An Unusual question fro all of you - part II??

Before you read this you should read the question I posted on

December 12 titled � An Unusual question for you�.

<p>

The reason why I love this website is because of the

experiences, commentary, and knowledge that people bring to

these pages. It is rich and invaluable. Thank you.

<p>

However I think some of you may be off topic. My questions are

not why I carry 160 lbs of gear or why it is so heavy, but rather

how can I be more productive and creative in the field. There

are very few, if any books that speak to this topic, yet this is really

what photography is all about. The equipment is secondary for

once you have it then you must do something with it and that is

very hard.

<p>

I believe that imposing a goal of 1-6 exhibition quality images per

day is absolutely essential for you to grow as a photographer. It

forces you to start to think about how can I obtain such a goal.

All of a sudden one image per week is no longer acceptable and

now you are forced to move outside of your comfort zone. Your

mind becomes filled with frustration and self drought. After

many failures you will start to ask the question am I really an

artist or just a fool running around with expensive gear. You are

now in a crisis. Only then do you really start to innovate and truly

create, if you survive.

<p>

Let me drive this point home by introducing you to another side

of myself. I am also a wedding photographer. Four years ago I

changed my whole approach and offered four packages starting

at 300, 500, 700, and 900 excellent photographs. Excellence

here means not only excellent images, but also excellence in

coverage. The next thing I did was to tell my clients that they

could keep half the fee until after inspecting the final product. If

they did like it then they do not have to pay. This kind of sounds

like 1-6 exhibition images per day, but it is even worse because

brides have unrealistic expectations. When I first instituted this

changes I can assure you my income went into a noses dive.

This year I have exceed all my expectations and booked 62

weddings and will shoot over 24,000 frames of film. So far I

have had no unhappy brides and I have received over $1600 in

tips. Four years ago I was an introvert. Today I have become a

extravert and I love pouring film over humanity. Yet, each time I

shoot a wedding I still sweat bullets which forces me to learn

and grow as a wedding photographer. If I fail to grow then I can

assure you I will not get paid.

<p>

So let me repeat my question. What methods and techniques

do you employ to insure success? To increase your

productivity? Do you have any untested ideas that you would like

to share with us. Here are just a few of the many things I have

done to move closer to my goal of 1-6 exhibition images per day.

<p>

1. I now use a llama. A llama lets me get lots of gear into

wild-prestine remote areas. Hershey allows me to set up a

comfortable camp, carry 10 lens, a polaroid system, a big tripod,

and many other things. All of this adds up to a very versatile

system. Once we start to shoot film, Hershey carries everything

(about 50 lbs) and I stay fresh, energized, and very productive.

<p>

2. I use color neg film. I then print it on Fuji super gloss crystal

archive papers to get cibrachrome colors. Most people think I

use chromes because of my colors. The reason I use negs is

because I can record up to 11 stops of total light and 8-9 stops of

dynamic light. This allows me to shoot later in the morning and

earlier in the evening. I can shoot rings around people who use

chromes, 4 stops does not cut it. I can also do contracted

development with my negs: n-1, n-2, n-3, and n-4 just like you do

with b&w film. In fact, I contend that I can take on higher

contrast scenes then those who use b&w film with my color

negs. This has made me extremely productive.

Personally, I have learned a great deal from Galen Rowell's books.

Instead of talking about the techno-babble regarding equipment, he

focuses on translating human experiences into photographic images.

His most recent book, "The Inner Game of Outdoor Photography", is a

compilation of various articles he has written over the years.

<p>

Even though he shoots with different tools than I, he describes the

process of capturing emotional images, not the mechanics.

<p>

I recently took a 3-day workshop in the Eastern Sierra Nevada with

him and 12 other students, and most people were asking the same

old 'what aperture would you take this image with' and 'what film do

you like to use'. Productive questions for some, but the reason he

has been successful as a photographer has more to do with searching

out and anticipating great photos. Keep in mind, most of his best

photos were taken with a manual-focus Nikon from the 70's, and an

older manual focus 24mm lens. Not exactly an equipment snob.

<p>

I don't want to come across as being a commercial for Galen Rowell.

I find faults in most artists, including his work. However, I am

intrigued by the process by which he seeks out his images.

<p>

Hope this helps.

<p>

Andy

As long as you equate numbers with quality you will be easily

satisfied with average 'pretty picture' images.

