frans_waterlander Posted October 2, 2018 Share Posted October 2, 2018 This is a major bug in my opinion, but Adobe Tech Support says the program was designed to work this way. It may be in other versions of Elements as well; I don't know. Here's the issue: you open a RAW image and start adjusting it; you unintentionally (or intentionally) click the DONE button. Oops; your original RAW file gets overwritten with the modified version and your original is gone forever. Nice! Shouldn't one of the top priorities be to safeguard the original RAW file? Shouldn't you, as a bare minimum, first get a warning like "are you sure you want to do this", although that's not enough safeguarding in my book. When I asked to report this as a bug, I got redirected to a feature/bug form that misdirected me to the Adobe Conversations (forum). What say you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
digitaldog Posted October 2, 2018 Share Posted October 2, 2018 Proprietary raws are read only. Sidecar files contain edits. Author “Color Management for Photographers" & "Photoshop CC Color Management" (pluralsight.com) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
digitaldog Posted October 3, 2018 Share Posted October 3, 2018 I’m saying the raws are read only and not altered! Your basic premise is false. Edits are stored elsewhere. Author “Color Management for Photographers" & "Photoshop CC Color Management" (pluralsight.com) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frans_waterlander Posted October 3, 2018 Author Share Posted October 3, 2018 I'm not using sidecars but the Camera RAW database approach. Are you saying that if I used sidecars I could recover the original file? Could I recover the original file using the database? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frans_waterlander Posted October 3, 2018 Author Share Posted October 3, 2018 I’m saying the raws are read only and not altered! Your basic premise is false. Edits are stored elsewhere. Care to tell me how I can recover the original file when using sidecars and when using the database? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
digitaldog Posted October 3, 2018 Share Posted October 3, 2018 There is nothing to recover. Author “Color Management for Photographers" & "Photoshop CC Color Management" (pluralsight.com) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frans_waterlander Posted October 3, 2018 Author Share Posted October 3, 2018 There is nothing to recover. Well, if that is the case, then tell me where to find my original files, because, on three different tries (with NEF and DNG RAW files) the files that I started with are definitely not the files I ended up with. Care to elaborate? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
digitaldog Posted October 3, 2018 Share Posted October 3, 2018 The NEF's are not the same how? Author “Color Management for Photographers" & "Photoshop CC Color Management" (pluralsight.com) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bgelfand Posted October 3, 2018 Share Posted October 3, 2018 I do not have Photoshop Elements, but I assume Elements works about the same way either Photoshop does, or using a catalog Lightroom does. Editing RAW files in Adobe Camera RAW (ACR) is nondestructive i.e. no pixels are changed; the editing instructions are recorded and reapplied each time you open the file in ACR. By the way ACR is used to process RAW file in Photoshop and a close equivalent is used in Lightroom. 1) Using sidecars, all the RAW processing instructions (and other data) are written to a sidecar file in the same directory as the RAW file. The sidecar has the same name as the image and a file type of XMP. Simply rename the sidecar file to filename.XMP1; Photoshop will no longer recognize the file as a sidecar and will display your original file, unmodified. 2) If you use the catalog, in Adobe Camera RAW, there should be a "Reset" button. Push that and the editing instructions are deleted. But there is no way to get back other than redo the edit. In Photoshop CS5 (ACR 6.7) there is no Reset Key; you Alt-Click the Cancel Key to reset the dialog 3) If you use ACR there should be a History panel. Simply step back to the history item that says "import" or something like it. One (or more) of the above should work. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frans_waterlander Posted October 3, 2018 Author Share Posted October 3, 2018 1) Using sidecars, all the RAW processing instructions (and other data) are written to a sidecar file in the same directory as the RAW file. The sidecar has the same name as the image and a file type of XMP. Simply rename the sidecar file to filename.XMP1; Photoshop will no longer recognize the file as a sidecar and will display your original file, unmodified. 2) If you use the catalog, in Adobe Camera RAW, there should be a "Reset" button. Push that and the editing instructions are deleted. But there is no way to get back other than redo the edit. In Photoshop CS5 (ACR 6.7) there is no Reset Key; you Alt-Click the Cancel Key to reset the dialog 3) If you use ACR there should be a History panel. Simply step back to the history item that says "import" or something like it. 1. I haven't used sidecars. 2. I use the database (which is not the catalog); there is no reset button in my version of ACR, 10.2. The issue is not undoing edits in ACR; you can easily do that (e.g. with the before/after button). The issue is that as soon as you click on the Done button, the original file seems to be overwritten and now has the changes made in ACR and ACR is automatically closed. 3. As soon as you click on the Done button, ACR closes and the file is gone. There is nothing to see in the History panel after that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
