Canon 5D

Hi,

 

First I just want to say that I'm not trying to create a fight or generate

discontent, but merely asking for opinion.

 

I'm trying to decide between the 5D and D200. I've handled both in the store and

was really impressed by the viewfinder of the 5D, but I found the controls on

the D200 to be more logical, of course I could live with that since the Full

Frame is very attractive.

 

I'm a Photograpy student at University and I do mostly photojournalism and

fashion/commercial work.

 

Until now I was shooting film with my Rolleiflex Automat and my Nikon F3 with

28,50 and 135mm lens.

 

I want to move to digital and I'm trying to cut down on the differences and

would like to hear your opinions about it.

 

Thanks,

 

Radu D.

Radu,

 

No fight here. I own a D200 and a 20D. As I have said many times I like the body of the D200 and the sensor of the 20D. The primary reason for going with the D200 was to use my pre-existing Nikkor glass (along with a very good copy of the 17-35mm 2.8). If I did not have a lot of Nikkor glass, I think the 5D would be the clear choice. If you have the budget go with the 5D.

Hi Michael,

 

How do you like your D200 compared to the 20D, do you mind the viewfinder? For me that was the biggest disapointment when compared to the 5D (talking about the D200).

 

As I have no Autofocus glass in Nikon, I'm still trying to decide.

 

Thanks.

 

Radu

I own the 5D and love it so my vote is the Canon <BR><br>

 

Now since you mentioned the planed uses here is how the 5D can work for you there:<br><br>

 

- Photojournalism: The Full frame will allow you to use the PJs most loved focal lenses 28mm, 35mm and 50mm at their intended crop size.<br><br>

 

- Fashion/Commercial work. The higher sensor and pixel count of the 5D gives you an advantage on image quality which is very important on this type of work (is so important the 5D may be the very lowest you can use). <br><br>

 

Now this of course is my personal opinion, and a bias one as I own this camera, so please take it as such.<br><br>

 

You may want to look at this article for a better comparison

<a href="http://www.photo.net/equipment/canon/20D_vs_30D_vs_5D_vs_D200">20D_vs_30D_vs_5D_vs_D200</a>

I just pulled them both out to see what you are talking about. I guess I don't feel that there is really that much difference between the two. In addition, both the D200 and 20D will take a Katz eye screen - to aid with manual focusing. I suspect that coming from the film world you are concerned about the view finder because quite frankly that is lacking in the digital world. Don't worry you'll soon forget about it, and that comes from someone who wears glasses.

 

To exemplify what I'm talking about with the 20D sensor, take a look at the following picts. You won't get this type of clarity - f4 iso 800 - with a D200.<div></div>

Crop....<div></div>

Actually those are different pictures, shot one after the other, but I'm sure you get the idea.

Michael, Looks like the eye of Sauron.

Radu,

 

Like you mentioned, I had the pleasure of using both and I liked the logical placement of the D200's controls. However, I did like the full frame and viewfinder of the 5D and just ordered one. Right now, I have a 20D that I love and since I've been a Canon user since the 1970's, I stuck with Canon although when I was shopping for the first Digital rebel and D70, I kept an open mind.

Radu,

 

This issue has been discussed many times, as you'll find many discussions via a search.

 

But now that I find myself responding, I want to impress upon you the number one prime directive: Image Quality.

 

And if you agree, your answer is really simple: Canon 5D.

 

The 5D offers less noise, a bit more resolution for a given composition, and a tad wider dynamic range, but now I'm splitting hairs.

 

The better 200D body will do NOTHING to improve image quality.

 

It sounds like you don't have much invested in glass from either company, so it seems you'll not be swayed by glass-investment. Lucky you...nothing worse then having mega-bucks in Nikon/Olympus/Sony glass and wanting to switch to the better Canon bodies.

 

Try not to get fixated on ergonomics, nor in how the bodies feel in your hands....these issues are important, but IMHO hand-feeling should carry much less decision-weight then Image Quality.

 

The images of the 5D are sharper out of the camera then provided by the D200 because the 5D's anti-alias filter is not as aggressive. The 5D provides noticably cleaner images at ISO 400 and up.

 

The 5D is better in low light, as it's images will often be cleaner.

 

And then of course, there's full-frame. Nikon does not provide this at any price.

