Nikon Announce Z6 II and Z7 II

Discussion in 'Nikon' started by ShunCheung, Oct 14, 2020.

  1. Ordering from the US is not always possible "we don't ship to your country" but when they do, you have to pay import taxes here.
     
  2. Indeed. Even a tree or flower moving slightly in the breeze can cause very strange artefacts. Or a change in lighting that spreads shadows.

    So as far as 3D subjects, you're basically stuck with buildings in constant light or still-life studio subjects of some sort.

    What it is useful for though is film copying, where you can get an 18,000 pixel wide digital copy of a medium-format negative or transparency. With a 'true optical resolution' as good as the lens fitted allows.

    Epson scanner owners, eat your hearts out!
     
  3. Right, but even with those it would have still been a bit cheaper. But you're right, Nikon USA seems to have placed restrictions on cameras and B&H won't ship a Z7 II to my country. I have to wonder what happened to market economy and global trade. Nikon seem to be artificially maintaining price differences between regions. I understand there is longer than 1 year warranty in Europe (due to EU regulations as well as national legislation which can be even more stringent) and of course they have to translate manuals and camera firmware to the numerous languages in Europe and then there can be higher costs of employment as well. These could contribute to the higher prices. But on return, I've had very good service from Nikon during all these years. Still, I'd love to buy gear at US prices.
     
    Last edited: Oct 14, 2020
  4. ShunCheung

    ShunCheung Administrator

    I think the main improvements are:
    1. Dual memory card slots: while it is not necessarily an important feature for everybody, for some, such as certain wedding photographers, this is a must. I think it was a surprising miss in the first-generation Z6 and Z7, although after 4 years with XQD cards, I have a lot of confidence with them myself and don't necessarily use dual cards any more.
    2. Dual Expeed 6 processors: which means better AF, somewhat a weakness in the first gen Z6 and Z7. How much that is improved needs to be tested. I should point out that AF on my Z6 has improved with the various firmware upgrades this year.
    3. A real vertical grip, and no doubt third-party clones will soon appear.
    Otherwise, the sensors are essentially the same as the first generation. I think it is getting harder and harder to improve sensors now.

    The 400mm/f2.8 and 600mm/f4 are critical lenses for sports. The 400mm/f2.8 is important for night and indoor sports. I don't think those 400mm and 600mm lenses will be PF. A 600mm/f5.6 PF sounds good on paper, but it will be much bigger than the 500mm/f5.6 PF and harder to hand hold. That is why like Sony's 200-600 is f6.3 on the long end.

    To me, whether Nikon (and Canon) will move to mirrorless for their flagship sports cam is important. If the newly introduced D6 will be replaced in 2 years or so, there is really no point to invest in the D6 and F-mount super tele any more. Therefore, the fact that Nikon is telegraphing Z-mount super-teles by 2022 is significant.

    I am somewhat disappointed that the 2nd memory card slot is SD (UHS-II) only. If one shoots at a high frame rate, even an expensive UHS-II SD card (about $100 for 64G) will still be the bottleneck. I really wish to have a dual SD/CFx Type A option like the Sony A7S III since CFx Type A is much faster, although expensive. However, for still subjects, SD cards are inexpensive.
     
    Last edited: Oct 14, 2020
  5. Where have you been? Nikon has long protected dealers in specific national markets. Apart from vendors refusing shipping to foreign customers, Nikon usually refuses warranty service coverage to cameras not purchased in a given national market from authorized retailers. That tactic amounts to a sizeable disincentive to purchase Nikon products abroad or from gray market sellers. "Market economy" and "global trade" are the usual cheapskate refusals to cope with realities. Access to cut-rate pricing isn't covered by human rights legislation.
     
  6. 2 years legal warranty in Europe, mandatory.

    I also tried B&H and the answer was "no, not to your country" (Belgium).
     
  7. Yes, but in some countries it is 3 years, or it could even be longer depending on the flaw and what is considered reasonable product life. But in the EU, 2 years is the minimum. Of course, I would assume that Nikon design their products not to fail in quite many years after purchase, so I am questioning whetther the extra warranty period really causes them additional costs or if they should cover these years as a matter of course (and pride). But if the product is misused or heavily used then it might not the manufacturer's fault if it should fail, and in that case there is indeed an extra cost that the manufacturer has to cover.
     
  8. This is illegal in European Union and the manufacturer's importer cannot refuse service just because the product has been purchased in a different market, as long as the same product is sold in the market where the importer operates. This has been tested in court and Nikon lost the case.

    I've long purchased Nikon products from abroad, in some cases the savings have been considerable. For example I remember paying $1000 for a 135/2 DC Nikkor which sold at about 1600€ in my country. There was no limitation of export back then. However, as people learned how to buy from the internet, the price differences (apart from the effect of the VAT) largely disappeared for some years. Now it seems that Nikon have taken hardline tactics and give export bans to products from cheaper markets to markets where the prices are higher. This is now possible because there is basically no travel between the continents, or there is very little of it, so people can't just go to NYC to pick up the item and then pay the VAT and customs fees upon arrival to the EU. So Nikon are able to enforce the price differential. Still, I don't see how this is fair. Why do Europeans have to pay more for a given product? I do not buy the excuse of the extended warranty period as an additional cost to Nikon as in my opinion, a Nikon product should function 5-10 years easily without fail. Most of them do.

