Best area to list Rollei gear?

Discussion in 'Medium Format' started by robert_nancarrow, Nov 3, 2011.

  1. I've been trying to sell some Rollei 6x6 SLR gear for quite awhile on an auction site (and here on photonet) and I've limited the sale to USA buyers only. Not a lot of interest so far and I got to thinking that maybe Europe has more love for this type gear as I remember reading somewhere that USA loves Hasselblad and Europe loves Rollei. If this is true, can anyone suggest some countries in Europe that I might do well in and other's to avoid due to a history of scamming/payment problems? Hope not to offend any Europeans but I do remember there are some areas in eastern Europe where shipping is sketchy and it might not be advisable to sell there. Thanks, Bob.
     
  2. Register/open your USA auction site name on the European version auction sites;
    *Bay UK, or *Bay GER, etc...
    State in your listing narrative that you only ship international on Thursdays,
    and that payment is due within 48hrs of auction close.
    Have your auctions close/end on SAT or SUN.
    This way, the PayPal process from your buyers is well under way before you ship.
    As to which countries you decide not to do business with,...that's your call.
    I'll let others address recommendations there.
     
  3. I don't understand Marc's advice at all. Just ship once you've received the money via Paypal. You get an instant notification from them.
    As for dodgy areas in Europe, nowhere in the EU is a known trouble spot but a few countries outside the EU in Eastern Europe could be a bit riskier. Having said that, there are some lovely Russians and other Eastern Europeans on the forums who are serious professional photographers and they want to find good used gear just as much as the rest of us. Perhaps you can exclude countries such as Russia and Ukraine but post in your listing that you can make an exception for professional photographers with websites and contact details which you can verify. I believe you can add them as exceptions once you've checked them out.
    But Rollei is most popular in Germany, Austria, Switzerland, Holland, UK and France. There's a 90% chance your buyer will be from one of these countries.
     
  4. The mail service in Italy can be extremely slow. So extreme, sometimes, that it takes literally forever. But only "can be". It can be very good too.<br><br>(Holland, by the way, is not a country. ;-) )
     
  5. QG, "Holland" is interchangeable with "Netherlands" in English. Even the Dutch tourist board is hosted at holland.com. Oxford dictionary agrees with me ;)
     
  6. Yes. And over here, the U.K. is called "Engeland". I'm sure not many in the U.K. will think that to be correct.<br><br>I know about the tourist board. They're crazy.<br>That's because we generally are. For instance: the national police over here just opened a crime scene investigation centre (they watch too much t.v.) and it's officially called "crime scene investigation the Hague" (note: i have not translated that from Dutch. It's what it really is called). We also have a "Traffic Information Center". And "Animal Cops". Etcetera. Nowadays, almost everything seems to need an English name.<br>Pure insanity. And being retarded enough to let t.v. (another example: 95% of programs shown on Dutch t.v. is in English. Of those few that aren't, 95% have English names.) be a frame of reference is really to blame. Unbelievable, but, sadly, very true.<br><br>So trust me (as one of those crazy people ;-) ): despite all that, Holland is not a country. It's part (split into two provinces) of a much bigger (yet still small) real country, called the Netherlands. Calling the Netherlands "Holland", despite what your dictionary and the Tourist Board might say, is the same as calling the U.K. "England", the U.S. "Texas", or Germany "Bayern".
     
  7. So Roger Miller had it right in the '60's with his lyrics "Engeland swings...."? I always thought he was singing about some place in New Jersey. ;)
     
  8. Nederland, then, must be the only 'right' name?
    My family are from Sverige, but a few were originally from Preußen.
    My great uncle did briefly serve in a treaty port in 中华/中華 or 中国/中國, depending. ;)
     
  9. Well, JDM, translations/local versions are quite o.k., quite "right" too. As long as they are that.<br>So Netherlands is as good as Niederlande, Paesi Bassi, Nederländerna, Países Bajos, Niderlandlar, Pays Bas, etc. All of them being translations (or derivatives) of Nederland. Not (note) of Holland.<br><br>I'll attach a map, showing the country (excluding the overseas bits), with the bit of it called Holland marked in red.<br><img src="http://home.tiscali.nl/qnu/PN/ned.jpg"><br><br>It's a language thing, only in as far as that pars-pro-totum thing is. And, of course, there's a historic cause for it, it in most part quite simply being that "Holland" was the part adjacent (across the little pond) to "Engeland". Hence "Holland" and "Engeland". Doesn't change the fact that Holland isn't the name of the country. It's just that bit of it nearest (sharing that honour with Zeeland) to the English speaking land across the sea.<br><br>I don't know whether Rolleis are popular in the Netherlands. But the mail service is very efficient and reliable.
     