Look at the work of Ernst Haas, David Muench, Paul Caponigro and

Edward Weston. Seeking only excellence in results, not numbers, will

get you out of the rut you seem to be in and pushing for good images.

Are you really looking or asking for answers, or are you

challenging anyone who cares to respond to point out the rightness or

wrongness of your current mindset?

<p>

The beginning of your thread asks 'how can I be more productive?'

and your last sentence suggests that you are extremely productive? If

you think you've been productive because of your personal style and

mindset then it's essentially case closed, because nobody can be you

better than you can. Nobody could or should shoot like you except you

if the way you shoot works for you, notwithstanding what can be

learned from you or any of us from example and/or inspiration and so

forth.

<p>

There are many ways to be productive, some I think are going to

wear you out quicker than others, and maybe the day will come when you

will want to 'mellow out' your style a bit.

<p>

Change, flexibility, inspiration, doing things differently,

getting a masterpiece as a result of and/or making a mistake, in other

words growth, are the keys for me, not quantity or quotas(I say that

with absolutely no disrespect to your position).

<p>

'I believe that imposing a goal of 1-6 exhibition quality images

per day is absolutely essential for you to grow as a

photographer'...........If this is a reflection of you true beliefs,

then maybe thinking this does in fact help you to grow, but only

you'll be able to know if it does.

<p>

Growth for me as a photographer takes place when I'm not

shooting. Growth for me occurs for me while I'm looking at what I've

shot and how I shot it. Sometimes this process is drawn out,

sometimes I'll be driving down the street thinking about anything but

photogaphy , and an inspiration will hit me!

<p>

Sometimes I'll be sitting at the beach with my wife and kids and

I'll 'realize' something that I'll want to try later. I'm racing

around the beach begging anyone with 'earshot' for a pencil and a

piece of paper so I can sketch out my newfound 'idea', and when this

happens, my wife thinks that I've gone crazy.

<p>

Growth takes place for me while I am setting up a shot, and I'm

thinking about how it looks, but at the moment of taking a shot, the

thinking is over, and all I care about is executing. Its not in me to

think about things when I'm shooting, and whether it's right or wrong,

that's me.

<p>

Expecting one to six exhibition quality images per day is a hell

of a Gorilla to hoist up on your own back! I can't help but think

that the day will come when you'll get tired of carrying that Gorilla

around, and eventually, the time might come when you will indeed want

to put him down, which will probably be a part of your growth process

to help you achieve what you want.

You grow as a Photographer on the days you don't shoot and on the

days you don't come up with good shots, and even though you might have

had a day that stinks, think of it as the fertilizer that makes your

grass grow.

My brothers and sisters in large format photography:

<p>

I came to photography back in the 1960s when my mother gave me an old

beat-up Kodak Brownie box camera. After we moved up to a Nikkormat,

we spent the next 30 years essentially documenting a growing family,

travels, and sundry special events. These were snapshots, where the

subject was the thing, and there was little or no attention to any

artistic or other esthetic quality. We still regard handheld 35mm

photography as a wonderful way to share experiences with others, to

preserve a record of things that would otherwise be entirely

forgotten, to (re)create an acceptable past, to make possible a

visual review of our lives in images.

<p>

Last year, we took up large format with the acquisition of an 8x10

field camera with related gear. We shoot b/w only, in response to

largely esthetic considerations. Entering LF photography, at least

on my part, was the end result of long-simmering unfulfilled

aspirations rooted in autobiographical details which are beside the

point here. What is to the point is the difference I perceive

between my ongoing 35mm snapshooting and the use of the field

camera. The two work in synch, but with entirely different purposes.

<p>

Through large format, I try to express some very deep-seated life-

long esthetics and mental images that I carry with me everywhere. A

decade ago in a frenzied burst of enthusiasm I grabbed some of my

preschool daughter's colored craft paper and within a quarter hour

had pasted together a likeness of perhaps my most persistent image:

approaching the Sierra Nevada range by road from the San Joaquin

Valley--my childhood mental rendition of John Muir's account of the

view eastwards from Pacheco Pass a century before. I framed it and

it's still hanging in my living room ("When I Paint My Masterpiece",

I always explain). But I still have other images I want to express:

some childish, some erotic (the curve of a woman's body), some

heroic, some monumental, but basically abstractions in search of a

specific visual embodiment. All, I suspect, are rooted in some

autobiographical ego-related space-and-time circumstances, but I'm

far less concerned with those circumstances than with my desire to

find expression for them in my black and white large format images.

