How much of an issue is Live View sensor heating, noise increase, dynamic range degradation?

The camera sensor is continuously operating during Live View, heating up the sensor, increasing sensor noise and degrading the dynamic range. How much of an issue is this in today's cameras and does it mean that the dynamic range measurements are only valid for a not-yet-warmed-up sensor?

For my own peace of mind, I'm going to say its not an issue at all, no effect.

What camera - what time frame - what ambient temperature during usage.

increasing sensor noise and degrading the dynamic range.

Attach sample or quantify.

does it mean that the dynamic range measurements are only valid for a not-yet-warmed-up sensor?

Probably not, but I doubt it would be possible to determine, ex. by lab test.

I would not know as I never use that feature.

Ya pays yer money and

Yer takes yer choice.

 

I have been shooting digital since 2004 and in that time I have used live view only a few times.

 

In the old days, I shot GAF 500 slide film, so I guess I'd just accept whatever noise is necessary to get the picture.

Perhaps there is an increase in noise, but you would have to look for it. Leica seems to think so, which is why they have no immediate plans to take the S system mirrorless. Personally I would take a little extra noise if it meant my camera was no bigger than it had to be. I love the S system on paper but I think I'd prefer the Fuji GFX system.

For long exposure, high ISO, nightscape imaging and astrophotography, noise due to sensor heating (referred to as dark current photon noise) is of concern, and it is usually recommended that mirror lockup rather than live view be used. See, Astrophotography and Exposure, Clarkvision.com

 

High-end astrophotography cameras typically have built-in thermoelectric coolers to reduce sensor temperature.

What camera - what time frame - what ambient temperature during usage

 

I'm looking at mirrorless in general, don't have a specific brand or model in mind. I'd say at least one hour of use, or more. Temperature range as to be expect for a digital camera; Alaska in the winter through Death Valley in the summer.

 

Attach sample or quantify.

 

Don't have samples or data; that's why I posted here.

 

Probably not, but I doubt it would be possible to determine, ex. by lab test.

 

"Probably" isn't very specific now, is it? Yes, lab tests would be great! Dynamic range specs are the result of lab tests, so it would be nice to know how the dynamic range changes as a function of how long Live View has been on and also how it changes over ambient temperature.

 

Certain camera manufacturers, including Canon and Nikon, warn the user of image quality degradation when Live View is used for more than a short period. From the net: "I have also read that Nikon do not like live view to be used for more than 9 minutes."

Edited March 28, 2019 by frans_waterlander

Here is a comparison of images shot with a Canon 5D2 to see what happens during very long exposures, between 5 and 60 minutes, at, Photo Cornucopia. These tests also look at what happens when Live View is used and how this affects sensor noise.

 

It appears in these tests that Live View contributes to long exposure sensor noise quite significantly.

Here is a comparison of images shot with a Canon 5D2 to see what happens during very long exposures, between 5 and 60 minutes, at, Photo Cornucopia. These tests also look at what happens when Live View is used and how this affects sensor noise.

 

It appears in these tests that Live View contributes to long exposure sensor noise quite significantly.

 

This is an interesting survey. I think, the tests suggest that the sensor heat from using live view comes not from the sensor itself, but from the other electronics in the camera such as the LCD screen and the battery. The heat problem is even more manifest in many digital cameras when shooting high res video like 4K for a long time. It affects even more than using live view I think.

"Probably" isn't very specific

Nor was anything in your post. :D

Some real world experience-not so much with live view but with long exposures-

 

I've done several 30 second exposures with my D800. It's CAPABLE of longer, but I never seem to have a cable release with me when it would be useful.

 

In any case, at 30 seconds, I generally will a few "hot" pixels. The last one I printed, I think I had four in the image-they were visible because it was a night scene(hence the long exposure) with a lot of contrast. I cloned them out, but mostly because they would have been noticeable(at least to me) in the 20x24 I printed from that file.

 

That image also involved me bringing up the shadows quite a bit-I'd guess 5-6 stops in some areas(BTW, I also lost some highlights in the image, but set it per ETTR for the highlights that I thought I could keep and wanted to keep). The shadows I brought up were a bit more noisy that I'd have liked, but weren't terrible and of course some noise is expected when bringing up shadows that much in post.

 

I suspect that the hot pixels I mentioned in this particular image wouldn't have been noticeable in a normal daylight image.

 

I wouldn't be overly concerned about it-after all in the real world I've seen some amazing prints from the Sony A7R, which at least is about the same age as the D800 and has a sensor with the same resolution as the Sony-made sensor in the D800.

I think its normal for the sensor to heat up for a long period of use and you may also consider the temperature of the environment. But the increase in the sensor's noise would be alarming. It might be a mechanical fault which may lead to a more serious problem if you overuse your camera. I think you should rest your camera for a while to cool down. You can still do it in not-so-warmed-up sensor though.

Live view can't be active during the exposure, even a long exposure. If you see an image, it is from memory, not the sensor itself. The display can contribute heat, because it consumes a lot of current. There should be an option to remain dark during the exposure, or time out normally.

 

When I shoot video, which uses the sensor, rear finder and memory simultanously for the duration, most of the heat seems to come from data processing and storage. If I store internally, the camera gets noticeably warm. However if I store externally, it is barely warm to the touch after 2 hours or more. The battery gets warm too, but lasts about 2.5 hours, compared to about half that when saving video internally.

 

For long exposures, 10 seconds or more, you get better results if you turn long exposure NR off, and correct it with one or more "dark" frames, taken subsequently with the lens cap on, for the same time and ambient temperature. If you're concerned about noise, then a dark frame consists of nothing else.