Best Russian LTM wide angle lens?

I have my FED2 with 50mm f3.5 fake Elmar working fine. Now I'm ready

to get other lenses. Have read old threads and have decided to get

Jupiter-9 f2 85mm, but am not sure which Russian wide angle is best.

Read that Jupiter-5 35mm f2.8 has a rear element design problem.

Is this true? Is there another wide angle Jupiter that anyone

can recommend?

 

BTW, I'm planning to get a Jupiter-8 50/f2 or Jupiter-3 50/1.5 to

replace the "Elmar." Preferences, anyone?

 

Thanks as always for any suggestions or recommendations.

Here I have two 50mm F3.5 Russian lens. Both at F3.5 are better than the 50mm F2 and 1.5 Russian lenses I own; at the same F3.5 setting. I have about six 50mm F2's; three 50mm F1.5's; and a couple of 50mm F2.8's in Russian stuff. Maybe I just got a good batch of 50mm F3.5's. A couple of my 50mm F1.5's are off in focus ; most of my F2's are on; one is way the heck off. With Russian stuff it is the "roll of the dice" matter. The BEST Russian lenses that focus great came from Russia; or the Ukraine. All of my duds one of my Russian "duds" came from USA sellers. I am in the USA too. Dont be fooled by the security of buying ffom a USA seller. Many buy their stuff from Russia/Ukraine; and sell their junk/duds to their fellow Americans. <BR><BR>In Jupiter-9's; 85mm F2; My good one came from Russia; and a bad one too. The other dud was from an American. These lenses have a bad reputation of focus problems; that cannot be corrected.<BR><BR>I would not sell your 50mm F3.5; if it works well.

absoluetly no question -- the 20mm f5.6 russar is absoluetly

superb. as good as the old 21 2.8 non-asph. highly rectilinear,

very sharp. and flat as a pancake. a stellar lens. and you can

use filters!!

I agree with Roger although i have had great experience with the jupiter 12 35mm lens, biogon copy. If you are going to consider the russar then you really should look into the voigtlander 21mm as it is even better and a whole stop faster and costs about the same. The jupiter 12 is about $40-50 and I have never had a bad preformer for this type, That being said try to get an older one as they seem to be better put together.Russar is $300-400 and the voigtlander can easily be had for the same and you get a new lens one which will constantly impress you. Cheers George

If you can find out, try a 28/6.

 

Frankly, the best Russian lenses and cameras are the Kiev Contax clones. And they are cheap.

Thanks to you both for comments and suggestions.

 

Kelly, are your 50 f2s all Industar-50s?

 

Roger, I couldn't find a 20mm f5.6 Russar on eBay. Do you know of any reliable source? What is current cost range of the 20 mm f5.6 Russar?

Lester; the 50mm F2 are all Jupiter-8's. The 50mm F1.5 are Jupiter-3's. The 50mm F3.5 are Industar-22's and 50's. The Industar? 61's are 55mm F2.8 The 28mm F6 is the Orion-15.

There is also an Industar-26m a 50mm F2.8 lens; these seem to be on alot of FED's

The Russar can go $400 w/finder and the 35/2.8 Jupiter 12 does have a big blob for a rear element but can be a problem only for those new-fangled metering cells - they work fine on a FED.