  10. My first advice is to check the asking price compared to completed eBay-listings.
    Second: These days Rollei TLRs are up, Rollei SLRs are down.
    Third: Don't forget Japan, Hong Kong and "real" China (lots of lovers of German classy cameras with "new money".
    When trying to sell to Germany think about different ways of payment than Paypal. Within Euroland it is pretty common to use direct bank transfer. Paypal is charging a lot for their services compared to banks, freezes accounts at will, ...
    As soon as the money arrived at your place, mail the parcel (registered and insured).
    To my experience most people you meet on eBay are nice people regardless of their place of birth or residence, about 3% have/bring some sort of problem.
     
  11. Robert, I would be looking at 'Germanic Europe' as the most likely region of "Western" interest. To really make sure your items appear in ----.de .ch and .at search results, get some help with the listing in German. Most folk in either Denmark or The Netherlands seriously looking for something will search in .de and can read the language. I search in German and English and do the rounds, including ----.nl . Any photographer in 'Romanic Europe', serious enough to be searching for a Rollei, will know where to look and will decipher your English, and so will the interested parties in the Far East with that "new money" as noted by Jan Böttcher.
    Many European sellers list bilingually: their native tongue + English. Of course a brand name such as Hasselblad, Rollei or Linhof is the same the world over, but the words for items such as lenses, film holders etc., are not. If you are just selling one complete outfit, it may not be so much of an issue. But still, words such as 'complete outfit' and descriptions of condition in German and English will make it look as though you mean business and are interested in the customer. ie., it is good manners.
    Let the auction run as long as you can afford, so as to gather interest. Some of the best and most reputable German sellers, start out with no reserve. Then a few interested buyers will place a nominal bid of €1 or whatever. Action warms up in the last minutes, then takes off in the closing seconds. It's fun to watch, and more so to be part of it. (And sometimes frightening if you win :) If the item is well photographed, it will attract attention. Remember too, that the majority of folk around the world have their Google settings tuned for results in their own language. Just a thought.
    Good luck.
     
  12. Coming back to the business of photographs, don't underestimate the importance of well presented items, photographed with clarity and from all angles. Note defects if any, so as not to disappoint buyers. Buyers everywhere, especially the Far East will enjoy and want to reach out to to touch it if it is a beautiful photograph. It also helps overcome difficulties with language.
    You may wish to offer a "Buy now" price.
     
  13. Speaking of Holland, I once gave my GF a Dutch Oven. She was not very appreciative.

    Regarding Rollei equipment, I have searched the German eBay site. It does not look like it has more or less Rollei
    stuff than eBay. Or for a lot more or a lot less than regular eBay.

    I have an HFT lens I have been trying to time to sell. There seems always to be someone listing one for less and less.
    I'm going to just list it and see where it ends up.
     
  14. Richard,<br><br>That (giving your GF a Dutch oven) is indeed something that should better be considered as something from Holland.<br>Or, considering that "Dutch" is also often used meaning "Deutsch" (as in Dutch Schultz), the practice could be blamed on Bratwurst with Sauerkraut, Eisbein, with lots of butter and no ruffage, and such?<br>;-)<br><br>Talking about Germany: eBay.de is, i believe, by far the largest (in trade volume) European eBay 'version', and would be my choice if i wanted to sell something (It's where i first turn to when looking for something.)
     
  15. Bob,

    I just took a look at your deleted ad for the Rollei gear.

    I think you're going to have a hard time selling the whole set at one time. No matter where you are selling. A buyer of
    the SLX is going to be very budget minded. They are looking for a $300-500 camera basic setup. You have a few
    thousands worth of gear there, all locked up in one package. And someone with 3K to
    spend is not going to want an SLX.

    Most of that stuff will work on later Rolleis, you don't want to exclude them from your buyer/bidder pool. You're scaring away potential SLX buyers and your potential 600x buyers.

    Anyway,
    Send me a private message when you do list it. I may like to take a shot at a lens or two when it's up for auction.



    ps. I just did a search on eBay for an Rollei SLX camera. No results. This is probably a good time to list.
     
  16. Bob, I would add that you need much more detail than you had in your deleted ad. For example, you don't indicate with the 150mm lens is a PQ or PQS. The condition of each item is not specified, etc.
     
  17. Great responses and exactly the kind of advice I was looking for. Many thanks to everyone who helped. Bob.
     
  18. In general I do not think it will be wise to sell in Europe. Customs will charge VAT and duties. VAT alone will be 20% in the UK (IIRC) and 19% in the Netherlands, similar percentages elsewhere , etc. The cost of shipping will be substantial. At the end of the day all this will come out of your pocket.
    Ferdi.
     
