Leica announces end of R line

<p>I was looking on line late last night to see what i would need to put my Leica SL2 onto a televid spotting scope and saw that Leica, on 3/25, announced it is discontinuing the R line of cameras and lenses. It will keep the information up on its web site about the cameras because of the vigorous second hand market, but it is official now.</p>

<p>I'm of two minds -- sorry to see the end of a grand marquee, but on the other hand not horrible suprrised. Canon has quit the film market, and Nikon barely pays attention to it. The Second hand market is more than adequate for the needs of the shrunken-but-vigorous body of users of film (God Bless Freestyle). This is also a chance to pick up some lovely gear, as others have noted, cheap.<br>

The M continues, although I don't help them there because I'm still waiting for my M3 and M2 to wear out. In fact, except for the CL and the R3 (now deceased) I've actually bought almost nothing of their new.<br>

We went through this same agony with the Minox a while back -- bottom line for me is that I was, this year, able to buy a Minox LX for under $200. Other dead brands -- Graflex -- are still popular, I imagine Leica R will stay so as well.<br>

So keep shooting, people. That's the best guarantee that the brand will be around a long time.</p>

<p>Charlie Trentelman<br>

Ogden, Utah</p>

<p>Well you see, after I bought an M6 several years ago, and seeing as I won't be able to wear it out in my lifetime, I got myself a 1954 IIIf. I doubt if I'll wear THAT one out. So I got a 1936 II, and guess what? That looks like it's going to keep chugging along as well. This so-called old stuff simply won't quit, and will keep helping us making those wonderful silver-based photographs for quite some time.<br>

Cheers, André<br>

Antwerp, Belgium</p>

<p>yeah, andre, that's always been Leica's problem -- they completely forgot to design in obsolescence, so nobody needs to buy new, at not if they're really serious about photography -- I should get my 1931 Model I-C out and exercise it -- no rangfinder, but is teriffic with a wide angle lens.</p>

<p>This topic was knocked around in early March...<br>

http://www.photo.net/leica-rangefinders-forum/00Sel7</p>

 

<p>It is sad. I had always hoped to own a new R series some day, but like Rolexes, the price kept growing faster than my income.</p>

<p>I'm still waiting for the prices to drop a little more before upgrading my R4 with an R6.2</p>

<p>...of course, with an R4, I might be forced into the upgrade just to keep shooting my lenses... one never knows with sketchy electronics... :)</p>

<p>List'</p>

<p>So they lied about a future R10 (digital) I'm glad I did not swap a few hundred rounds of .22 Match<br>

ammo for a friend's R8.</p>

<p>Jerry</p>

<blockquote>

<p>So they lied about a future R10 (digital)</p>

</blockquote>

<p>Not really. They made statements like "evaluating", and overenthusiastic folk (mainly at the Rangefinder Forum) turned that into "R10 on the way".</p>

<p>What are you guys talking about? What they discontinued is the production of manual-focus R9 and R lenses. The auto-focus R10 and auto-focus lenses are still in the works, now planned for 2010. Leica has stated the R10 will be able to use old manual-focus R lenses. This was hashed a few weeks ago, and I haven't seen anything to change it. Have you?</p>

<blockquote>

<p>The auto-focus R10 and auto-focus lenses are still in the works, now planned for 2010. Leica has stated</p>

</blockquote>

<p>Can you provide any reference to an actual Leica document or transcribed interview where Leica "stated" this?</p>

<p>"Can you provide any reference to an actual Leica document or transcribed interview where Leica "stated" this?"</p>

<p><a rel="nofollow" href="http://tv.mediaprovider.se/leica_s2_and_r10_1223561589701.html" target="_blank">http://tv.mediaprovider.se/leica_s2_and_r10_1223561589701.html</a></p>

<p>See this interview with Maike Harberts, Leica Product Manager, at last September's Photokina. About 5 min into the interview she talks a little about tentative work on the R10.<br>

http://tv.mediaprovider.se/leica_s2_and_r10_1223561589701.html</p>

 

<p>http://blog.photo.net/?p=4051</p>

<p>Hehe...Mr. Herr beat me to that link.<br>

In addition, as featured in the Q4 edition of LHSA's Viewfinder #41-4, p.22, Andreas Kaufmann addressed the LHSA 2008 annual meeting and stated that the R10 will have a range of autofocus lenses and will accept existing Leica-R lenses with the advantage of tapping the autofocus system for autofocus confirmation (as reported in Viewfinder).<br>

Of course any plans can change due to unforeseen circumstances. But those are the stated intentions and I haven't yet seen or heard anything to the contrary.</p>

<p>Doug and Ken, your links tripped the spyware warnings.</p>

<p>Thanks anyway, though.</p>

<p>You might want to look at your security settings Joseph. I went to both Ken's and Doug's links and all is fine.</p>

<p>just fyi --- this is from Leica's web site, their press release on the subject. Doesn't mention the R10, just possible future products, maybe:</p>