 

IMHO full frame bodies are the long term keepers; the crop bodies are transitional, of course this is my subjective opinions.

<P>I find the user interface of the 5D intuitive and more logical to use than Nikon bodies.

However, I probably just got used to it after 15 years of mainly Canon bodies. Perhaps you

can use your AIS/AI Nikkors on the D200? It may sweeten the deal in the direction of

Nikon.</P><P><B><A HREF="http://emedia.leeward.hawaii.edu/frary/

canon_eos5d_01.htm" TARGET="_blank">My EOS 5D review</B></A></P>

i've owned and used both cameras so at least i can offer some hands-on experiences between the two. </p>

 

first of all, all you ever needed to know between the cameras can be found at <a href="http://www.digitalcamerainfo.com/content/Nikon-D200-vs-Canon-EOS-5D-Head-to-Head-Review-.htm">hands-on review</a> </p>

 

Regardless if every pro I know, pros SI PJ's to studio shooters use Canon, I'm a big fan of Nikon's philosophy of camera design, everything will so intuitive, well thought through, ergonomically perfected etc. It sometimes makes me wonder if the engineers that design Canon's camera actually ever used the camera in the field?! (just take the example of the position of the on/off switch between the two brands - come on, Canon...) </p>

 

I can go on and on about things I like about Nikon, but at the end of the day it is the FILE/IMAGE THAT COUNTS. It is in that department that Canon, and in particular the 5D, brings home the bacon. It all goes back to the fact that Canon is the only DSLR manufacturer that produces all the components of the product, including the imperative sensor. Ergo, it not held-back by another companies objectives and goals where Nikon is fully dependant upon what Sony and other sensor manufacturers wants them to do. This fact has led to that a) Canon is able to shorten development cycles and b) be the only vendor to produce and keep a full frame sensored camera in the line up. </p>

 

So, as much as I respect and adore Nikon, their heritage, design philosphoy, and their glass, at this point in the race, Canon is the way to go and the 5D produces one of the best files on the market, bar none (other than that and the VF, I personally don't find the camera body/design much to celebrate, it actually feals darn right cheap compared to a Nikon D200). </p>

 

Having said all of this, with more than a little sadness, I sold my D200 after three months of use and bought a Canon 5D about a month ago. Again, the reward is in the files, they are thoroughly impressive and wonderful to work with.

I had a D200 from late January to late March. It was an excellent body, but the poor high ISO noise performance and the fact that the 5D will full frame sensor was only a few hundred $ more made me switch to Canon.

 

Like the above poster said, at the end of the day it is image quality that matters, not bells and whistles and a pro body that will still be in great shape long after the camera is obsolete.

 

Nikon is expected to introduce a full-frame camera by January of 2007, but don't hold your breath, and there is no word on pricing.

 

In the meantime, I am using my Nikon pre-AI and AIS lenses with the F-mount to EOS adapter on the full-frame 5D without a hitch. The only difference between the D200 and 5D when using manual lenses is that the D200 only accepts Nikon AI and AIS, and will note the aperture and focal length in the exif data. The 5D will work with any Nikon SLR lens, pre-ai or otherwise, along with Leica R, some Pentax, Zeiss and Olympus manual-focus glass.

 

Get the 5D today and you won't regret it.

Thank you very much for your answers.

 

I know that at the end of the day, it's image quality that counts, so Canon is the definite winner.

 

Did all of you know that they have 500CAD rebate on the body if you buy a lens or any other accessory with the body (probably 300US over there).

 

Thanks again,

 

Radu D.

You are comming from a world where you take your film seriously it sounds like. So anything less than the 5D would be a mistake and a dissapointment. Full frame sensor, film like viewfinder, incredible imager with little noise. The noise on the D200 is, in my opinion, unacceptable at ISO 800 and up when compared to ANY Canon DSLR.

 

As I have tried it out, the viewfinder on the 5D IS impressive, I love it. In fact I think it was more comfortable to work with than <sigh> my EOS 3. I wish I could afford the 5D, but I had to go with the 30D which is a great camera too!

 

Personally, I do not like the Nikon system because the equipment's ergonomics feel weird to me, then again I have always owned Canon equipment. Each of us come from our respective camps, the Canon camp, and the Nikon camp.

