Kodak stops B&W paper production

Incredible, but true: after 117 years in the B&W paper business, Kodak

announces today that it is over - it stops the production of its

ENTIRE LINE of B&W paper forever.

 

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Kodak Announces Discontinuance of KODAK PROFESSIONAL Black & White Papers

 

June 15, 2005

Due to the significant declines in market usage of papers designed for

Black-and-White printing, Kodak is discontinuing the manufacture of all

KODAK PROFESSIONAL Black & White Papers.

 

This announcement has no impact on the production or availability of

Kodak's

portfolio of Black & White Films and Chemicals for processing Black and

White Papers or Films.

 

Most of the Black & White Paper products will remain available through the

end of 2005 - although depending on demand, some specific formats or

products may be exhausted sooner. The paper products affected are:

 

 

KODAK PROFESSIONAL

 

Digital Black & White Paper

RC base -For Digital Exposure -Traditional

 

B & W Process,

 

KODAK PROFESSIONAL

 

POLYCONTRAST IV RC Paper

RC base -For Optical Exposure - Traditional

 

B & W Process

 

KODAK PROFESSIONAL V-PRINT Paper

RC base -For Optical Exposure - Traditional B & W Process

 

KODAK PROFESSIONAL

 

KODABROME II RC Paper

RC base -For Optical Exposure - Traditional

 

B & W Process

 

KODAK PROFESSIONAL

 

PANALURE Select RC Paper

RC base -For Optical Exposure - Traditional

 

B & W Process

 

KODAK PROFESSIONAL

 

POLYMAX Fine Art Paper

Fiber base - For Optical Exposure - Traditional

 

B & W Process

 

KODAK PROFESSIONAL

 

AZO Paper

Fiber base - For Optical Exposure - Traditional

 

B & W Process

 

KODAK PROFESSIONAL

 

PORTRA Black & White Paper

RC base -For Optical and Digital Exposure

 

RA- 4 Process

 

KODAK PROFESSIONAL

 

PORTRA Sepia Paper

RC base -For Optical and Digital Exposure

 

RA- 4 Process

Sorry to say, but it's true. I just confirmed it with the Rochester Democrat and Chronicle Kodak beat business reporter Ben Rand (brand@democratandchronicle.com).

 

Anyone with appropriate comments (that he can print-no hate mail please), I sure he would like to hear from you immediately for quotes in tomorrow's newspaper. Also any other rumors you might have heard would be appreciated.

 

Robert Johnson

Seems demand for film is declining faster than expected. Still lots of people shooting color print film, but I wonder about the future of slides.

 

However, Kodak is an awfully big company to be dealing in what has become the nitch market of B&W paper products. As the market shrinks the competition heats up with others just trying to stay alive. I suspect that Kodak wisely decided that fighting it out just to become the last man standing was not going to be profitable. I doubt that smaller companies will follow suit for some time, and there will always be a nitch market that some one or two companies will find to be profitable. In fact, with Kodak out of it the rest of them just got a much larger market share of the shrinking pie.

 

I still have doubts about Kodak remaining in slide film from more than another year. And in spite of what they say here, they will probably drop B&W chemicals in the not to distant future.

<i><b>RA- 4 Process</b></i>

<p>

They're killing off their chromogenic B&W papers too?

<p>

So what now is their rationale for maintaining two chromogenic B&W <i>film</I> varieties (one for chromogenic papers, one for real paper)?

Well, the chromogenic films are primarily intended to be printed on color paper, not color process b&w paper. The latter is a specialty item for picky customers who want to absolutely have no color cast, which aren't apparently a large enough group of people to justify production. It also may be that they just close production of the plant, which includes all black and white paper, without consideration to whether individual paper types would be useful to have around.

 

I thought that Kodak only makes one type of chromogenic film: BW400CN. Which other types are available? I thought all the rest were discontinued, and this type is primarily for printing on colour paper so in that sense they still produce what is needed.

 

Slide film is still more popular than black and white film, and even the latter remains in production both in traditional and in chromogenic varieties, to be printed on Ilford papers, or colour paper, or scanned and printed on inkjets or a variety of other digital methods. Can't say that options aren't available.

 

Besides, I think Ilford and Agfa papers are better than Kodak's b&w papers.

The consensus on most lists and forums is that Kodak lost this market to Agfa and Ilford 20 or 25 years ago anyway. I know few people who ever used Kodak B&W paper and most who did switched brands decades ago. With the exception of a few specialty papers (Azo comes to mind) Kodak papers won't be missed by too many people.

