I'm every camera store's worst nightmare

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<br />I'm every camera store's worst nightmare - quite often I go into look at off beat items like tri-pods / backpacks etc as they are difficult to visualise scale and quality from online photos and then look for a less inflated price online using a couple of trusted sources - taking into consideration warranties associated with 'grey market' items etc.

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<p>The above quote was noted in a different post.<br>

Is it me, or are others disturbed by the fact that there are those that suck up the services of local camera stores, and then not support them when it costs money to keep a physical location open so fake customers can come in and sample the merchandise, then only to spend their money elsewhere?<br /><br />Maybe this is the same kind of customer that will not complain if someone just copies private photos off web pages without compensating the person who took the time to physically take the photo. hmmm<br /><br />Do not misunderstand my thoughts here. I do not advocate paying rip off high prices; however ethics rules my decision to pay for a reasonable profit for the good of the industry and to compensate the employees of said local camera shops so they can pay the light bill. In an internet world there would be no local camera shops except for BIG BOX stores. Is this what we want? Food for thought. Your thoughts?</p>

 

<p>The short version:</p>

<p>Buying all you need on the internet makes for very dull city centers.</p>

<p>Buying all you need in city centers at more than 10% above internet prices is ripping yourself off.</p>

<p>Yes I agree. You have to realize that the kind of stores that permit you to inspect and handle cameras and tripods, etc., will soon disappear if you do not buy from them. It has happened to me many times that someone comes into my store, spends an hour having me show and explain a variety of cameras, then is never seen again. This person may have trouble coming up with the funds, but I believe that many of them go elsewhere to buy used, or look to save $10.-$20. by making the purchase elsewhere. It has gotten to the point that I will now ask a customer "are you buying or looking ?" if I suspect them to be one of those customers." The worst was when two guys in suits made an appointment to see a large ULF camera. I spent a long time with them, after taking out that very heavy and difficult to handle item. After I explained it to them they said thanks. I asked if they were going to buy it. "No, I have a camera of this format, was just curious." Even worse than those kind of customers are the ones who buy it, use it for an assignment, then return it. Because of those guys I did not take returns. Now the policy has been modified to "return within 3 days and pay a restocking fee" to keep those kind of customers from buying.</p>

<p>In a way I agree with you Ed.</p>

<p>But on the other side of the coin, as the original post indicated its hard to "visualise scale and quality from online photos". Id rather waste the local stores time than my money. imagine ordering something off the net, pay the shipping on top of that and find out when you get it that the product is not as you expected.</p>

<p>Sure you might be able to return it but you pay shipping both ways, and perhapse a 'restocking' fee on top of that.</p>

<p>I dont waste the locals time though, if Im gong to buy it local - I go in. If I have my heart set on getting something on the net then I just do it - well: after doing some research online first. I might also buy locally even after I do all the online research if the product I settle on is available locally.</p>

<p>I have to balance the cost of getting it online or locally. If I get it locally I will pay more than if I bought it online but there isnt any shipping involved so the extra cost is offset a bit. Makes it easier to return the product too.</p>

<p>But if I was the salesman and I spent lots of time helping you and then found out you just went online to buy the product, I would be a little miffed.</p>

<p>If I know what I want, I buy on price and tax avoidance. So, B&H it is. Local camera store when I have to have it today. Maybe an impulse purchase every now and then. Just wait until Wal-Mart starts to carry pro-glass ;-)</p>

<p>I always support my local camera shops, but unfortunately, the camera stores themeslves are often just a reflection of many on-line stores, namely chain outlets to sell marketable goods fast. Is that a camera store we should support with our money? I don't know because I don't use them. I support <a href="http://www.glazerscamera.com/">Glazer's Camera</a> in Seattle. But even they've changed the products to both keep their existing customers and build new one in order to survive.</p>

<p>I used to be the silent partner/tech co-guru in a local, small town computer store in the early-mid 90's. Every Tom, Dick and Harry came in to ask questions, play touchy feely and get 'educated'. Once they had what they needed, off they would promptly go to Circuit City, CompUSA or elsewhere to buy. Where incidentally they would also be up-sold all manner of junk that they did not need.</p>

<p>I estimate that for every customer who bought from us, at least 10 came in, picked our brains and went elsewhere. Our prices were at most about 15% above the Big Box Stores. As you can well imagine, we didn't buy in the same bulk as they did so our prices reflected a higher bottom line to start. We wound up being an educational resource but had trouble selling at all.</p>

<p>Interestingly enough, many people who bought elsewhere still had 'learning curve issues' with PCs back then. So, we ended up hosting classes for a nice fee, so they could learn how to use and operate their dirt cheap bought gear. That didn't offset the brain drain for window shoppers, but it did help us stay afloat for a few years. Ahhh, the good old days.</p>

