Nikon clarifies full frame policy

http://www.amateurphotographer.co.uk/news/Nikon_clarifies_full_frame_policy_news_115110.html

 

UK magazine "Amateur Photographer" has a short write-up about Nikon's policies

regarding the future of a 'full frame' dSLR camera. Click on the link to read

more.

It would have been swell if Jeremy Gilbert "clarifie(d)" whether Nikon would ever produce another professional-quality DX lens to supplement the only two such lenses Nikon has in production.

",,,Nikon has never ruled out the development of a full-frame digital SLR, but has no immediate launch plans..."

 

Tanslation: "We'd love to compete with Canon, but we just don't have the resources to do it".

"if the firm decided to make such a camera it would first need to meet the appropriate quality-to-price ratio. In other words, it would have to be the right quality at a price able to compete in the market."

 

Yet the 1DsII and M8 are steady sellers. Sounds like Nikon is trying to convince themselves, not us.

What does the M8 have to do with this? It's not full frame. And nobody has seen real sales figures on it yet.

Well, to me AP write-up do not qualify as a clarification on Nikon FF policy. It is not clear

where Jeremy Gilbert, essentially a spin doctor, is employed. Is he a head of the marketing at

Nikon UK, subsidiary distribution channel; or he is the marketing guru at Nikon headquarters

in Japan. Usually important statements are made by the company CEO or made public in

white papers, etc.

The M8 has to do with "the right quality at a price able to compete in the market." Those things can be irrelevant, if the product is something that people WANT to buy. This statement is an excuse, not a strategy.

",,,Nikon has never ruled out the development of a full-frame digital SLR, but has no immediate launch plans..."

 

Translation: Sony is still working on a full frame sensor for us, but their R&D hasn't got anything that works just yet. Maybe next year...

what would a ff d3x cost? 8 to 10 grand? who is gonna pay that kind of cash? only a handful of professionals who need high speed & huge files - fashion/studio advertising photographers. that means at least 22mp. <p>

today, right now, fashion photographers have the choice between an existing canon ff cam (most likely soon to be upgraded to 22mp), hassy's h2, h3d, contax645, rollei 6008 af, mamiya 645 afd, rz67 proIId and soon the announced pentax 645d, rollei/leaf/sinar hy6 and mamiya zd with like 6 different mf backs.

all of the above, except the announced pentax/hy6 cams are working systems with huge lens choices and rentable all over the world.

why would nikon want to enter that race at this stage in time? <p>

no-one is going to thank them for investing millions into a ff system - but everyone will rip them to shreds if it's more expensive than canon, has bugs, sensor problems, outdated lenses not up to the task of a ff sensor and a software that is too slow and cumbersome to develop 1000 raw files and make jpegs in 2 hours time to send to the ad agency. <p>

i'd bet my house there aren't 2 people on this board that would shell out 9 grand for a ff nikon.

",,,Nikon has never ruled out the development of a full-frame digital SLR, but has no immediate launch plans..."

 

Translation, now that Sony is developing their own line of dSLRs, we're even less confident we'll see a sensor to compete with Canon's full-frames anytime soon. But gosh, we'd really like to have one.

"However, Gilbert stressed that just because a camera is 'full frame' it does not necessarily mean that the quality of images it produces surpasses those of current Nikon DX models."

 

Translation: The full frame Kodak sensors we used on our prototype models were really crappy.

From whom would Nikon buy a full frame sensor that competes with Canon full frame cameras?

 

Nikon does not make sensors, as do Canon and Sony. Nikon has been fully dependent on others to provide sensors, most recently Sony has provided all Nikon's DSLR sensors. Now that Sony has bought its way into the DSLR market by taking over the Minolta mount and that Sony has said they want to be one of the top two DSLR companies, Nikon is not likely to get any full frame sensor from Sony should they produce one. Nikon may even be trying to find a new source of APS-sized sensors in case Sony decides to keep all new sensors to itself.

Sony will probably sell it's full frame sensors to anyone and anybody. Sony sells their low end sensors to both Canon and Nikon and yet is number two in the compact camera market.

 

Even if Sony refuses to sell Nikon the bigger sensor. Nikon has made sensors in the past, The LBCAST.

Kodak makes a FF sensor, don't they? I'd bet they'd sell them to Nikon.

"Sony will probably sell it's full frame sensors to anyone and anybody. Sony sells their low end sensors to both Canon and Nikon and yet is number two in the compact camera market."

 

That was BEFORE Sony got into the DSLR business. They certainly don't sell their sensors to their competitors in consumer and pro camcorders, or cellphones, or security cams.

 

"Kodak makes a FF sensor, don't they? I'd bet they'd sell them to Nikon."

 

I bet they would. At a competitive price? With competitive quality? In sufficient numbers? Hard to say.

But Kodak got out of the dSLR bidness, didn't they? They do sell sensors to Leica (M8) and Hasselblad, etc. They appear to be in that bidness.

If you just can't wait, find a Kodak SLR/n. At around $2000 on the used market, for a low-use

body, they're a steal.

You'd be better off with a used or refurbuished EOS 5D. Much better camera.

Also Philips made full frame sensors for the Contax N.

 

"That was BEFORE Sony got into the DSLR business. They certainly don't sell their sensors to their competitors in consumer and pro camcorders, or cellphones, or security cams."

 

A lot of off brand security cams use Sony sensors.

I still like the 1.5x magnification with the current nikon sensor. especially with the larger zooms and telephotos. how much would my 600mm f4 cost if it was a 900mm f4?

sony and canon are both essentially run by business people. If they have the means and resources to provide parts like sensors to other companys, then they will certainly do so. They probably gain quite a large profit margin from such sales. Are the sony made sensors badged as 'sony' when they are put into a Nikon DSLR? No. These business guys understand that the sensor is only a small part of the equation. People buy brands for various reasons, prestige, reliability, accessories available etc.. Why wouldnt sony keep selling sensors to nikon, even if they are full frame? Personally i use a nikon, not to say that i am brand-loyal, but i am very familiar with their lens cahracteristics and body handling, and quite frankly i dont like the feel of the canons. The image quality comparison between say a 5d and a d200 is marginal at BEST.

God how about the amount of advertising on that webpage! Like being slapped in the face with a wet camera.!

"A lot of off brand security cams use Sony sensors."

 

I don't think so, Sam. If you can, please name three models.

Sony makes a huge number of sensors used in security cams, Jacob. In fact, there is a Sony sensor shortage at the moment, and security cam makers are scrambling to source from other vendors.

 

http://www.security.globalsources.com/gsol/I/CCTV-color/a/9000000084788.htm

 

"Makers are confident that they are past the challenge of CCD sensors shortage. To ensure the stable supply of this key building block, makers are looking for alternative sources to Sony, which is the key supplier of CCD sensors."

Sony will sell their CCD sensors to anyone who wants to buy them:

 

http://products.sel.sony.com/semi/ccd.html

 

When Sony had a problem with a flaky sensor recently, these competing camera models were recalled - all with the Sony CCD imaging chip in them:

 

http://www.imaging-resource.com/NEWS/1128958202.html

 

Fact is, Sony makes imaging chips for everything that uses them, more or less, and sells to all comers. They may have been eclipsed in production since 2004, but at that time, they were the world's largest producer of CCD sensors (there may be more recent data, I just didn't find it with a cursory Google). There has also been speculation that Sony will keep the 'best' of its chips for its own Sony brand cameras, but so far, Sony claims that isn't the case, and no one has been able to point to a Sony camera model that has an imaging sensor that is not also available for sale on the open market by other digicam makers, to the best of my knowledge.