    In my opinion people should have equal rights independently of where they live, but then I don't make the rules. They should be given equal pay for equal work, and so on. And it makes sense that anyone should have the right to buy from a vendor of their choosing unless there is some kind of breach of law.
     
    paul_b.|1 likes this.
  9. That really depends on what kind of camera you prefer to use. I like optical viewfinders and find the EVFs quite disappointing and diminish the shooting experience for me. I experience nausea when panning with an EVF, and the noise, flickering, and brightness variations that some EVFs show e.g. when used in artificial lights is highly distracting to me (though the Nikon Z cameras have a more stable EVF image than competitors' cameras and it has few artifacts but the lag is still there). However, over time these drawbacks may be alleviated by technological progress. The silent shooting capability is a large benefit of cameras like the Sony A9 II. But most of the mirrorless cameras are used with at least one mechanical curtain as the fully electronic shutter is too slow to work without distortion or artifacts in all cases. So in practice these Nikon cameras are quieter than the dSLRs, but not silent (unless one is willing to accept the disadvantages of the silent shutter).

    I will likely buy one of these cameras introduced today and a few Z lenses for situations which call for a quieter photography experience. This could be a funeral or concert or similar situation, or just when photographing people in close range. There is also an optical quality advantage to native Z lenses but honestly I don't think it's that important for me. However, for the rest of my photography I will continue to use DSLRs. To me this is a big part of what I enjoy in photography, being able to time moments on how the light comes from the subject without delay and without artifacts.

    But if they had included the SD/CFx Type A solution, then we would have to buy new memory cards (and readers) and would not be able to use our existing XQD or CFexpress type B cards in those cameras.
     
  10. ShunCheung

    ShunCheung Administrator

    A few years ago, I used to dislike those EVF on Sony and Fuji mirrorless cameras. When Nikon introduced the Z6 and Z7 two years ago, I went to one of their local shows and tried the Z7. I immediately realized that its EVF had improved so much that it was acceptable. Now I have had the Z6 for almost two years, I am very used to its EVF by now, although the slight delay can still be issues for action photography.

    Are you familiar with the memory card slots on the Sony 7S iii? It has two card slots. Since the CFx Type A card is slightly smaller than the regular SD card (i.e. not micro SD), either an SD or a CFx A card can fit into either slot. Each slot has electronic contacts for both types of cards. In other words, you can use two SD, two CFx A, or one each on the Sony A7S iii. I wish Nikon had that same arrangement in their second slot. For those who prefer a cheaper, slower card, they can use SD. For someone who needs speed, I can use a CFx A.

    As the way it is now on the Z6 II and Z7 II, when I want speed, I'll have to leave the SD slot empty or as overflow because even the most expensive, fastest UHS-II SD cards will still slow things down.
     
  11. Any idea when it's estimated to be available? It's on the Z roadmap.
     
  12. A reminder: warranty has to be provided by the one you buy something from. Not by the manufacturer. You have no contract with Nikon when you buy a Nikon product from a shop, unless that shop is Nikon's.
     
  13. ShunCheung

    ShunCheung Administrator

    The Z-mount 200-600 has been on the roadmap since Nikon introduced the Z50 last year, and at the time the roadmap covers to the end of 2021. In other words, the 200-600 should be announced some time in the next 14 months or so.

    I am surprised that no new lens is announced this time along with the Z6 II and Z7 II.
     
    Mary Doo likes this.
  14. It doesn't say what F-stop. When that is available, adding a 1.4x and possibly 2x, there will be no need for any other camera - at least as far as I am concerned. :)
     
  15. My understanding is that the company which is the manufacturer's official importer is the one which is responsible for the product's warranty. In most regions these companies are owned by Nikon Japan. It is possible that the store provides additional warranty but it's not typical. For warranty service we typically take the product to the company which Nikon have authorized to provide the service. That company then bills Nikon for the warranty work.

     
  16. In the UK it's Nikon who do repairs under warranty after the 14 days have passed. They take in and fix import cameras as if they were domestic.
     
  17. ShunCheung

    ShunCheung Administrator

    I would expect a 200-600 to be f6.3 on the 600mm end, like the Sony version. A 600mm f5.6 is quite huge.
     
  18. Sorry but reduced air travel has nothing to do with this. Nikon Canada/USA have for years refused warranty service--any service--to product purchased outside their dealers' respective countries. Have seen irate bargain hunters refused warranty coverage countless times at Nikon.ca's service counter. Their website clearly states the policy. Serial numbers don't lie when it comes to where Nikon gear is purchased.

    You can, of course, buy from whomever and wherever you prefer--just don't expect uniform pricing nor is Nikon obliged to deliver it.
     
  19. In the EU at least, the person or company you deal with, who collects your money in exchange for goods, is the only one who is obliged to provide warranty.
    Who is next up in line, and where the line ends, is if no concern to the end user.
    Yes, shops will have to deal with whoever they got their goods from, who in turn, etc. So even if a company such as Nikon would refuse to pay for warranty service, that would be of no concern to the buyer.
    Indeed, it is typical for an importer/distributor to offer warranty to the shops they supply. They too are obliged by law to do so. So in the end it may well be Nikon who pays for it all.
    But again, if Nikon would say they will not, it is of no concern to the buyer. He has to turn to the shop he bought from. Not to Nikon.

    Extended warranty offered by shops are a waste of money, unless they include an insurance that covers mishaps warranties will not cover. They (shops) are obliged by law to make good for any fault that occurs before such a thing could have been expected given normal use. And that usually is much longer than the 'official' period of 1 year, or an 'extended' period of 3 years.
    They get away with selling what you are already entitled to because of the consumer's general ignorance of what the law has to say about this.
     
    Last edited: Oct 14, 2020
  20. Do you think the adapter will cause a lot of degradation of images? My son looked it up and the f mount lens dates from the 1950's
     

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