<p>Jim M.</p>

A few months ago I was in the market for a 70-200 f/2.8 IS. The Internet price was nearly EUR 400,- lower than my local store. I went to the store and asked if they could knock something off the price as I was willing to pay a reasonable price to buy locally. I would (gladly?) pay 100.- more to buy locally but they stuck to the recommended retail price. I mentioned this up front and didn’t first ask to try. Maybe it is unfair to local stores, but nearly 400,-- difference – I ask you. I don’t know what the mark-up is with this kind of equipment and I know the local store has overheads but this Internet company also had an outlet where you could visit and try before you buy, also with sales persons, so why the huge difference? It wasn’t grey import as the normal guarantees and rebates were applicable. My store then went on to tell me that were many horror stories and that I would taking a big risk buying from the IntAernet. Needless to say I purchased from the Internet company to my complete satisfaction.

<p>It certainly has become hit or miss. I buy what I know I want, and what I don't need to touch in advance, online. I walk into the local pro/sumer shop when I want to see how a bag, or lens holster, or ballhead etc looks and feels. And I buy it <em>from them</em>. But what's maddening is that I completely understand that they make most of their real money on accessories and slightly odd-ball items which they don't have to necessarily deep discount... but now that stuff is fading away from inventories.<br /><br />Just yesterday, I waltzed in to pick up a C Stand and some gaffers tape. Cleaned out! Nada. Zip. <em>Not even a roll of gaffers tape at $25.00</em>. My fault for not planning ahead, but that's exactly the sort of stuff I would turn to a local pro-grade camera shop for... a piece of gel, a stand adapter, a step-up ring for a filter - that sort of stuff. And I'd expect to pay fairly high prices for such stuff, given the convenience of being able to immediately have it in hand. But alas: that's getting harder to find. </p>

<p>Camera stores can do what wineries do. Charge something like $5 to check out the goods in detail and have this charge redeemable from the cost of anything the customer buys from the store that day. I don't know if this would work for electronics, but it does pay for the employees time.</p>

<p>I have known 2 really great camera stores in my life, Beach Photo in Daytone Beach, and Camera Trading Company in Ottawa. I always got good prices and learnt a great deal about camera systems I did not even own, or intended to ever own, but it was interesting and revealing none the less. The online guys never have a chance to offer the same, except if you call them. The local guys are still business people, trying to make a buck. If you are lucky enough to have a good camera store in your neighbourhood, or even half an our away, you know already what it's worth.</p>

<p>I'm not sure I'm well liked at my local Ritz, mainly because with me there, no one can scam innocent people with insignificant features like megapixels and "digital shake reduction," the biggest ripoff in digital history. I'm always in there with friends looking for cameras, and it's gotten to the point to where they don't say a word, they just let me do the sale. Probably not the best way to make friends, but these people do it to themselves.</p>

<p>For oddball items and a world-class atmosphere, I love Iris Photo in Northampton, MA. I drive over an hour to go there because there's no useless BS sales pitches, and they actually listen to you and what you need before trying to sell you something.</p>

<p>This issue has been discussed numorous times already and there are always the same two camps:-) It seems to me that the local stores have not migrated to the 21st century yet - they don't understand that the game has changed and that everyone out there can now easily and conviniently compare prices and make a choice. I agree that it is not correct to check things out at a local store and then get it through the internet - I would never do this. But the bigger issue for me me is that the prices of the local stores AND the lousy service they provide are completely out of line. Why should I pay 1o%-20% more (not even incl. the sales tax) and deal with an ignorant sales person who doesn't have a clue of what I am talking about?</p>

<p>This is such a difficult issue when what's involved is a substantial amount between ordering online and buying local. Hwvr, I just about do all my research online instead of unfairly taking advantage of anyone's time. When I walk into a small store, I do feel that the owners or partners are entitled to make some profit. It is not easy to survive these days. Just recently I had a local store add a secondary DVD drive and 500GB HD to my desktop computer. The cost was so low I felt that it would cost more if I chose to do it myself. So I then took my old Gateway laptop to them to be serviced as well. They will replace the existing 100GB drive with a 250GB at a cost of only $109 plus some service fee. I could not believe it. I have not looked but this price is incredible, insn't it?</p>

<p>Mary</p>

<p>I phoned up an internet outlet today to order a camera to be told they were on backorder with a waiting list of about 250. A shipment was due in a few days time of about 400 cameras of this type . They were not sure what the price of the bnew shipment would be due to currency fluctuations but wold honour their advertised price.<br>