  19. I hadn't thought of the extra costs Ferdi, thanks for adding that bit. Bob.
     
  20. Ferdi says:
    The cost of shipping will be substantial. At the end of the day all this will come out of your pocket.​
    Don't you mean the buyer's pocket Ferdi? .. perhaps you do if it is a "figure of speech". Besides that's a decision of the buyer, and will do it if they see what they want in top condition, hence my emphasis on the importance of presentation in previous posts. There are couple of high end sellers in Hong Kong and Singapore, who have customers the world over. Their items are always showing up in my eBay.de searches. We are accustomed to higher VAT in Europe, so don't let that put you off.
    As Richard Sperry says, a breakdown of the outfit will probably lubricate the cash flow. When all items are listed at the same time, interested buyers will check out your "other items", especially if you mention it in the information for each item. Spread the closure times at a minimum of 10 minutes apart, to enable a buyer to be active on each at those crucial closing moments. Offer to combine shipping costs. The "outfit breakdown" may well work at aBay.com, and could be worth giving it a shot before you try overseas. But be sure to offer "Shipping worldwide".
    It's more work, but if you want the best return, there's no way around it. (It's a pity you have to sell it all. Beautiful gear.)
     
  21. Kevin,

    If I am looking at two 120mm Rollei lenses to buy. And they are both $1000 but one has 20% VAT and the other does
    not, I am going to buy the one without VAT.

    Unless the seller with VAT drops his or her price. With the alternative being a NO SALE on the register.

    Example; I just bought an 80mm PQS from ffordes in the UK, after VAT and shipping it came to $750. They sell here
    in the US for $1000 used without tax. Who paid the VAT in this case? Would an Englander buy a $1000 lens
    from the US with an addon of $200 in this case?

    A value added tax on used goods is pretty stupid. All the value has already been added into the item. A reseller is not
    adding any value to the item. Just as stupid as a sales tax on a rented item, and the owner has already paid the
    sales tax for it. They should be called GARTs instead, for gratuitous anal reaming taxes. If I sold something and shipped it to a VAT country, they would have to catch me first before I ever paid it as a seller.


    Ps, I don't think the UK VAT for my lens was 20%, it was like $40 iirc.
     
  22. A value added tax on used goods is pretty stupid.​
    Well Richard, this is really a political argument. However, to clarify, and I don't know where you are ...
    1. From one country to the next within the EU, there are no import/export duties on the movement of goods. Some auction houses who list through eBay charge the usual 'Buyers Premium' and add VAT, otherwise there is nothing in the way of tax added to normal eBay transactions.
    2. Buying anything from retailers/shops, over the counter, there is VAT, used or new, at varying rates from one EU country to the next. I expect that retailers who have eBay 'shops' will already have VAT loaded in the price.
    3. The "Political" component: I can have free medical treatment, including hospitalisation for as long as necessary ... wait for it ... FREE. This includes all visits to NHS* medical centres, and specialists when referred by one's local doctor. Now that I am 60? I even get free prescriptions in the UK.
    * NHS - National Health Service
    People in the US end up mortgaging their homes, even lose them, paying for lengthy, costly hospital treatments. Or come out of hospital from that hip replacement, only to have a heart attack when presented with the bill. We in the UK still have the option for fast track treatment on elective surgery, by paying a bit extra for 'Private'. Dental treatment is also subsidised by the NHS. So, with all due respect, I don't find VAT on retail sales, of goods or services, is stupid at all.
    In Norway, with even higher taxes, the cost of total prescriptions within any 12 month period is capped. I have had two visits to hospital in Norway, once for surgery, the other for a week's observation and thorough schedule of tests after a T.I.A. .. the bill? Zero. When in Norway, and ordering anything except books from outside Norway, there is an import duty of 27.5% (or more?). So be it. It's not so often, and I don't mind.
    However, when politician's throw money at stuff like this, and use tax as a dirty word, I'm at a loss.
     
  23. VAT is added on to the sale, not the item. Anyone selling things as a business has to pay the tax to the tax man. That's why used goods are often sold "in commission" for the owner, a private person, i.e. the shop claims not to be the one to sell the stuff, merely acting as a go between.<br><br>Anyway, having to pay VAT and duties on stuff bought by Europeans from sellers in the U.S. is a possibility, but does not always happen. It depends on what type of goods are concerned and what the value of the thing(ies) is. And even if 'eligible', often you get the stuff delivered without any such extras. I get stuff from the U.S. quite often, and have paid VAT and duties only once or twice.<br>What i did have to pay a bit more often were customs handling charges, charged by the carrier. No VAT or duties due, but a $20 bill for the privilege of someone probably not filling in some forms anyway... annoying. This however depends a lot on the choice of carrier. Stuff sent using the U.S. Postal Service gets through without any hassle.<br><br>But even if VAT and duties are due, it's often worth getting stuff from across the Big Pond anyway. All depends on the selling price (obviously) and the general (in)availability of the item concerned.<br><br>But what can really put a potential buyer off is something seen far too often, it being crazy shipping charges.<br>Who can even begin to fathom the depths of inanity that drives some hopeful sellers to ask for $80 to $90 to ship something from the U.S. to Europe when you can get another seller to send the very same thing for $8 or $9? Could it be because some people do not want to sell things to overseas, but are afraid to say so? Or what?<br>So quote realistic shipping charges. Asking $40 in shipping costs when it can be covered by a $2 stamp is far, far more off-putting than the prospect of having to pay VAT and duties over that item you wanted to own for a long time.
     

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