 

<h1>03/25/2009</h1>

<p >For more than 40 years the Leica R-System has played an important role within the Leica product portfolio. However new camera developments have significantly affected the sales of Leica R cameras and lenses resulting in a dramatic decrease in the number sold. Sadly therefore there is no longer an economic basis on which to keep the Leica R-System in the Leica production programme.<br /> At the beginning of March 2009 authorised Leica photo dealers were informed by Leica Camera AG that the production of the SLR camera, Leica R 9 as well as R-lenses would therefore be discontinued.<br /> In due course the technical innovations derived from the newly developed professional system SLR camera Leica S 2 will, we believe, generate a basis for new system solutions for the future. We will obviously keep you informed of these developments at the appropriate time.<br /> Leica R-system products are still available at some authorised Leica dealers and in addition a significant second-hand trade confirms the continued use of Leica R products, therefore, the information regarding the Leica R system will continue to be available on our web site .</p>

 

<p>Nor would I expect them to talk about the future R10 specifically. It might not even be called "R10".<br /><em>"In due course the technical innovations derived from the newly developed professional system SLR camera Leica S 2 will, we believe, generate a basis for new system solutions for the future. We will obviously keep you informed of these developments at the appropriate time."</em><br />That's close enough for me for the time being. Within a year I will expect to hear more from them.</p>

<p>I have to say that Leica website's message seems to me to be very cagey and does not really fill me with great confidence.</p>

Leica is so lucky a company. They can discontinue a line and not succeed it for several years and yet their loyal fans will continue cheering for them, and will await with eagerness no matter how little reassurance comes from Leica. And when it will finally be in stores, usually a year or so after originally it was planned, no matter now much it is by then obsolete, or how many strange quirks (like needs for IR filters) and bugs, or how many pros are disappointed and write poor reviews, or how much more expensive than other brands, there will still be those fans buying it and claiming it superior to all else. I would kill to own such a company with such fans for customers, especially in this economy!

<p ><a href="../photodb/user?user_id=3811803">L DaSousa</a> wrote: <em>"Leica is so lucky a company... "</em></p>

<p ><em></em></p>

<p >The DMR does not require IR filters</p>

<p >The DMR's image quality is in no way obsolete</p>

<p >The DMR isn't buggy</p>

<p >The DMR's poor "reviews" were written by people who never used one</p>

<p >The R8 + DMR was no more expensive than a contemporaneous top-of-the-line Canon or Nikon</p>

<p >Leica-R lenses work best on a camera designed for them</p>

<p >Leica has anounced plans to develop a successor to the DMR</p>

<p >Given what I've seen of the performance of Leica-R lenses on the DMR there is good reason to wait for the DMR's successor instead of trading systems for the Canon/Nikon/Sony flavor-of-the-month.</p>

The DMR was discontinued some while ago. The only way to get one now is find secondhand if possible, with of course no warranty from Leica (I believe there are no more demo's). For those who donot have a DMR, cannot find one secondhand, or donot want secondhand, if they want digital and donot want to go to Nikon (or Canon, and perhaps keep R lenses on adapters), must now wait until an unknown time for a camera of unknown specifications. That is what I was talking about. Not the few thousand people in the world who have a DMR. <p>

 

"The DMR's poor "reviews" were written by people who never used one" </p>

 

Who were these terrible frauds and liars who made such reviews without ever using one???!!! Are they still keeping their jobs with magazines??? <p>

 

"The R8 + DMR was no more expensive than a contemporaneous top-of-the-line Canon or Nikon"</p>

 

That was true only if you considered a secondhand R8 (which the R8 was already discontinued). If at the time you had bought a NEW R9 and a NEW DMR it was more expensive than Canon 1DS-II, which also was Full Frame BTW and 60% more pixels. I was seriously considered to buy a DMR and did very much research at the time.

<p><a href="../photodb/user?user_id=3811803">L DaSousa</a> wrote: <em>"Who were these terrible frauds and liars who made such reviews without ever using one???!!! Are they still keeping their jobs with magazines???"</em><br /><em></em><br /><br />Bob Atkins: <a href="../equipment/leica/dmr">http://www.photo.net/equipment/leica/dmr/</a><br>

If the DMR is so lousy why is its resale value - for a discontinued 4-year-old digital camera - nearly the same as the original purchase price?</p>

<p>I am surprised to read someone here can call Mr. Bob Adkins a fraud and liar. I thought he was universally well respected. This is a shock. <br /> <br /> However BTW as I recall the price of the DMR was new $4995 and shortly after to $5995. Here is from today a screen shot at KEH.com.</p><div></div>

<p><a href="../photodb/user?user_id=3811803">L DaSousa</a> wrote: <em>"a fraud and liar"</em></p>

<p>Your words, not mine.</p>

<p>BTW for those who still believe that pixel count determine image quality, the Canon 1Ds II was the top-of-the-line model when the DMR first went on sale, not the 1Ds III.</p>