digitaldog Posted October 3, 2018 Share Posted October 3, 2018 ACR has no database. ACR has cache files. Your edits are stored in sidecar files for proprietary raws. Author “Color Management for Photographers" & "Photoshop CC Color Management" (pluralsight.com) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frans_waterlander Posted October 3, 2018 Author Share Posted October 3, 2018 The NEF's are not the same how? Here is the before and after file; not quite the same. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frans_waterlander Posted October 3, 2018 Author Share Posted October 3, 2018 Your edits are stored in sidecar files for proprietary raws. Again, I didn't use sidecars, but the database. Any other ideas as to how to recover the original? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
digitaldog Posted October 3, 2018 Share Posted October 3, 2018 The previews are not the same. That isn’t what I asked. Try again. Author “Color Management for Photographers" & "Photoshop CC Color Management" (pluralsight.com) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
digitaldog Posted October 3, 2018 Share Posted October 3, 2018 As seen in the past, the correct answers are not the ones you want to hear. Author “Color Management for Photographers" & "Photoshop CC Color Management" (pluralsight.com) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frans_waterlander Posted October 3, 2018 Author Share Posted October 3, 2018 The previews are not the same. That isn’t what I asked. Try again. These are not previews; these are jpg versions of DNG RAW files. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frans_waterlander Posted October 3, 2018 Author Share Posted October 3, 2018 As seen in the past, the correct answers are not the ones you want to hear. Simply tell me how to recover the original. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
digitaldog Posted October 3, 2018 Share Posted October 3, 2018 These are not previews; these are jpg versions of DNG RAW files. You ever answered the question about the NEF! JPEG is rendered from the raw you refuse to examine. It is READ ONLY. Author “Color Management for Photographers" & "Photoshop CC Color Management" (pluralsight.com) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
digitaldog Posted October 3, 2018 Share Posted October 3, 2018 1. I haven't used sidecars. Major bug in Elements 2018 Look for sidecar 'xmp' files. That's where the recipe is stored. Delete it. Never heard of a program that alters RAW files. Most every photographer trying to use it would raise hell if that happened and there would be tracks all over the net. Author “Color Management for Photographers" & "Photoshop CC Color Management" (pluralsight.com) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frans_waterlander Posted October 3, 2018 Author Share Posted October 3, 2018 You ever answered the question about the NEF! JPEG is rendered from the raw you refuse to examine. It is READ ONLY. I examined both the before and after NEF and DNG RAW files in ACR. So, tell me what I'm doing wrong in your opinion and we can go from there Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frans_waterlander Posted October 3, 2018 Author Share Posted October 3, 2018 Look for sidecar 'xmp' files. That's where the recipe is stored To the best of my knowledge I don't use sidecar 'xmp' files; I set my Save image settings in: Camera RAW database. So, where would I find those files? I can't find them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
digitaldog Posted October 3, 2018 Share Posted October 3, 2018 I examined both the before and after NEF and DNG RAW files in ACR. So, tell me what I'm doing wrong in your opinion and we can go from there You examined what? There is no before and after NEF. There is one file that is READ ONLY! Author “Color Management for Photographers" & "Photoshop CC Color Management" (pluralsight.com) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frans_waterlander Posted October 3, 2018 Author Share Posted October 3, 2018 You examined what? There is no before and after NEF. There is one file that is READ ONLY! OK. So, as I have asked you already many times, how do I go about restoring the original image/get rid of the editing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bgelfand Posted October 3, 2018 Share Posted October 3, 2018 ACR has no database. ACR has cache files. Your edits are stored in sidecar files for proprietary raws. Respectfully, not so. ACR (at least in Photoshop CS5) gives the user a choice, in Preferences, of storing the image settings either in XMP files or in a "database" as the following screen shots show. Now the database may be saved in cache files, but the program definitely says "database". 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bgelfand Posted October 3, 2018 Share Posted October 3, 2018 1. I haven't used sidecars. 2. I use the database (which is not the catalog); there is no reset button in my version of ACR, 10.2. The issue is not undoing edits in ACR; you can easily do that (e.g. with the before/after button). The issue is that as soon as you click on the Done button, the original file seems to be overwritten and now has the changes made in ACR and ACR is automatically closed. 3. As soon as you click on the Done button, ACR closes and the file is gone. There is nothing to see in the History panel after that. Do not click on DONE. Hold down the Alt key on your keyboard and click CANCEL That should do it. How do I know? In CS5 when I hover the mouse pointer above CANCEL, it opens a hint box and tells me. Try it. In my original reply I should have written DATABASE, not CATALOG. I guess I'm just use to Lightroom for RAW processing. No, the original image file is NOT overwritten, the changes you made in ACR are written to the database (unless you are using DNG files, but that is a different story). 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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