Whay local camera shop can compete with that?</p>

<p>I find amusing to notice that I'm mostly doing the opposite: I normally look online to choose what to get, then go for a store of my liking to buy it. I tend to buy online onlywhen either the saving is gigantic (which is rare) or when the product is hard to find elsewhere. So DPReview might get upset that I looked long at they Panasonic LX3 review, then simply walked into my local FNAC and bought it.</p>

<p>Also, I'm the kind of person that stopped going int what is likely the cheaper shop in the city, preferring places where they might ask you a 10% more, but you do not have to wait 45 minutes to speak with them, and when you speak with them they look competent AND genuinely interested in their work. I guess I'm the minority!</p>

<p>L.</p>

<p>The reason the local stores' prices are so much higher is simply that the manufacturers give a lower price to stores that make larger purchases. Simple as that. It isn't fair to the local stores but this doesn't seem to cross the manufacturer's minds.</p>

<p>"I normally look online to choose what to get, then go for a store of my liking to buy it. I tend to buy online onlywhen either the saving is gigantic (which is rare) or when the product is hard to find elsewhere."<br>

Ditto. Except I'm buying from online stores more and more, especially for photographic equipment. Most of the remaining camera shops in my area are becoming increasingly less well stocked. What's worse, the clerks are becoming increasingly less motivated and knowledgable of the range of products. There are some I won't set foot in because their response to "I'd like to buy 20 rolls of 120 Tri-X" was "What is 120? I thought Tri-X was 400. Take a look at what we have and maybe you can find something that will fit." All they seem to know about these days is the small range of (digital) product on their shelf... and little about what else might be available.</p>

<p>Sometimes it works out. My daughter needed a tripod for a Jul gift, so while she was home we tried to go to our excellent (and often as low as mail-order) camera store. They were closed, so we went out to the local B*stb*y store. Now I know this is not supporting a <em>local</em> store, but at least they are here, not a 1000 miles away. We found a decent looking carbon-fiber tripod (brand name) with a magnesium head, so went home to check on the internet price of the same. Turned out that the local (and internet) price of the big box store was about $50-75 <em><strong>less</strong> </em> than anyone else's price for exactly the same unit, so we went back out and bought it on the spot, tax and shipping being about the same.</p>

 

<p>Consider yourself lucky if you stil have local stores. Around here, they have folded. The nearest thing we have is a Costco. While the prices are competative, the selection is not.</p>

<p>I would buy consumables like film, paper, and chemicals at the local store here. We bought a few tripods, camera bags and other odds and ends also.<br>

When looking for a light meter, I had to order from the net because the price was through the roof.</p>

<p>In order to get stuff I need now without waiting for UPS is to drive into the city 40 miles each way. <br>

The local store here has since closed. They said they could not get their obsolete machines serviced anymore and didn't want to spend $800,000 upgrading so the owner sold off everything and retired.</p>

<p>I kind of miss that place now.</p>

 

<p>After buying online at several outlets, I now use Calumet as my "local" camera store, usually the Drummond St branch in Euston. Their prices match online prices, they are very knowledgable and very helpful. You can go in handle what you are looking for and discuss your needs with the staff.<br>

Last week I discovered that a tripod and head combination I bough was on sale at a lower price. An email later and I had a refund.<br>

Tomorrow I'm off there to buy a Peli 1510, at about 60GBP less than some web sites.</p>

<p>i try to be fair. i value my local camera store, and feel very fortunate to have it within walking distance (although in the past year they've curtailed their hours, making it impossible for me to get by there any day but saturday).<br>

i have bought a lot of high-dollar equipment there, and always try to pick up something -- even if it's only a few dollars -- when i stop by.<br>

mostly what i've purchased online would be unavailable -- like used gear -- or need to be special ordered -- paid in advance. under the circumstances, i'm not ashamed to talk about a new acquisition from another retailer with the sales associates.<br>

but it's hard not to miss the signs that this store is probably not going to survive the current economic meltdown. i will truly miss it. as for the online merchants, they offer so many ways for one to spend money, i almost wish ordering from them wasn't so convenient!</p>

 

<p>It's a mix. My local store sometimes has good deals on large items like light stands and tripods, that shipping alone would kill online, while selling film for $20 a roll! I have a hard time supporting a business with 4x mark-up on an item that I need a lot of! For things like lens-caps and accessories, it's great, but the stuff that is over priced is terribly over priced. Of course, I make less than $10K a year, no I'm not exactly their target market.</p>

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<p>I am my local camera store's best dream. I do research online for products I want to purchase (lenses, cameras, etc) then go into my local store to buy them. When I want something like a backpack, I need to try it on and play with it a little bit. Once I have found one I like in a local store, I buy it right there and then. I truly appreciate the service I get at my local stores (including repair services) and want to keep them in business.</p>

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