<p>

When we take the rig out, we're not looking for Kodak moments,

although I'm not ashamed to admit that those boyhood visits to Best's

Studio in the Valley have in not a few cases substituted photographic

icons for reality--icons I'd like to try to recreate myself in my own

personal way. Essentially, what we're about is to capture on film

the essence of almost archetypal notions. We (me, my wife, and a

child or two) work hard on technique, on the craft in all its

aspects, but all in the service of the larger personal project "from

within." No quota of images, exhibition quality or otherwise, other

than to continue until I/we have satisfied these inner

emotional/esthetic longings.

<p>

All the best,

Nick.

Dear Stephen,

my heart rate is increasing just thinking of all the stress you are

imposing upon yourself. Does this stress show in the pictures?

I work as a professional photographer, and - like you - I have certain

commercial demands and motivations (i.e. my mortgage payments depend

on a consistent turnaround of quality of work in very short time

spaces).

<p>

However, when I make pictures in the landscape, the motivation behind

the work is altogether different. My motivation here is to MAKE

pictures (not TAKE them), pictures that I can live with, that feel

they have been made with a clarity of mind not possible in the

commercial world, whether I make them half way up a mountain (usually

not), or somewhere close to home (most often).

<p>

Most of us have limited time to make these kinds of pictures, and so

there is an inevitable pressure to 'perform'. However, I find that

when I have forgotten those anxieties, the picture-making process

begins to work faster.

<p>

At the same time as arguing for the necessity of a calm, clear-minded

approach as I have, for some artists this anxiety may actually help to

generate a flavour in the work that the pictures need. Signs of

urgency, or agitation. For some this may be an equally necessary part

of the process, reflected in the images.

<p>

At the end of the day, it sounds as though you are making plenty of

pictures. The question you maybe should be asking, more importantly,

is whether they reflect your artistic motivations, or are they a

series of practical excercises in coping with everything thrown at you

and making something come what may?

<p>

If you are making six great pictures every day, then congratulations!

I think Ansel Adams said to Imogen Cunningham that he probably made

one or two great pictures a year (or something like that), to which

she replied "one a lifetime".......

<p>

Best w

I think you make a mistake setting your goal based on a target number

of great photographs a day. It's good to have goals, but you'd be

better served if you made your goal simply to *be* there as often as

possible and to look and see and imagine the possibilities are before

you.

<p>

Photography is very much a Zen-like experience--the harder you aim,

the more likely the arrow will go astray. You cannot force the arrow

to the target; you focus your energy on the target and *let* the

arrow find its way.

<p>

You must dismiss numerical production goals. That's good for

manufacturing, but not creating. Numbers of photographs mean

nothing. Some days we are on, some days we aren't. The important

thing is to free your mind and allow yourself to focus, to experience

the world around you, and to see without excessive mental burden. A

relaxed mind, clear yet focussed on your environment, should be your

goal. If you do that, you will not have to concern yourself with

production numbers. If you build a place for images to grow, they

will come.

Don't tell anyone you use colour print film that our little secret.

Everybody thinks you need to print slides but of course our prints

prove people wrong. It is bad to be a factory but a production goal

is important. Yes we have to go with the flow but we can't get

anywhere without a goal. I never expect to make that special image

everyday however I need to make a lot of images to find that special

one. I try to enjoy life and when I can't take a picture I will just

enjoy the moment. However we are photographers and photographing our

lives is what we need to do. This discussion is really good because

this forum is technical and we don't talk about what we actually make

with our great cameras. I am doing a school documentary project of my

photography program at Ryerson University in Toronto. I can't believe

you use a IIama. So does the animal live with you or do you just

rent? What film do you use to get massive N- development? Portra?

Please e-mail me offline.

I find that traveling light and being responsive to local conditions

works best overall.

For example, if I am working in the desert and a thunderstorm rolls

over a mesa in the distance, I know that I can go there and shoot

water pockets when the sun is low. Or if the weather reports say snow

in the high country � a quick trip.

<p>

This is a strategy, of course, for one who has very limited time��

Nothing can beat living in the area full time for quality of

production, if not quantity.

I don't see why so many are fixated on the llama. My recollection is

that St. Ansel commonly used a burro, even indicating that how much

equipment he brought depended on how much the burro could carry.

Heck, Ed Weston didn't like getting 50 feet from his car. So what?

