holgaroid not working: HELP!

Hello. I have an Holgaroid (Holga 120 SF). I taped in the batteries

and tested the camera, but it does not hum and a ready lamp does not

appear as it is explained in the manual. Does this mean the camera

does not work or do i actually have to load film in it? Will it work

once it has film? I actually tried out the polaroid back without the

batteries, but the polaroid came out blank. Again, is there maybe

something wrong with the film, did i load it incorrectly, i believe i

followed instructions correctly. Anyway, after reading the

instructions over and even doing some research online (which did not

help) I took another picture, (with the batteries in place this

time), but the polaroid was blank again. Am I doing something wrong?

Is the camera defective? Can you tell me why it's not working? Thank

you. I really appreciate it.

Melissa,

 

Well, the first thing that I would check would be the batteries. Make sure they have a good charge left in them and that they are seated correctly in the camera and sucure on the contacts. Mine have a habit of slipping out from time to time. If both of those things are in order then the flash indicator light on the back of the camera should come on when you flip the switch and you should hear it charge briefly.

 

Most of the Holgaroid films are pretty slow. If you are making test exposures, make sure you have pretty good light. Are the prints completely black? How much development time are you giving them and at what temperature? Are you removing the dark slide before exposure?

 

Michael D. D'Avignon

Step 1: forget the batteries for right now.

 

Step 2: Take the camera with the polaroid back out into the bright sun. Take off the lens cap.

 

Step 3: Remove the dark slide from the polaroid back. This is the silver metal thing.

 

Step 4: Take a picture.

 

Step 5: Pull the film per Polaroid's instructions. Let the film develop per the temp/time combo on the back of the film pack.

 

Step 6: Peel the film apart and see if an image develops.

 

Step 7: Report back.

Er, sorry developed not develops.

Also, do make sure to review the instructions from Polaroid in this pdf:

 

http://www.polaroid.com/service/userguides/photographic/holga_holder_ug.pdf

 

The photos in the instructions are not that detailed, but the text does provide the steps you need.

Hello RON. I have some questions first before i take the picture.

 

Step 1: forget the batteries for right now. IT'S POSSIBLE TO USE THE HOLGAROID WITHOUT BATTERIES?

 

Step 2: Take the camera with the polaroid back out into the bright sun. Take off the lens cap. BY LENS CAP, DO YOU MEAN THE DARK LENS CAP OR THE CLEAR "ATTACHED LENS" THAT IS REFERRED TO IN THE MANUAL IN STEP 1? DO I LEAVE THAT ONE ON DURING MY SHOOTING?

 

Step 3: Remove the dark slide from the polaroid back. This is the silver metal thing. I HAVE TYPE 88 FILM. THIS IS MY FIRST TIME EVER USING THIS KIND OF FILM AND I DON'T KNOW IF THEY ARE ALL DIFFERENT OR THE SAME. WHAT DO YOU MEAN BY REMOVE THE DARK SLIDE FROM THE POLAROID BACK? HOW DO I DO THAT. THERE IS NO SILVER METAL THING.

 

LET ME TELL YOU WHAT I SEE: THERE IS THIS WHITE TAB WITH RED LETTERS THAT SAY POLACOLOR ON IT. IN THE MANUAL IT SAYS THAT BEFORE TAKING THE PHOTOGRAPH, THAT I SHOULD PULL OUT THE LIGHTPROOF PAPER. I DID THAT ONLY AT THE VERY BEGGINING OF THE ENTIRE ROLL OF FILM. IS THAT RIGHT? THAT WAS THE LAST STEP IN STEP 2. I REALLY DON'T UNDERSTAND WHAT STEP 3 IS. I JUST THOUGHT THEY WERE REPEATING THEMSELVES.

 

THIS IS WHAT I DID: I TOOK THE PICTURE. I PULLED OUT THE LITTLE WHITE TAB THAT SAYS POLACOLOR ON IT. (I DONT EVEN SEE NUMBERS PRINTED ON IT. WELL, IT IS VERY FAINT AND HARD TO SEE. IS IT SUPPOSED TO BE THAT WAY? THE FILM HAS NOT YET EXPIRED BY THE WAY. ANYWAY, AFTER THAT, I PULLED THE LEADER TAB AND LET IT DRY. MAYBE I DIDN'T LEAVE IT LONG ENOUGH TO DEVELOP BEFORE I PEELED IT? DO YOU THINK THAT COULD BE IT? MAYBE I DID SOMETHING WRONG ALONG IN STEP 3?

