Nikon Coolscan 9000 glass holder

Discussion in 'Medium Format' started by steve_parrott, Jan 1, 2008.

  1. Some day in the not too distant future I hope to treat myself to the 9000 scanner, if I can find one, even
    B-H does not have them in stock. Anyway, I was hoping someone here could tell me some things about
    the glass holders. First of all, I assume it should definitely be used for best results?

    There are two holders, one of which is "rotating". Just what exactly rotates, what benefit is it, and is it
    worth the extra $100 over the "non-rotating" holder.

    Here are links to each holder from B-H:

    the non rotating holder:

    the rotating holder:

    Also, why does the description of the holders say "for brownie film" ???

    Thanks so much!
  2. While the best effect should be obtained with the rotating holder, I thing actually the best
    cost effective solution is to use your regular MF film holder,after removing the flaps and
    getting a custom cut sheet of anti newton glass for it. There's a company selling this on line,
    try to google for it - I use one of my Doug Fisher's glass inserts originally bought for the
    Epson V750. This way you keep the glass surfaces down to a minimum, you can still scan 3
    6x6 frames in on go and you save some 480 USD...
  3. Steve,<br><br>The regular, 'stretch' holder that comes with the scanner will do fine most of the time.<br>Occasionally, however, a strip of film curls so much you can not get focus across the strip, no matter how hard you try. Then the glass holder is worth every penny it costs.<br>The downside: dust. But with due care, not more of a poblem than when using a glassless holder.<br><br>The rotating holder is a waste of money.<br>You never need to rotate the strip, as it is easy (and good!) enough to straighten the scanned image in software later.<br>And while the glass holder allows scanning a full strip of film, the rotating holder only allows scanning one frame at a time.<br>So i think you should get the glass holder FH869-G, but better not consider the rotating thingy.<br><br>Nikon refers to rollfilm as "brownie" film because they are a Japanese company, and that's what that film was called there (still is?) for a long time. It's after Kodak's Brownie cameras, that used and popularized this film, which in turn were named after the camera designer and manufacturer, who made these cameras for Eastman: Frank Brownell.
  4. Steve,

    The non-glass holder does not hold your film flat, ever. You need some glass holder, either after market or Nikon's. Advantage of the rotating one is it comes with masks and preset scan windows for 2-1/4 formats, xpan, etc. I don't think plain glass holder has this convenience. Also, I haven't tried it, but wet mounting would provide the absolute best scans, and I know that offers this for the 8000/9000 scanners. You might want to go that route from the get go. But the "stretchy" holder is not adequate.
  5. The whole film holding part rotates in the rotating holder. Its useful for landscape or architecture photos where you need to get the horizon (or some other straight line) parallel with the scanner. Its worth it maybe if absolute sharpness is necessary and you often don't have your camera aligned with the scene during exposure. Making big rotations in photoshop is not good for sharpness if you are pushing the limit of your scan (ie large prints), not only because you will have to crop out some of the scene in a rotated scan but due to the rotation's effect on the sharpness of the file.

    So, if youre photos are straight, just get a regular glass one.

    And yes, if you want good (i would say acceptable) results, you need to get a glass holder. It is difficult enough to get 645 flat with the stock holder (and its not even really flat if you compare with a scan from a glass holder).
  6. With a different scanner I found introducing glass into the scan unacceptable, but with the Nikons there apparently is not that much difference, as attested to by many users, and by Nikon themselves offering glass holders. Maybe try scanning some glass mounted slides first, before taking the plunge on the glass holders, or go the less expensive (and equally effective) DYI route suggested above for glass holders.

    Anyways, things glass *might* do:

    1. Reduce brightness, contrast.

    2. Increase the odds of dust, fingerprints, etc.

    3. Introduce Newton rings.

    4. With the use of Anti-Newton glass: introduce dappling, and possibly not completely quell Newton rings.
  7. I think your question has been answered pretty well. I don't have much to add since I use the
    stretchy holder but am considering a glass carrier.

    As far as finding a scanner, B&H has a feature where they will notify you when they are in
    stock. But act fast. They notified me and I waited a few days, and they were sold out again.
    These things seem to be selling well. At any rate, I ordered it straight away the second time
    they notified me, and I love the scanner.
  8. I have the 9000 with the glass holder. If you think the 9000 is hard to find, try getting a glass holder. I'd advise trying the regular holder but in the end, using MF cameras, most of which are pretty expensive, and the scanner which is not cheap either, it seems silly to compromise sharpness if not necessary. I agree the rotating holder, which I have not tried, is probably not necessary. The beauty of the regular holder is the ability to just blow all the dust off each side of the film before inserting the holder. With the glass holder, one must clean the glass, and clean the glass and... you get it. I have begun using lint free gloves so I do not accidentally touch the glass while getting the film aligned ... just right, Misalignment is really easy to do, and then you need to open it again and start all over. In the end though, the scans are sharp edge to edge with the glass holder.

