Just bought my first FD Body in a while

I bought my first "real" camera, an A-1, in 2005 and have since been a big FD system fan. Although I have been absent for a while, I was a moderator on this forum for several years.

 

In the time, I've owned(and still own) lenses ranging from the 20mm 2.8 to the 400mm 4.5 and a lot of great lenses in between. There are still a lot I'd like to have(55mm 1.2 asp., 85mm 1.2L, and 14mm to name a few) , but my attention has been focused more on medium and large format equipment lately.

 

I've also owned virtually every FD body along the way. I've never had a (working)T50 or T80 but have no desire to, and never got around to buying an AE-1P. There's one camera that has always intrigued me, though, but the prices in the past sort of scared me off.

 

That camera is the EF. For those not in the know, this was a 1970 shutter priority SLR-as far as I know it was the first AE camera made not counting the rare Servo EE finder for the F-1(yes, I've had one of those). I've never seen one in person, bu superficially it looks like a cross between an F-1 and an FTb with the AE-1 shutter speed dial thrown in.

 

One of the other big selling points of the camera, though, is the vertical Copal Square shutter. The general "venetian blind" design became common in the late 1980s and continues to this day in DSLRs, but at the time it was quite novel. My grandfather had a Konica AutoReflex TC with this feature(I now have the camera), something which he praised endlessly.

 

Earlier this evening, I was able to win a nice EF on Ebay for $50 shipped. I'm excited about the camera, and will of course report back once I have it.

Go to it!

 

I've got and shot almost all the A and T series cameras and found them great to excellent.

 

My really much favored, of all cameras, is the Canon T-90. If only the mirror magnet didn't freeze....

I go back and forth on whether I like the T90 or the New F-1 better.

 

At the end of the day, I usually end up back at the New F-1, but it's still a tough call. I can't skip the original F-1 and F-1n also.

 

Since I've acquired some Nikons lately also, I have to say that to me the New F-1 kicks the butt of the contemporary F3. That's not to say that the F-3 isn't a great camera(it is) with some great features lacking in the F-1(MLU, anyone?) and a film advance lever to die for, but the New F-1 just feels so much more "natural" to me.

 

In any case, I can guarantee that the EF is going to get some use when it gets here.

 

BTW, the Radio Shack in town is in final stage liquidation and was selling "grab bags." I raided the specialty battery shelf, and all told picked up 391 separate items(several of which were multi-packs of batteries) with a normal retail price of $1400 for $26.50 with tax. Along with a bunch of PX-28As(I cleaned out the 2CR1/3Ns, which are the lithium PX-28As, at $1.10 each last week), I picked up several alkaline 625s. One of the beauties of the EF is that it's perfectly content with any voltage battery as long as it's enough to power the meter. AFAIK, it's the only Canon using a 625 battery for which this is the case. I did pick up about 40 #675s for all my other "need a mercury battery" cameras.

 

 

In any case, I just checked the freezer and it looks like I need to order some more Tri-X. Both the 35mm and 120 shelves are getting a bit thin.

I do have a T-80. I got it from a Goodwill auction a year or so ago. Interesting camera.

What a beautiful camera, Canon EF it is.

I was hunting for a while for working one in presentable condition, finally I have given up.

Then I looked at my shelf with FD cameras, something was missing, so I have bought one god looking body for 30£. Not to my surprise long shutter times were not working, it is very common issue with this model. It was bothering me a little, I have sent it for repair, not to avail unfortunately, looks like 40 years old electronics in the camera are irreparable. Then I bought another one, I have specifically asked seller in Japan if long shutter times work. They, so bought this one as well, few weeks later it has arrived. Indeed , electronic shutter times work as promised, but body itself looks like it was dropped from fifth story building underneath upcoming lorry, all dented and rattly.

I have spoken with my camera repair serviceman ( Dave of Milton Keynes, cannot praise him enough) and he agreed to combine both bodies into one decent looking, completely working Canon EF body.

I cannot wait...

I'm a big fan of the original F-1, so there's no small wonder that I'd also like the EF, since they look almost identical to each other. I own three EFs now, sort of by accident, but I don't mind. I have spares now for the one, almost mint copy that I also own.

 

One thing that bears mentioning, just in case you're not aware -- unlike other Canons that take a PX625-size battery, the EF picks up the + signal from the side of the battery, not the top. This isn't an issue if you're using the full size batteries, but it does become an issue if you're using the 675 hearing aid batteries, which is what I use. You'll need adapters for your 675s, which can be gotten for cheap. But lacking adapters, I've found a work-around. I tear off some narrow strips of aluminum foil from a roll, then fold them until they're the same depth as the batteries. Then I wrap the foil around the battery until I have the desired diameter. At that point, I trim the foil. I insert the battery and foil together into the battery compartment, but once inserted, I find that I can remove the batteries, leaving the foil in place, for relatively easy replacement. Hey it works, and it'll get the job done until I get some adapters.