 

I REALLY APPRECIATE ALL OF YOUR HELP. THANKS A LOT.

First: Turn off the caps lock. It makes reading your response very difficult and is the internet equivalent of shouting.

 

Now, to each of your points:

 

1) The Holga uses the batteries for the flash. It has nothing to do with the polaroid film or the polarid back.

 

2) A lens cap is a thin piece of plastic that covers a lens. It is almost always black. In order to let light strike the film, you need to take the /lens cap/ off the camera. The additional lens that came with the Holgaroid is called a diopter. This needs to be on your Holga when using the Polaroid back because the film is further away from the lens than when the Holga is using 120 film.

 

3) Per the PDF instructions, you did the right thing by pulling the dark gray/black lightproof paper out after loading the film pack. If you look closely at Step 3 in the instructions, you will see that it's not the same thing. The light proof paper clearly does not have a metal handle attached to it. The formatting in the PDF is off but if you read the text it gives you the correct instructions. What I call the dark slide, the instructions call "the screen." You have one, it has a metal handle.

 

4) Type 88 film is an ISO 80 film, which, when coupled with a camera with an aperture of f/11 and a shutter speed of 1/100, might be too slow for anything but very bright days. If you look on the back of the box that the film came in, it gives you development times and tempertures. These times are for /after/ you pull the film out of the camera. The rollers in the Polaroid back spread the chemicals over the film that enable the processing. Just taking a photo doesn't start the processing, you need to pull the film out and let it sit for the time and temp indicated on the back of the box. According to your description, you seem to be doing this fine, but please re-read step 4 in the instruction manual to make sure.

 

I'm willing to bet good money that you are simply not pulling the dark slide out. Many first time polaroid shooters fail to do this.

You're right. step 3 is not the same thing. alright so i think i found this dark slide you are talking about, but it has no metal handle. i think it's all plastic. anyway, but just to be sure....i'm supposed to take out this dark slide right before i take a picture right?

I suppose it could be plastic, because all it's doing is blocking the light from striking the film. But I've only ever seen dark slides that are metal. Did you buy this polaroid back new or used?

 

If you don't remove the dark slide then light can't get to the film. With the dark slide in the polaroid back, you can take the back off your Holga and see the hole it's covering up.

 

 

If you don't have any film in there right now though, I would invite you to remove the back from the Holga and look at it. Look at where the light goes to reach the film, open it up and see what each of the parts are in both the Holga and the Polaroid back. I believe, because you're not familiar enough with the hardware, you're making the process more diffcult than it actually is. Take a few minutes to "get to know" any new hardware you buy.

 

Best of luck and enjoy shooting with the Holgaroid. I look forward to seeing some of your images on photo.net

alright, so i don't really know what i did. i have just been taking picture after picture trying different things and setting them aside not really knowing what it was i did. stupid i know. but now, i've finally got an image. and i think it might be the one where i removed that dark slide. i'm going to try it again right now. just to make sure.

 

also, a question about the batteries: mine came with triple A panasonic alkaline plus. i was wondering, can they be any triple A batteries, or only a certain kind. are they all the same? which brand works better? i don't understand why in one manual it says to use two 1.5 V AA penlite batteries. i'm assuming that must be for a different model of the holga? mine which is a 120 SF does use triple A, right? just making sure. Thanks again.

No, Melissa, the Holga 120SF does not take AAA sized batteries. The manual is completely correct. You need AA sized batteries. Which brands you use are completely up to you.

 

Given that so far you've told me that

 

1) Your dark slide is made of plastic and

 

2) it was shipped with the wrong size batteries,

 

I'm guessing you purchased this polaroid back used. You probably also do not have the 6x6 mask for the Holga that holds the batteries in. That's not important though because tape is a better solution anyway.