It appears to me that the questioner is focussed on eliminating a lot

of variables that ordinarily interfere with the act and process of

shooting. He seems to be doing that. He obviously has all the

technical tools. Maybe Stephen is asking the how to move between the

chaos of wedding photography to the relative calm of nature

photography. As to his goals, different things drive people

differently in the creation of their art, their vision, their

message, their whatever. However, I think that ultimately, as others

have said previously, that most of the battle is just showing up.

You're there -- enjoy it and enjoy the results whether the photos are

exhibition quality or not.

Jonathan hit the nail on the head. If you can already knock out this

many keepers in a day and truly close the gap between quantity

and "real" quality, buildings will be constructed in your name in the

future to house all of these masterpieces for many generations to

see. For some reason, I do not think that this is the case. How can

we take you seriously that you want to kick it up a knotch. When I

first read your first post, I thought you were pulling our leg. Now I

realize that you are serious. In any event, in the extended period

that I have been monitoring this forum, yours is the first to even

suggest such a paradox. I run across the llama brigade in the

Colorado high country on occasion and it seems to me that the likes

of you are on a mission to a higher calling. Stop and talk? Just sit

down and marvel at what is transpiring in front of you? Hell no, we

are on a mission! I just steer clear any more and let you do your

thing. Photography for me is not a destination, it is a marvelous

journey not defined by the parameters we use to describe success in

our daily lives. How many frames you shoot in weddings has no

material bearing into the "esthetics" of photography. The bottom line

is that very people could assist you in your question that I have

ever interacted with. You are in another orbit and I wish you the

best of luck. Can you say burnout?

So you are an obsessive compulsive who feels you must be productive

every minute or you are moving dangerously backwards. You are on an

accelerating treadmill with only brief glances of satisfaction.

<p>

It sounds like your system makes you both productive and very

successful - so there isn't really a problem. I suspect the roots of

your dilemma are not in photography at all.

Michael,

<p>

These are only goals and in most cases are not a measure of what

actually happens. By having goals it forces me to grow and innovate.

That is all. No goals no growth!

<p>

For the record, Hirshey and I are a real team, and we have lots of

fun on our journies where ever that may lead us.

<p>

Perhaps you could tell us about a typical day in the field for you.

Outline what you do. Maybe in between the lines there is a small bit

of information that no one except you has thought of. Something

innovative that the rest of can benefit from. For example, I attach

a 10" cable release to everone of my lens because this saves me time.

<p>

Remember, this is a small commutity and we are all in this together,

so lets challenge each other and share what little we have to

offer.

<p>

Thanks

We all are into photography at different levels and for different

reason. It sounds like you need to relax and maybe enjoy what you are

doing a little more. I love it when I have a very productive day.

Some days it just doesn't happen. If you feel the need to meet

production quotas, get a factory job somewhere. You will never get

enough numbers to please them and you will have plenty of the stress

you seem to need in your life. (Just kidding).The number of

photographs I'm going to make is the last thing on my mind. I get

totally into the subject at hand and then move on to something else,

and hopefully another subject will inspire me to make another

photograph. When I shoot 35mm, I pretty much take the same approach,

except I usually will shoot a little more film on the subject.

I think part of the reason that some may be distracted by the quantity

of gear, is that some of us find excessive amounts of equipment to be

a distraction in the field. I own a good deal of equipment, but I try

to go out with a focused vision, with certain things that I am looking

for, but also prepared for a few surprises. When I decide to leave

equipment at home, I'm making aesthetic choices.

<p>

But that's just the way I work. I'm not trying to pay the rent with

photography. I have a very fulfilling day job that pays the rent as

well as providing much intellectual and aesthetic satisfaction. One

of the reasons I set aside the idea of pursuing photography as a

profession at a certain point was the desire to be free of commercial

pressures and influences in this part of my life. If I can produce a

few aesthetic objects of lasting meaning and value, that is sufficient

for me.

Here's what I do to be more "productive" with a view camera. I shoot

roll film.

<p>

If you get a small view camera and 6x7 or 6x9 RF back, you won't need

a llama, the weasel would work just fine.

all the other stuff aside I recommend Robert Adams, Why People

Photograph. Mainly the first few chapters. It's good soul food.