<p>The "rear element design problem" is that the rear element

protrudes, is very vulnerable in what would normally be minor accidents,

and won't fit any of various non-Soviet bodies. (The 28mm lens also

won't fit them. Perhaps the 20mm too; I forget. There are no other

wide-angle Soviet lenses.)</p><p>On top of what everybody else has

said, consider mechanical/ergonomic issues. The wide-angle Soviet

lenses have fiddly aperture adjustment in the front. Meanwhile, none of

the

50mm-plus lenses you're thinking of getting has aperture click-stops. The

aperture rings of these lenses often have insufficient friction. If you set

your otherwise excellent Jupiter lens to f8 and take half a dozen photos

before noticing that your elbow had somehow bumped it around to f16,

you may be rather unhappy. Meanwhile, the Industar 55/2.8 has a good

to excellent reputation, actually has click-stops, and more often than

not comes with <a

href="http://home.planet.nl/~ucklomp/fed5v/index.htm" title="Yes,

another FED.">an elaborate and fascinating rear cap</a>.</p>

Before I got my response up for Kelly and Roger, I was happy to see two more valuable responses. George, the Voigtlander and Russar are too expenses for my present(and future I'd guess)retiree's budget. I'll keep an eye out for the 28/f6--though I think it may be too slow.

 

Alex, after being a long time Leica rangefinder user, I switched to Canon FD SRLs,which I still have. In the 80s I returned to RF, but that time they were Nikons (oops!) I had two S2s with a battery of Nikkor lenses, but I sold them all, just like my Leica outfit. Buckets of tears, I shed. The sad thing is I can't replace either outfits with todays prices. That's what led me to Russian rangefinders with interchangeable lenses; those I can afford.

 

Alex, maybe rather than developing a FED2 outfit, I should use it with the 50 as back up and consider one of the Kiev models for an outfit. Which one do you recommed? Ditto for compatible normal, wide and short tele (80-90mm.)I'm familiar with the system from my S2 days. BTW, I had Minolta CLE with 3 lenses in late 80s for a year, but owner/photographer/friend begged for them back, and I reluctantly complied. I miss that outfit, too.

The Orion-15 28mm F6 works on my Bessa R with no interference; and even meters OK too. I have used this combo for about 3 years now. Many other sites say this combo doesn't work. There must be several mechanical variants of Orion-15's; or Bessa R's? or the sites are wrong in their info.

It was Crackers in a previous thread that gave the suggestion that got my FED 2 free of its frame skipping problem. Thanks again!

 

Peter, the click stops are an advantage and if the f stop moves due to lack of friction, it can be a big problem, as I get klutzier as I age. I can't remember if my old Nikkor LTM f2/85mm had click stops or not. I believe that, too, was fashioned after a the Zeiss f2 85mm Sonnar. Boy, was that ever sharp.

 

Kelly, if you are interested in selling one of your good Jupiter 50 f2s, please contact me at my email address. My Elmar 3.5 seems reasonable sharp, especially with Efke KB25, but setting f stop from front of lens slows me down--along with a zillion other things. I doubt I ever could do the type of street photography I enjoyed eons ago. The hand/eye coordination has slowed just enough to miss great shots. Guess landscapes and portraits will be my cup of tea, but I still try street work. When I compare hit percentage per roll today with yesteryear, it's discouraging. As the Italians would say, "Forza, forza!" No real equivalent in English, but something like: Have courage! Go for it! Keep trying! Don't give up!

Lester, you might look at www.fedka.com for some useful info and FSU camera gear shopping.<div></div>

Every day there are three or four LTM 35mm f2.8s in the camera shops here in Prague. Price is usually between 30 and 70$US. The 28mmf6 is possible but less common and usually around $3-400. The 20mm is about the same. Accessory viewfinders can be found but seem rarer than the lenses. So come to Prague and do some shopping.

 

A friend here said that many of the Russian lenses have been taken apart to be cleaned and/or have their innards re-blackened. Shiny metal innards mean strange light flares which a bit of black paint takes care of. Only problem is that lens elements are then put back into the body incorrectly, making focusing inconsistent and thus the reason the lens is in the shop for sale. So if you have one that isn't focusing correctly, a bit of futzing might be in order, if you are feeling brave. Maybe a shot or two of vodka first....

This is one of those threads that I could contribute to, but saw it too late and everyone else beat me to it. DANG IT! I like the J12 and Orion 15 best.

The 35mm f/2.8 Biogon copy is a great lens for the money and works fine on my LTM and M Leicas. It will be OK on your Fed 2. Don't forget that you'll need a finder too. The Russian finders are very, very nice, and usually pretty cheap.