Oh man, well, I've done it now.

 

Melissa, I'm sorry. The newly released 120CFN is what takes the AA batteries. The 120SF takes AAA sized batteries. I'm sorry for the wrong information in the previous post.

Nicely done Rob! I see a career in tech support in your future! Glad you finally got an image Melissa. Have fun!

 

Your Holga requires batteries for flash functions only. Any AA batteries should do the trick.

Rob,

 

I think you were correct. To my knowledge, the 120 SF does take AA batteries.

<< I think you were correct. To my knowledge, the 120 SF does take AA batteries. >>

 

Yup, this is where my career in tech support takes a turn for the worse. The original (way-back) Polaroid instructions are wrong. I second-guessed myself after reading them, which I shouldn't have done. Everything else I've found on the web since my last post points to AA not AAA batteries.

 

Thanks for the confirmation.

i tried AA batteries and the camera works now! i don't understand why they would send me triple A ones. anyway, thanks guys for all your help. i really appreciate it. can't wait to take pictures now.

Don't get your hopes up just yet...The diopter that came with your camara reduces the "speed" of your lens by at least 2 stops (maybe more?).

 

Since the original lens was an optomistic f8.0 in the stock configuration...and since your typical Polaroid emulsion is ISO 80/100 your exposure value is probably correct only for bright snow/beach scenes. Most of your images will turn out in various shades of black. Even bright sun was at least a full stop under by my estimations.

 

So you have two options: first shoot the high-speed B&W emulsion (I forget the number) or second, take the back off and remove the lens (a couple of small screws to get the lens box off and then one more that allows you unscrew the lens). Once you've got it off, you want to gently pry out the little black plastic ring on the back side of the lens. Now put it all back together.

 

This will effectively change your lens from f8.0 to f5.6. Now you have a slight chance of getting an image (in bright sun) exposed properly.

 

good luck,

And Rob, the "dark slide" on my Holgaroid is also all plastic.

<< The diopter that came with your camara reduces the "speed" of your lens by at least 2 stops (maybe more?). >>

 

Can you provide confirmation of this? The default aperture for the Holga is around f/11. I have a modified Holga from Holgamods.com that provides f/8 and f/11. I've not had any problems shooting ISO 100 Type-80 film in bright sun.

 

<< And Rob, the "dark slide" on my Holgaroid is also all plastic. >>

 

I've only recently seen one other Polaroid back with a plastic dark slide. This was on an ebay sale in the UK. That back didn't have a tripod mount whereas all the ones I've seen with metal dark slides have a tripod mount. I don't see anything on the Polaroid website about a difference (aside from the full frame vs non-full-frame backs), so I'm not sure what to say.

"The diopter that came with your camara reduces the "speed" of your lens by at least 2 stops (maybe more?)."

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<I>"Can you provide confirmation of this?"</I>

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Actually no I can't, at least not in the form of a lens measurement. I did take it to a local camera store asked but they weren't set up to mount such and odd "lens". They did however, measure the shutter speed for me: resonably consistant at 1/70 second.

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My highly subjective opinion is based on the old shine-a-flashlight-through-another-lens test and compare. I did that and then stopped it down until they appeared to pass the same light. That worked out to around f2.0.

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<I>The default aperture for the Holga is around f/11.</I>

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Lord knows all these cameras are different, but all three of them that I own came with nothing mounted in the little opening in the sunny/cloudy lever that is supposed to provide different apertures settings. In other words, when you positioned the slider to the sunny setting and the arm swings in front of the shutter opening the hole in the arm was larger than the hole in the shutter. So there was no effective change in aperture. I also made the assumption that the f8.0 printed on the lens was what the film "saw". Maybe the shutter opening stops it down as well? Not sure.

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"And Rob, the "dark slide" on my Holgaroid is also all plastic."

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<I>I've only recently seen one other Polaroid back with a plastic dark slide. This was on an ebay sale in the UK. That back didn't have a tripod mount whereas all the ones I've seen with metal dark slides have a tripod mount.</I>

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Hmm, mine has a tripod mount, so I'm not sure what to say either.