 

Ultimately, both systems will produce great results, you can't make a wrong decision, really.

 

Good luck and enjoy whichever one you choose.

"Try not to get fixated on ergonomics, nor in how the bodies feel in your hands....these issues are important, but IMHO hand-feeling should carry much less decision-weight then Image Quality."

 

In my experience, this is not true. Ergonomics are EVERYTHING. The camera is a tool, your tool, an extension of your mind and creative expression. If you cannot get it to do what you want it to do quickly and precisely then the work suffers, end of discussion.

 

Image quality is just as important but never less important than a comfortable camera. Canon owns the ergonomics department, IMO.

Having just moved up from a 350D to the 5D, I can safely say that the controls are incredibly intuitive to use, setting ISO, drive mode, aperture, shutter speed, EC, FEC, etc is simple in the extreme and can be done without even taking your eye from the VF.

 

One thing I like about the 5D a lot is the Custom © mode, I have mirror lockup enabled in this mode so that I can quickly switch MLU on without having to hit the menus - C mode is a very nice touch.

I'd have to side with the people who are emphasising ergonomics. Really any of the cameras mentioned can take good quality images in most situations, but differences in ergonomics can decide if you actually manage to have all the desired settigns set when you press the shutter button. Otherwise you have a great quality image of something totally wrong.

 

I used to use nikon cameras before getting int 1D series canons and was flabbergasted how bad the canon's UI was in comparison. You can operate a F5 / F100 with one hand, from power on to power off, apart from the AF-S AF-C switch which is on the front of the camera, where your left hand is anyway. It is just not possible to do that with a 1D camera. And the rear command dial - so bad that they need a switch to turn it off. But it doesn't always turn it off. Arg!

 

Having said all that, with practice & time you learn to mitigate the flaws in a particular camera, but sometimes I really wonder what the people designing these things were thinking.

do you shoot with flash? get nikon. if not, canon is better in every other aspect. imho...

Why is it beneficial to operate the entire camera with one hand? Most of us have two hands.

Peter, it makes one wonder what he wants his free hand for....lol

 

To those that say ergonomics is as important as image quality....well, I think that is pure and silly rubbish at best. You forget the whole point of the camera...TO TAKE QUALITY IMAGES...NOT to prevent your fingers from being a little uncomfy. I think you have lost the point....lost the prime directive....it is NOT to be comfortable, IT IS TO TAKE QUALITY PICTURES.

 

Like Hillary might've said: "It's the picture, stupid"!

 

Even if one decides that the ergos on the Nikon are better, they are NOT a lot better, to the point that would force one to not go with Canon....this is splitting hairs....you and I both know that regardless of the user interface, one can adapt and get 2nd nature with the controls of any camera...it's about conditioning.

 

And why are some of you propagating this lie about Canon flash being inferior to Nikon's? This is more rubbish.

 

If you take flash pictures, get the Canon for sure...I have too many flash images that have came out excellent to believe this Nikon/Canon flash rubbish.

The Canon 1 series are BETTER then Nikon's UI because with the Canon, it takes TWO hands to change most controls....preventing accidental changes to controls.

 

One-handed changes to controls is a liability, not a feature.

Hi,

 

Thank you all once again for the helpfull comments. I'm still trying to decide if as a Student, I'm ready to shed 5000CAD for the 5D package(with a lens).

 

It's hard because I like to shoot film so much, but clients are not ready to wait "that" long for film. For my personal projects I still shoot film, especially Tri-X in my Rolleiflex and make huge prints with those, (I love grainy images, but I've also come to love to smoothness of digital). Anyway, thanks again that was very helpful.

 

Regards,

 

Radu D.

 

by the way, you can see my only picture on the web here: http://paquinphoto.com/44.html

 

Thanks.

I can't believe I read this entire thread,....

Analogies aside, I can certainly identify with that fact the 5D is 3.5 times the cost a 30D.,,,, but it is used for diferent purposes. The 5D can have light fall-off in specific situations with specific lenses. If I use the 5D 90% of the time in situations in which it is prone to light fall-off then it's probably the wrong camera to use, or I LIKE the fall-off. Assuming of course this was know PRIOR to purchaisng the camera. If however the most important criterion for me is file latitude, resolution, depth and size, then it is the right camera. This is why I love photo.net