 

The 28/6 Orion is good lens, but IMO has become too overpriced by collectors. The Voigtlander 28/3.5, with it's superior build quality, is a much better choice.

 

In the 24/25 area, you can't beat the Voigtlander 25/4, which shows up at around $200, with the finder.

 

I'd stay away from the Russar 20/5.6, as the quality can be pretty spotty. Why would you pay $400 for a quality crap-shoot when you can get the superb Voigtlander 21mm f/4.0, with the great finder for $325, maybe less used?

 

So in short, I think that the 35/2.8 is the only viable Russian lens, given the new line of Voigtlander lenses on the market.

 

Skip

Doug, thanks for links and photo. The J12 looks like a keeper. I've never used XP2 and that may be a great help while I'm away from home. I didn't bring any enlarger, not even my portable 35mm Durst Reporter Why? is OT. However I do have a Visioneer flat bed scanner, but it can't scan negatives or 35mm positive transparcies. When I have XP-2 processed in C-41, do any standard processors offer positive prints? If so, I could scan them and display some of my current shots with FED2. I've been souping all negs, but haven't made any b&w prints. I could contact print 35mm negs and blow up them with laptop's software.

 

Jon, I'd love to come to Prague again. Was there in mid 90s and found cheap and wonderful apartment that a single mom rented us for a week, just a stone's throw from famous Clock Tower square (Shucks! it was down for repairs.) BTW, wife's family grew up in Nova Lehota in Slovakia. Both countries have beautiful countrysides and cities are just as wonderful and quite photogenic.

 

Thanks for tip about blackening bare metal inside lens to avoid glare. Don't know about taking Vodka first, maybe all photos will produce images as I currently see everything in the central vision of my right eye. I have a hole in my macula that produces that effect 24/7. Fortunately, it's my left(good eye)that looks through viewer/rangefinder. Operation in May, should correct some of my OD's vision loss.

 

Henry, are the J12 and Orian 15 used on a FED or Kiev? And where did you buy them? I presume they use same formula for both mounts.

 

Thanks everyone. This is a great Leica forum and appreciate so many good responses to 'copies' of Leicas and Contax (Oops, there goes the "Z" word, again)

Skip, thanks for info. How good are the Russian turret finders? It would save me time changing finders. Never owned one, instead I used those wonderful brightline Leica finders; they were a joy. I preferred one for normal lens even when my eyesight was 20/20. Never had any M series Leicas, but did have a IIIG with 50mm Summicron. Its glass wasn't 100% clear, some superficial scratches or wipe marks (can't remember which,) but it didn't effect the quality of images.

Another fine camera. I still have my Leica template for bottom loading Leicas. My last souvenir with a Leitz logo; I won't part with it.

<i>"Henry, are the J12 and Orian 15 used on a FED or Kiev? And where did you buy them? I presume they use same formula for both mounts."</i><p>

Yes, both work wonderfully on the FED 2. I've used both without an addon viewfinder. The FED 2 is my favorite of the Commie cameras and once you start using it with these two lenses, you'll get used to the field of view and be able to frame your shots without a problem. I've never used an addon finder since I like the small size and the add on just bothers me.

<p>I have a Kiev mount J12, but not Kiev mount Orion 15. Actually, it's a Contax mount. They did make an Orion 15 for the Kiev, but it is even more rare than the LTM version. Both lenses can be bought on *bay. Let me recommend my favorite forum for <a href="www.beststuff.com">Commie Cameras</a> at BestStuff.com. This is the place to go for help on photo Russian stuff. They have a list of sellers they recommend so you don't get screwed. I personally have used Alex-photo from fleabay with great satsifaction.<p>

 

<p>As to the formulas, go to <a href="http://www.commiecameras.com">Nate's Communist Cameras</a> webpage and he has the actual specs on all the lense.<div></div>

This was the first time I used the Orion. The whole role had my finger showing up where I was focusing. Duh!