 

As for other FD cameras, I've owned them all at one time or another . . . well, except maybe for the TLb, a model that I've never seen the sense in owning. And I've arrived at a few favorites -- endearing ones that have withstood the test of time. These are the original F-1, especially the F-1n, the second version, the FTb, especially the FTbn, the second version, the New F-1, the T90, and even the T70. The only reason why I include the T70 is it has a choice of metering patterns, which includes a partial pattern, which I much prefer. My preference for partial metering patterns grew from the fact that, back in the day, I shot slides almost exclusively. Because of their narrow exposure latitude, having a metering pattern that was able to eliminate any spikes in the readings due to extraneous light sources was most welcome. This is also a big reason why I've always preferred the old F-1 and FTb as first cameras of choice. Their 12% selective area pattern is excellent for slide shooting. The New F-1, when equipped with a Partial focusing screen, produces virtually the same results. And both the T90 and T70 have partial patterns. To my knowledge, none of the other FD cameras have partial metering patterns, and this is the main reason why I've excluded them from my list of preferred FD cameras. The EF, A-1, AT-1, and AE-1 Program are also great cameras that have withstood the test of time very well, but they all have Canon's rather weak centerweighted meterng pattern, which one must use with quite considerable care when shooting slides. They do fine though when shooting C-41 or B&W.

One thing that bears mentioning, just in case you're not aware -- unlike other Canons that take a PX625-size battery, the EF picks up the + signal from the side of the battery, not the top.

 

 

Thanks for this information, although it's sort of a non-issue for me now since I'm actually PX625s in the camera. The local Radio Shack closed last Friday and they were selling "grab bags" for $25. I swept all the specialty batteries off the shelf(by swept I mean I just put my hand at the back of the rack and pushed them into my bag). All told, I managed to get about 30 PX28s/2CR1/3Ns, which of course are common camera batteries and a probably in the hundreds of SR76s/LR44s(which a lot of other makers use). I even managed to squeeze in a rechargeable for my DSLR. All told, I had 391 separate items with a retail value of $1400...and that isn't an accurate battery count since most of the SR76s were in 3-count packages and the 675s were in 8 or 16.

 

 

In any case, I know that the EF can use alkaline 625s, so I pulled some out of my stash and stuck them in.

 

 

Unfortunately, I've run into a few issues with the camera after playing with it for a day. First of all, the electronic shutter speeds don't work. The camera will indicate correct exposure, but they all fire at 1s. I understand that this is a common problem.

 

 

Second, after playing with it for a little while I found that the mirror doesn't go down at 1/1000. If I push the stopdown lever, it will drop, but that's the only way to get it going.

 

 

I need to decide if I want to return it or send it to Mr. Oikawa and see if he can straighten it out. I still haven't sent my F-1n(on which the meter decided to die) but I may stick this in the box when I send that camera. The worst he can do is say it's not repairable. The one I bought is very nice cosmetically, and for $50(total investment) I think I'd still come out alright to have a known good body.

I'm a big fan of the original F-1, so there's no small wonder that I'd also like the EF, since they look almost identical to each other. I own three EFs now, sort of by accident, but I don't mind. I have spares now for the one, almost mint copy that I also own.

 

One thing that bears mentioning, just in case you're not aware -- unlike other Canons that take a PX625-size battery, the EF picks up the + signal from the side of the battery, not the top. This isn't an issue if you're using the full size batteries, but it does become an issue if you're using the 675 hearing aid batteries, which is what I use. You'll need adapters for your 675s, which can be gotten for cheap. But lacking adapters, I've found a work-around. I tear off some narrow strips of aluminum foil from a roll, then fold them until they're the same depth as the batteries. Then I wrap the foil around the battery until I have the desired diameter. At that point, I trim the foil. I insert the battery and foil together into the battery compartment, but once inserted, I find that I can remove the batteries, leaving the foil in place, for relatively easy replacement. Hey it works, and it'll get the job done until I get some adapters.