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I'm going to go out on a limb here and respectfully suggest that maybe reason that you're successful shooting with ISO 100 speed print film and I'm not with ISO 125 Polaroid film is because of the exposure lattitude of the print film? From what I've read Polaroid emulsions are closer to slide film then print film. But then again it could entirely be based on differences in our cameras...toys that they are.

<< m going to go out on a limb here and respectfully suggest that maybe reason that you're successful shooting with ISO 100 speed print film and I'm not with ISO 125 Polaroid film is because of the exposure lattitude of the print film? >>

 

I'm not using print film. I'm using Type 80 Polaroid peel-apart film. Type 84 for B&W and Type 89 for Color. Both have an ISO rating of 100. I'm not aware of any Type 80 film made by Polaroid that has an ISO value of 125.

 

I suspect your back is not actually made by Polaroid.

Sorry, that should have been "I suspect your back was not made by Polaroid for the US market" (i.e. it could have been made for the European or Asian markets).

<I>"I'm not aware of any Type 80 film made by Polaroid that has an ISO value of 125"</I>

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Yes, of course it is ISO 100, I was typing from memory...

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<I>"I suspect your back was not made by Polaroid for the US market" (i.e. it could have been made for the European or Asian markets).</I>

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How would this matter? Is there a difference between the backs?

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This is all very confusing, because, if you and I both are shooting Polroid films then I'm at a loss to explain why I've had difficulty getting reasonable images. Maybe old stock film?

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Truthfully I haven't picked the camera up in a month so maybe I should order some new film and give it another go around.

<< Is there a difference between the backs? >>

 

I own two Polaroid backs for the Holga. The first one I purchased was the original, or non-full-frame back. The image size is about 3/4 the size of the image area available on Type 80 films. I then purchased a Full Frame CB80 Polaroid back for the Holga.

 

The images I saw from the Ebay UK auction would indicate that, there might be a non-CB80 Polaroid back that either has been modified to fit the Holga or is actually a third version without a tripod mount and with a plastic dark slide.

 

And now, of course, you have indicated one with a tripod mount and a plastic dark slide.

 

I don't believe my diopter lenses (for I have two from having two backs) cause any significant light loss. I have two shots of the same object shot from the same film pack 3 minutes apart just past noon using my holga from holgamods.com. The "cloudy" setting (f/8) produced an over-exposed image and the "sunny" setting (f/11) produced a properly exposed image. If there really was up to two stops of light loss from the diopter then the "cloudy" setting should have produced a properly exposed image.

 

So, I would conclude that either:

 

1) your diopter lens is different than mine (which may be possible if Polaroid has produced more than two versions of the back)

 

2) your film was bad (also possible, but I don't know enough about peel apart film to know when a film pack is or is not bad)

 

3) some other voodoo that will shroud this in mystery forever.

 

Just to make sure I've spent way too much time thinking about this, :) , I emailed Polaroid tech support to see if they can shed any light on this subject.

 

I guess the bottom line for me is this: I don't have any problems using my holga+diopter with my polaroid back in clear to mostly-cloudy skies between 10am and 2pm (which is when 90% of my shots are taken). It behaves just like I would expect it to behave with ISO 100 film.

Wow Rob, you certainly are a wealth of knowlege when it comes to these things, your comments are much appreciated.

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<I>...non-full-frame back. The image size is about 3/4 the size of the image area available on Type 80 films."</I>

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Mine is definitely a full-frame back (just so you know what I have).

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<I>I have two shots of the same object shot from the same film pack 3 minutes apart..."</I>

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I'm not sure why it never occured to me to just shoot two images, one with the diopter mounted on the lens and one with it off. There will be a focus issue, as you point out, but I should be able to see if there is an exposure difference. And that would be an indicator of the quality of the diopter. Good suggestion.

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<I>"I guess the bottom line for me is this: I don't have any problems using my holga+diopter with my polaroid back in clear to mostly-cloudy skies between 10am and 2pm..."</I>

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I'm encouraged to hear this because it may be something entirely related to the points you mentioned and therefore correctable.

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Thanks again for all the information. I'll try some new film and do a few experiments tomorrow and report back.