matthew_stanton2 Posted July 4, 2003 Share Posted July 4, 2003 Gordon Hutchings claims that using high developing temperatures actually inhibits grain aggregation because the film spends less time in the developer. When on the odd occasion I have used tmax developer @ 24 (1:4) to process Tri-x I have found that the grain is remarkably fine, finer than d-76 stock @ 20 degrees. So I guess I am curious if this theory is consistent across the board or only applies to certain developers with certain constituents. I get the impression that MQ developers should not be used much above 20 degrees because the hydroquinone becomes disproportionately active. Experience Anyone? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m0002a Posted July 4, 2003 Share Posted July 4, 2003 That theory may work with modern emulsions such as Kodak TMAX and Ilford Delta Grain films. Maybe also with the new Tri-X. But older emulsions don't like higher temps (but there are fewer of these emulsions every day). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
igor_johanson Posted July 4, 2003 Share Posted July 4, 2003 1) What are �higher T�? few degrees above common 20 C is not a problem, otherwise it would be pointed out by the manufacturer. 2) Is Gordon Hutchings a chemist experienced in chemical kinetics? If not, than such a claim may better fit in gourmet cooking. 3) It is not a �theory�, it is a MYTH. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
conrad_hoffman Posted July 4, 2003 Share Posted July 4, 2003 Can't tell myth from legend, but way back when I used T-Max developer I didn't like it much. Then I noticed that the recommended process was the bold numbers in the chart, and those were for a higher temperature! I tried processing at the recommended temp and seemed to get better results. Can't remember if the grain pattern was more pleasing or what, but I have to assume Kodak made the primary process recommendation something other than 68F for a reason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
triblett_lungre_thurd Posted July 4, 2003 Share Posted July 4, 2003 i'd like to tout matthew's stumblings, tri-x and tmax rs is a fine combo when you get it down. real creamery gravery grain but retains lovely tonal seperations... none of that hard-edged vietnam-era dee-seventiesixy docu-golfball grain at all and not nearly as picky as 400 tcrap. try it you'll like it, me p.s. i don't know what 'disproportionately hydroquiwhatsit' means though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
john_hicks___ Posted July 5, 2003 Share Posted July 5, 2003 Dr. Richard Henry tested exactly this; he found that (for the films and developer tested) the finest grain was obtained at around 70F-72F and that colder or hotter increased graininess. See his _Controls in Black and White Photography_ for all the details. That's the only test of such things I'm aware that was done using any semblance of scientific method. I'm sure there were others published in the past but I have no idea of titles or authors. I don't know what Hutchings considers to be "high"; if it's say 72F compared to 68F then he and Henry are in agreement while if he's referring to 75F+ then Henry's results contradict him. The assertion that less time in a developer inhibits graininess is, so far as I know, unsupported by any experimental results. New films are hardened in manufacturing, so they won't suffer the defects that occured with old films in high-temperature processing. Maybe that's what Hutching was referring to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evan_parker Posted July 5, 2003 Share Posted July 5, 2003 Isn't TMAX a hydroquinone developer anyways? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matthew_stanton2 Posted July 5, 2003 Author Share Posted July 5, 2003 Yes I think it is actually Phenidone/hydroquinone now that you mention it, hmmm. Tribblet, to clarify, I meant that perhaps the superadditive effect between Metol and Hydroquinone becomes imbalanced at higher temperatures. I believe this is due to hydroquinone exhibiting a greater reaction to increased temperature than metol does. But I may well be wrong. So I assume that the unexpected difference I found between these results is more to do with developer and not temperature. I would have expected tmax to be noticably grainier at the same contrast index..... not so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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