 

As for other FD cameras, I've owned them all at one time or another . . . well, except maybe for the TLb, a model that I've never seen the sense in owning. And I've arrived at a few favorites -- endearing ones that have withstood the test of time. These are the original F-1, especially the F-1n, the second version, the FTb, especially the FTbn, the second version, the New F-1, the T90, and even the T70. The only reason why I include the T70 is it has a choice of metering patterns, which includes a partial pattern, which I much prefer. My preference for partial metering patterns grew from the fact that, back in the day, I shot slides almost exclusively. Because of their narrow exposure latitude, having a metering pattern that was able to eliminate any spikes in the readings due to extraneous light sources was most welcome. This is also a big reason why I've always preferred the old F-1 and FTb as first cameras of choice. Their 12% selective area pattern is excellent for slide shooting. The New F-1, when equipped with a Partial focusing screen, produces virtually the same results. And both the T90 and T70 have partial patterns. To my knowledge, none of the other FD cameras have partial metering patterns, and this is the main reason why I've excluded them from my list of preferred FD cameras. The EF, A-1, AT-1, and AE-1 Program are also great cameras that have withstood the test of time very well, but they all have Canon's rather weak centerweighted meterng pattern, which one must use with quite considerable care when shooting slides. They do fine though when shooting C-41 or B&W.

Why bother? The EF automatically adjusts voltage and works great with 1.5 volt 625A alkalines....

Well, I did it. The Lord and my wife know I didn't need another camera body, but I swore if I ever saw an EF listed in good shape for a good price I would buy what I have wanted ever since they first came out. Back then I had a couple of F1s and an FTb, so why bother. And when I finally decided to get an EF, they were discontinued. To cut to the chase, KEH listed one as "Ex" so I pulled the trigger. I should know in a couple of days if it was a good idea. Yeah, I'm a little excited.

I also think I like the EF the most, even though not for the same reasons you mentioned here. My first EF I got from a pawn shop, and I bought it because I think it is simpler than all others. I don't see any other 35mm film SLR that has only one big dial on the right, the center of which is the shutter release (another dSLR has it is the Panasonic L1). As usual, I prefer to shoot manually all the time and the EF was not really designed for manual, (that's why they have the letter E, I guess). But its S mode is very convenient for me to set the lens aperture "manually". Otherwise, I don't really trust the meters of the cameras, much less of the EF.

 

That first EF also had problem with long speed. I guess it was so innovative and the design had some issue, so that many EF had that same problem. It is also weird (and unique) that it has TWO battery compartment and sometimes also worked when I load only one battery and shorted the other compartment. Anyway, 8 years ago, I happily got a perfect EF, and unfortunately, I am about to let it (and many other cameras that I love) go just because I am having some problem and don't have room to keep them anymore.

I'm a happy boy. Just got back my test roll, and all looks good. And all of the long shutter speeds seem to work. (Too bad I took such stupid photos like 8 photos of the side of a brick building just changing the shutter speeds)

Why bother? The EF automatically adjusts voltage and works great with 1.5 volt 625A alkalines....

 

I have probably a hundred or more 675s and no 625s. That's why. May as well use what I got.

One of these days, I'll get some of the passive size adapters that fit LR44s/SR876s. Those, to me, are an ideal solution for cameras like the EF since they last forever unlike 675s but there aren't any voltage concerns.

 

I know you use aluminum foil, copper wire, or whatever but I like neat solutions.

 

I've gotten by with dropping 675s into the battery compartment of cameras like the original F-1 and FTb, but I have other cameras now where that doesn't work. Nikon F Photomic finders come to mind. It can also get questionable when you have to stack two cells-again I go back to most of the F Photomics, but it also applies if you're using the booster finder on your FT or Pellix.

Edited August 14, 2017 by ben_hutcherson

I just got the 2 EF's from John Tran. Will test them out with alkaline batteries and see how well they work.

1. One of your EF, the one with good horizontal scale, works well with alkaline batteries too. The other is so weird, and I found it also works S mode if you install only one battery (near tripod hole).

 

2. I still don't have a good explaination why the EF has S priority mode, but the F1 requires a motor drive to use that S mode. Instead the F1 is trying to be smart and lock up the camera if you try to use S mode without a motor drive. Hope someone can enlighten me.

John, don't forget that the shutter priority thing is true on the New F-1, not the original F-1(the one contemporary to the EF). If you want shutter priority on the original F-1, you need the rare Servo EE Finder.

 

In any case, the difference comes down to how the lever at the right side of the mirror box(as you're facing the box) operates/interacts with the aperture stop down tab on the lens.

 

Just to be clear, if you look at the back of an FD lens, you'll see two levers-the one at the bottom is an "absolute" stop down lever-i.e. on or off, while the one on the side has a bit of a dual function. If you set the lens to mimic being mounted on the camera, you'll see that side lever EITHER moves in steps according to the position of the aperture ring, or if the lens is set to its smallest aperture(or A) the lever can be manipulated to adjust how far the lens stops down.

