduction - make sure they are off. I don't believe auto D-lighting makes any difference.
    The Sandisk Extreme is about the fastest for a D7000. The Extreme Pro is not justified since there is virtually no difference on a D7000. There were some measurements done by Rob Galbraith some time ago (see reference above).
    Mike,
    I've long since given up trying to understand how the buffer works; it seems that it just isn't a simple FIFO as I'd understand it!
     
  12. Shantanu, camera settings have a big effect on the buffer rxx message, you see when half pressing the shutter.
    Mike pointed out some settings. Check your camera manual if other exists. Experiment first with those two parameters Mike pointed out.
    The speed the camera writes the buffer contents to the memory card is another, but related matter.
     
  13. camera settings have a big effect on the buffer rxx message, you see when half pressing the shutter​
    Yup, the more you want the processor to do the lower the number drops.
    However, this leads to the obvious fact that the OP isn't even getting the number of frames that allows for those 'slow-downs'.
    As I read it, it should not be possible to ONLY get 5 frames before lock-up?? Maybe it's a RAM issue?
    Richard D, agreed! Not sure why the Buffer can't be a true number or at-least a minimum, with the caveat that a faster card will improve markedly on this minimum figure.
    Simply because it's emptying as fast as it's filling...that's not really Buffer Capacity, that's Burst Capacity.
    It's a bit like buying a car on the promise of 100mph only to find it does 50mph unless you feed it on pure nitromethane.
    You buy it at 50mph but know it will go faster on better fuel.
    If it says r10 on the tin, you should be able to put 10 frames it.
     
  14. From D700 manual. I believe that the same parameters (with similar treshold values) apply to D7000 as well:
    Maximum numbers drops if - Jpeg compression is set to optimal quality, ISO is set to Hi 0.3 or higher, High ISO NR is on when auto ISO is on or ISO sensitivity is set to 2000 or higher, or long exposure NR, active D-lightng or image autenthication is on. Quite a few variables.
    So we should read the rxx indication when half pressing the shutter like - about at least rxx many exposures can be taken before the shooting speed may slow down ;-)
     
  15. Get a class 10 card and shut all the unneeded stuff off ...........
     
  16. From D700 manual. I believe that the same parameters (with similar treshold values) apply to D7000 as well​
    No they don't apply to the D7000. See posts above. Probably it's because the D700 is an older design.
     
  17. Firstly, i thank everyone for their patient replies. I really appreciate the help.

    After all the information, i checked the settings. The problem setting were- auto distortion control and long exposure nr.

    I had r7 before i changed the settings and now i have r11.

    There was one more problem - class 4 card takes too long to empty the buffer - i tried class 6 and everything is working
    ok.

    Thanks a ton!
     
  18. Good News!
    So with those settings OFF to show r11, how many shots will the camera do on the old 4 card and then on the new 6 card before it locks-up? Maybe r11 will give you 9 old card and 11 new card?
    Just out of interest, with your old settings for r7 gave you 5 with the old card...so with the new card...maybe 7?
     
  19. Changing the cards did not change the rxx number it was 7 before i changed the settings and 11 after for both the cards.

    For the class 4, it took 10 shots and then shutter was disabled till images were written on the cards. For the new card, the
    r number reduced as i took shots but the shots were written on the card simultaneously... So i took about 5 images, but r
    was still 9.

    My initial post with 5 shots was probably not correct as i might have started counting while r was less than 7 due to the
    previous set of images.
     
  20. ShunCheung

    ShunCheung Administrator

    I am glad you found the problem. In these days, even class 10 cards are fairly inexpensive and some class 10 are on the slow side. It won't affect the memory buffer size inside the camera, but a faster card can empty it faster.
     
  21. I ran some tests on my D7000 with 2 different cards, both Sandisk, using two rated at 30 mb/sec and the others at 45 mb/sec. I tested the system using 12 bit RAW saved to card #1 plus JPG fine saved to card #2. While the buffer capacity may be indicated as 10 images, that's a static quantity, and as soon as shot #1 hits the buffer, the camera starts exporting it to the cards, making the process one that is in motion as you shoot. For the 30 mb/sec card, I could get to 15 shots before the shutter rate suddenly slowed to a crawl (I got this number on three consecutive tests), and it took close to 30 seconds for the buffer to them clear completely, using the green light as the indicator.
    After switching the cards and repeating the tests with the 45 mb/sec cards, I got the same results. That means the limitation is in the camera's transfer rate, and faster cards won't gain anything.
    Then I switched to JPG fine only (no RAW files at all). I could get to 25 shots before the shutter slowed, again getting the same result from both cards. And the time it took for the buffer to clear was the same 30 seconds - a full buffer is a full buffer, no matter the file format.
    I did this test before my first outing (a few weeks ago) to shoot eagles. I never found the 15 shot limit to be a problem, but it was nice to have that test result in my back pocket in case I encounter a situation where the 25 shot limit could allow me to get images I might otherwise miss.
     
  22. Interesting results Bob. According to..
    http://www.robgalbraith.com/camera_wb_multi_page8e34.html?cid=6007-12454​
    to quote..
    ....The figure in the Burst column represents how many NEF + JPEG pictures the camera was able to take in 30 seconds.​
    ....you should be able to take 39 with a high end card!
     