 

Kodak leaving this market means more sales and a brighter future for better Ilford products. The fact that Kodak papers sold 25% less than last year doesn't mean that the situation is equally grim for niche producers whose offers perhaps match the market's demands better.

 

Some people have suggested that Kodak chemicals might be next to be discontinued, especially paper processing products like Dektol. I'm not sure; many people have been using them with Ilford or Agfa papers for ages, so we can assume that demand is still there and that the products will endure for a while. Chemicals are also better suited for small scale production than paper.

 

Of course, Kodak is a huge company that doesn't care for niche markets and probably couldn't adapt to them even if it wanted, so the future of the other product lines is uncertain. My guess is that film, which is still very profitable, is there to stay for a long while. Chemicals are probably profitable, too, but sales are so small that Kodak might wonder why bother.

you're probably right, I'm resigned to that fact, although I admit to taking the news rather

badly yesterday, and still am in a bit of a funk. where I work, the labs have used kodak

products forever it seems, and there's at least one lab I can think of that has probably

never

even run a single sheet of b/w paper that wasn't made by kodak, for years, the purchasing

system wouldn't even order any other products. I

remember---yawn---when I first started working , and trying to get them to order

Ilford, and the paper cost more money at that time, since it wasn't on contract. there was

only one other lab using ilford, and the way they ordered it, was to use outside funds.

While we ordered paper once a year in huge amounts--they ran out almost

and had to get it a box at a time.

 

Our lab had an ilford processing machine, and there was one more ilford machine in the

lab that used their paper. The largest lab, used a kodak machine. There were probably 6

ilford machines total at one time, though. I remember our Ilford rep, when we had one,

kept trying to get us to switch to their paper, but it was such a hassle because each order

had to have a written justification because it cost more money. We had to use their

chemistry though, and it was easy to justify that. The rep quit coming out after awhile,

since there was no sale really to be made.

 

They would send out these annual contracts for bids, with the amounts from the previous

year, and even this past year--the amount of b/w paper, film and chemistry was

staggering to me. It was almost all Kodak. I guess I must live in a fishbowl or something,

because I knew on these forums that Kodak is often villified, or seen as second to Ilford,

but where I am, it was the other way around.

 

When Ilford tanked last year--it was a blow as well. It was bad for us with the processor,

and it's still bad. It was the the first shoe to drop. This is the second.

 

so--see, it may not be a big deal to you, but some of us used a lot of that paper, and it

comes as a bit of a surprise, even though I guess it shouldn't.

It is unlikely that Kodak's b&w chemicals will remain in production. There are probably more amateurs using Kodak chemicals with Ilford paper than the other way around but there are many other fine products around for developing both paper and film. The way I saw things going was that I would continue to use my film cameras for black & white photography and make projection prints. The limiting factor would be the long term availability of photographic paper. This announcement might be good in the short run for Ilford but the market for the product is shrinking in general. I haven't heard any more news about AgfaPhoto but I wouldn't count on having their products around much longer.

 

I agree that slide film will not last much longer. I can see using a digital camera for color photography. If all b&w photographic paper is discontinued I could scan my negatives and make inkjet prints. I have enough black & white film to last a good long time. If I understand it correctly, paper can be stored frozen successfully for some time but not paper which has developer incorporated into it as some RC products do. At some point the market for dedicated film scanners will shrink up. Museums and archives will still need them but that's a small market. If most images in the future are made with digital equipment then scanners will see less and less use. One of my favorite things about collecting film cameras is actually using them. If they just sit on a shelf I don't know how much I will enjoy them. Will a Nikon F3 in perfect condition go for $25 in a year or two? Will it even go for that much?

 

That leaves color print film. What is killing off this business is the disappearance of local film processing. Earlier this week I took a roll of C41 film to Walgreens. The employee who works in the film department didn't come in so no film could be processed. Then I went to CVS. Their machine had been broken and there was a backlog so I couldn't have the film back for several days. I asked how much film they could develop in a day with the equipment in good order. The answer? From 3 to 4 rolls per hour. At that rate they couldn't make money even with minimumn wage employees. They still use the RA-4 line to make prints from digital media but at some point, soon, the C41 part of their line will be shut down. I mailed the film away for processing.

Here's my question for when agfa and and ilford finally call it quits. What are the methods for freezing fiber paper? Can it be thawed and refrozen or would you have to divide it up into smaller amounts and use it all at once. Also what is the normal shelf life of fiber paper at room temp? And my final question, what is the shelf life of powder and liquid chemistry.

Thanks, John

Kodak still makes even Kodachrome which has probably 0.001% of the market, and that's an arcane and difficult process which has pretty much only symbolic value. I imagine before E6 films go, Kodachrome would go 10-20 years earlier.