 

Early FD bodies, including the FTb, F-1(original), TX, and TLb use the lever to the right of the mirror box as a "feeler." It "reads" the aperture set on the lens aperture ring and adjusts the meter reading based on that. On aperture priority(only) bodies like the AV-1 and AL-1, the body selects a shutter speed based on the aperture setting that it reads from this lever.

 

Shutter priority bodies like the EF, AE-1/AE-1P along with multi-mode bodies like the A-1, T70, and T90 use the mirror box lever/lens lever differently. Instead of "tracking" the movement, the lens is(mostly) used locked at the "A" position. The camera body has a stepper motor that moves the tab in the body the correct amount based on the required aperture(whether in Tv mode, P mode, or in Av mode on the A-1, T70, or T90(where the aperture is set on the body, not the lens)) and the lever on the lens "follows" it. When the stop down lever at the bottom is activated, whether manually or as part of the exposure, the aperture ONLY closes to the position that the tab allows it.

 

The New F-1 is a bit "weird" in that the aperture tab can operate in both of the modes described above. As a bare body, the tab in the body functions only in "follower" mode and is used either with the meter or to select the shutter speed in aperture priority mode.

 

The power winder and motor drive, however, contain the stepper motor needed to position the aperture. There are three screw doors that must be removed from the New F-1 to mount the motor drive(the rewind cover needn't be removed with the power winder as it does not have power rewind). The smallest of these is the interface for this stepper motor.

 

So, the short answer is that the New F-1 simply doesn't have the correct mechanical components to operate in shutter priority mode. The power winder and motor drive DO have those components.

 

By the way, if you look carefully at the original F-1 body, there is a small flip-out door on the side of the mirror box next to the aperture lever. The Servo EE finder has a rod which connects the finder to this slot and directly to the aperture lever.

Thank you for writing up a long explanation. But I have read that kind of explanation from Canon and other reviewers a lot and I can't buy the idea that the required "mechanical components" is in the winder because the connection between the winder and the body is only at film advance and some "electrical" contacts. These electrical contacts obviously let the body knows if there is a powered winder or drive in connection, but the "mechanical components" or "motor" that moves the aperture lever MUST be inside the body (don't you think?). My guess is that Canon's design at that time requires 2 power sources to do S mode and display the aperture at the same time. But I am not satisfied with my own explanation.

Well, you can believe me or not, but look at the camera and winder/motor drive and the mechanical connection is obvious. If you have ever handled/installed a motor drive you will know that there are THREE mechanical connections-one at the film advance, one for film rewind, and then a third small one that's physically located between the two.

 

In addition, the power explanation doesn't fly as the A-series cameras used the same PX-28 battery and had the servo in them.

There is no stepper motor in any of these cameras. The aperture stops down by spring power and turns a gear which has a potentiometer to determine the position of the stop down level. When the aperture stops down to the intended aperture there is a pawl activated by a magnet to stop the gear.

I believe you Ben, and now I believe the mechanism is in the drive. I guess that would be better in the designs of that time.

I believe you Ben, and now I believe the mechanism is in the drive. I guess that would be better in the designs of that time.

I read the test report by Popular Photography they did a strip down report and thought they did that to get sufficient power.

I remember reading Canon’s explanation back in 1981 why you needed to attach a power winder or motor drive to a F-1N if you wanted shutter-speed automation. They believed that an internal, AE-1 style shutter-speed automation mechanism wasn’t reliable enough for a professional camera like the F-1N. By moving part of the SS-preferred mechanism to a motor drive or winder, reliability would be greatly increased.

This is the link to the article I was talking about

Popular Photography

 

Goto page 101

They believed that an internal, AE-1 style shutter-speed automation mechanism wasn’t reliable enough for a professional camera like the F-1N. By moving part of the SS-preferred mechanism to a motor drive or winder, reliability would be greatly increased.

 

I can certainly see that. The A-series type mechanism doesn't seem the most robust, although admittedly the past 40 years have not shown that to play out in practice.

 

With that said, the F-1 is unique among FD cameras in how it implements both shutter priority and aperture priority. On other multi-mode bodies, as mentioned, the aperture is set from the body in aperture priority mode. I much prefer the F-1 implementation. Using early multi-mode Nikon bodies like the FA and F4 has made me appreciate it even more, as it just strikes me as the correct way to do it(although the A-1 was "the way of the future" as basically all cameras work that way now, albeit high end Nikons can be set to work in aperture priority with the aperture ring if present).