  23. Thanks Shun!

    Bob, the way i tried was not using burst but one shot after the other but not as fast as the burst. I really expected the
    buffer to be a little bigger - i have never had such a problem with my d80.
     
  24. Stumbled upon this

    http://imaging.nikon.com/lineup/dslr/d7000/features03.htm
     
  25. Buffer Capacities from Nikon site
    12 bit RAW (lossless comp)D7100.....7, where-as D7000.......11
    14 bit RAW (lossless comp)D7100.....6, where-as D7000.......10
    12 bit RAW (compressed) D7100.....9, where-as D7000.......15
    14 bit RAW (compressed) D7100.....8, where-as D7000.......12
    I think they might have kept the buffer the same size from the d7000 to the D7100!
    Be glad you've not got a D7100...:)
     
  26. I neglected to state clearly that my test used the maximum frame rate for the D7000, and counted only the shots up to the substantially drop in the frame rate due to the buffer being filled, i.e., the burst mode at the max frame rate only. The Rob Galbraith web site says its burst numbers are from a 30 second run. The 15 shots I got account for about 3 seconds, after which the the shots slowed to something like 1+ seconds each (seat of the pants estimate). That actually agrees (give or take a ballpark) with the Galbraith burst number for holding the shutter release down for 30 seconds. And the Galbraith data for the 30 second busts got 35, 37, and 38 shots using 30, 45, and 95 mb/s Sandisk cards, which to me are all the same number - the variability in the test data is undoubtedly as large or larger than the difference among these results for different cards. Which agrees with my assessment that cards faster than 30 mb/s won't help the D7000 using my settings.
    One important factor to realize here is that the number of frames that a buffer can store is controlled by the size of the images (megapixels and file type/size/compression), buffer size, and write speed, along with additional processing time imposed by various camera settings like noise reduction. The time it takes to write to the card is affected by the camera's write speed, the card's write speed, file size, write options, etc. What I got for my camera and card combination not only may not be accurate for any other camera, if it happens to match someone's result for a different model body with different cards, it's literally just a coincidence.
    If you want to know what how many shots your camera can get at its maximum frame rate, you need to run your own test that is designed around the way you want to shoot in the field.
     
  27. Mike, the buffer capacity data are really interesting - you have to be right about the buffer sizes. The difference in the number of images between the 7000 and 7100 corresponds to the difference in sensor sizes, so they must have the same buffer size. That would limit the 7100 to about 8 or 10 shots at its max frame rate; the only opportunity for improvement would be if the 7100's write speed is significantly higher than the 7000. I'm very surprised by this - I've seen lots of posts online complaining about the 7100's frame rate and buffer, but not being in the market for another camera, I never looked at specific data before.
     
  28. ShunCheung

    ShunCheung Administrator

    Buffer Capacities from Nikon site
    12 bit RAW (lossless comp)D7100.....7, where-as D7000.......11
    14 bit RAW (lossless comp)D7100.....6, where-as D7000.......10
    12 bit RAW (compressed) D7100.....9, where-as D7000.......15
    14 bit RAW (compressed) D7100.....8, where-as D7000.......12
    I think they might have kept the buffer the same size from the d7000 to the D7100!
    Be glad you've not got a D7100...:)
    However, the D7100 can write to a fast SD card a lot faster than the D7000 can.
    The next generation UHP-2 SD cards have a theoretical maximum of 312 Mb/sec. We may be able to write 24MP images at 6 to 9 fps directly onto those SD cards so that no buffer is necessary any more. :)
     
  29. Shun, does that mean the buffer IS the same size, but the D7100's write speed is better?
    I wonder what the D7200 is going to have inside?
    I do like the sound of them there new cards! Whatever happened to XQD?
     
  30. Mike,
    I think Shun's point is that the D7100 runs out of buffer before the D7000 but is able to write images faster after the buffer has filled, even though those image files are bigger.
     
  31. ShunCheung

    ShunCheung Administrator

    On the D7000 and D7100, I shoot 14-bit lossy compressed RAW. My rule of thumb is that the D7000 can write one RAW image file per second onto memory cards. When I used 95 Mb/sec cards, the D7100 can write three files per second, even though the D7100 files are larger.
    Expect the next generation of SD cards to be a lot faster and more expensive. XQD? If you buy a couple of those, it'll be more expensive than your DSLR. :)
     
  32. It's not a controlled test with validated results, just what I got in a self test of my D-7000 set to manual 800 iso, shutter set to 1/200, 14bit losslessy comp. SanDisk Extreme Pro I got 50 shots in 30seconds by my watch second hand, and backed it up with 48 in the second test, and 90 in one minute. gotta be hard on the works to do that many in a burst. I find that if I lift my finger off of the shutter button aprox 3 seconds when the burst stalls it recovers faster and gives more in the next short burst. Not a true 30sec. burst but more photos. It seems slow on consecutive long burst. Probably heat related, don't pretend to know answer. On a short burst I might git 9-14.
     

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