    Good luck.

  9. I have the rotating glass holder. I wanted to buy the less expensive glass holder...but it was always out of stock. However, the rotating glass holder has masks so that one can use 35mm as well as medium format. I'm not sure if the regular glass holder will accept 35mm?? Anyway...I mainly use if for 120, and yes, it is a little time consuming because you can only scan one frame at a time. But then, I usually don't take much MF anymore, so a little extra time doesn't kill me.

    I would try the DIY stuff first. If it works well, it is a big money saver.
  10. The most cost effective way Ive found so far with this scanner is rather inexpensive. After trying a number of approaches, including sandwiching the film between two sheets of glass, a slight modification to the original holder worked very well.

    First get a single sheet of pre cut anti-newton glass from (at the price get a spare while youre at it). Then remove the thin rubber strips on both rails that support the film edges. Place the glass where the film goes, then screw down the moving side of the rail so it doesnt move anymore. To use, place the film in the carrier as usual - emulsion down - then place the AN glass on top which the etched surface against the film. Next, just clamp everything down as usual - no modifications to the film clamps.

    With just one piece of glass, I find the resulting edge to edge sharpness is very good. As a further note; when you use glass carriers, the lower glass is not AN glass and at times this will still give you newton rings. With just the one sheet you have two less surfaces to clean and no newton rings.
  11. Another vote for the FH-869G non-rotating glass holder. It is very easy to use. A real joy in
    comparison to the original film holder. Sometimes it is difficult to get but it is worth while
    waiting for. It comes with a number of black masks and strips. I still have them securely
    wrapped in the original sealed sleeve. I never understood how to use them and I do not need
    them anyway as the slides scan fine.
  12. The rotating glass holder is designed for handling single frames, which are otherwise very hard to align. In particular, it is used for long, panoramic frames like from an X-Pan camera (24x63mm), which if tilted, lose a lot of height in rotation and cropping.

    For most purposes ("Brownie Film" per Nikon), the standard holder is the best choice. You can scan strips of up to four 6.45cm frames, three 6x6cm, two 6x7cm or one (nearly) 6x9cm.

    It's a good idea to use gloves with the glass holder, to keep the glass and film clean. The inside must be kept (ideally) dust-free. Dust on the outer surfaces is out of focus, but may cause shadows.

    Slides are actually the worst things to scan. The film is inevitably bulged within a paper mount and can't be held flat. Furthermore, the mount crops a significant portion of the image area.
  13. Thanks everyone for the help. The Scan Science method really looks good. I have always
    wondered why Nikon did not make some type of fluid mount for the high end film
    scanners. This looks like the best way to go... and cheaper than the Nikon glass holders
  14. "I have always wondered why Nikon did not make some type of fluid mount for the high end film scanners."

    For one thing, it is expensive, time-consuming and messy. For another, Kami fluid is highly flammable, and there are many potential sources of ignition inside the Nikon scanner should a leak occur. While fluid mounting will hide scratches and improve contrast, it does nothing to eliminate dust (and potentially adds bubbles).

    Drum scanners have an external fixture for mounting film, away from the scanner itself and presumably in a ventilated area. The scanning chamber itself is enclosed and sources of ignition are isolated or sealed.
  15. Steve,
    If you do go the Scanscience route, please do post your experiences here, and if possible, a comparison of wet-mounted scans vs standard holder.
  16. I've been reading the many posts. I too am experimenting with scanning medium formats trannies on the 9000. I've been using GEPE glass mounted slide film holders. They definitely hold the film flat and fit into the medium (brownie) holder that should have been included with the 9000. The results are sharp corner to corner. I'm not sure of how much image degradation I am getting as I have other holders. I do have a question. 1 ) Does anyone know what type of glass is in the GEPE glass holders
    2 ) Should the frosted side be on the top or the bottom when I slide the carrier into the 9000 ? My tests show the top , but ??? Thanks for tips - I'm still looking for the fastest and easiest way - aren't we all !!
  17. Brian,<br><br>They fit in the 'regular', glassless Nikon holder?<br>What glass there is in the GePe mounts depends on what type of GePe mount you have, but since you mention a frosted glass, you will have those with one clear and one anti-Newton glass. The frosted Anti-Newton glass must be on top when the thing goes into the Nikon. Else it is between the slide and the sensor.
  18. Thanks for the info. The only problem I have with using the GEPE is that the 645 mount crops out quite a bit of the 645 frame. Square ones 6X6 are no better. I do have some 6X7 GEPES and they frame everything but are a super pain to align. Has anyone out there tried the wet scanning as described in this blog ?? It looks promising , but after many years of being a photographer , I usually find feedback from real users is the most informed route.

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