<p>

happy holidays

ec

Here is one of my techniques that you may find unacceptable. When I

am going into a new area that I am relatively unfamiliar with, the

only optical equipment I bring with me is my Linhof finder for my

format (4x5/8x10 or 5x7)and my binoculars for spotting bears, sheep,

eagles and elk. I cover terrain to look for composition without any

photography equipment specifically because I do not want to be

tempted to make a photograph and spoil the "understanding" of the

area in its entirety that will let me feel where the best places

within its boundary are to make photographs. I can cover a larger

area and when I return, it is like visiting an old friend - we have

commonalities. In the past I found that I was moved to make a

photograph only to find that 100 yards further, was a much better

position. It is still a lot of hard work, but it is without the 60#

pack.

Stephen, in the field there is no way to �insure success�.

Opportunity comes from simply holding ones� feet to the fire -

getting up at 4am for sunrises, getting out in windy and inclement

weather, taking the time to really see the compositions and form the

image you�re trying to achieve. There is no substitute for time spent

in the field. But opportunity alone cannot ensure satisfying images.

<p>

You need to enjoy both the process and the results, otherwise you�ll

not spend the time. You really need to have some kind of internal

motivation or drive to do photograph. You seem to be approaching this

from a �production� perspective, perhaps a conditioning brought on by

your wedding photography - where results are everything.

<p>

I guess what I�m trying to say is enjoy the process and the results

will come. Give the llama a weekend off, reduce your gear to backpack

size, and go for a days� hiking - relax and see what�s around you.

You could be making this more difficult than it should be. I wish you

luck.

I'm new at this board, I asked a question earlier about the MXT

enlarger, and thanks to everyone for their ideas and suggestions.

<p>

I guess I will add my ideas about productivity and creativity. I'm

probably a beginner in photography when compared to some others on

this board, started in 1991, using a 35mm Yashica range finder camera

that my parents bought for me at a garage sale. I used it for two

years, wandering around the streets of Chicago with it bouncing on my

belly. I guess it was more like shooting from the hip, because even

though I looked through the rangefinder, I discovered it focused on

one thing, and the lens another, so the negatives were always a

surprise to me, at least until my brain figured out that I had to move

the finder about two inches to the left of what I wanted to photograph

- scary process, because I started getting it right. I saved money for

a year and during that time thought about what camera I was going to

buy. I decided on a Hasselblad (whoops, I know this is a large format

discussion, but one day I will buy one), so far it is all I use, but

hopefully soon I will move into 4X5. I try to go out everyday with the

camera, sometimes I don't though, things come up, but if I am diligent

and carry it around good things sometimes happen. I notice better

things happen when no people or cars are around, so I like to go out

at 3am when most people are dreaming, then strange things occur, I see

rabbits and fog and twisting maple tree shadows. I start to have a

rapport with the things around me, then I have the desire to make a

photograph of what I am seeing. I don't photograph people much because

they seem to complain when I pull the camera out and point it at them

when they are telling me about what they bought at Walmart, but trees

and empty roads are always cooperative with my efforts. Sometimes I

walk around and never make a photograph, because the desire never

arises in me to make one, but other days I come back with 40 exposures

and think - "damn, I can't wait to develop this stuff". I have never

done photography as a job, because I probably would never want to see

a camera outside the work environment. I try to use the camera to

learn about the world that I find myself sinking in. Using it thus, I

rarely go out with any set ideas about what I want to make - I don't

want to make pictures of things that that are already known to me. I

want to see things on the film that startle me - even though I am the

one who presses the shutter, the image should remain difficult to

recognize.

I haven't even read but the 1st three answers but I have to get to

work so I'll save it for a treat later.

<p>

You are a person that thrives under pressures that would crush most

others:

<p>

5-6 isn't enough! That's laziness and sloth for you. You need to

change that requirement to at least 24. OK 24 to start with and 50

tops. Then you need to take more gear so you can duplicate all your

camera backs with Black and White film. (Poor Hershey)

<p>

Plan your trips around a full moon so that you can work at least 6

24hour days while you're there.

<p>

Treeline in the rockies isn't hard enough for you. You need to come

out here to central Nevada where I live to add some difficulty.

<p>

Finally, you need to hire a large vicious person with a bull whip that

will inflict real pain if you start to slack off. Let me know when

you're coming so I can get you on my calender.

<p>

Jim Galli

Michael,

<p>

Most excellent. I have just purchased the same finder last year and

it is turning out to be a very powerfull tool for quickley weeding

out junk. I suspect that this finder will have a significant impact

on my yeilds. This summer I did go to a place that turned to be

worthless. If I had done a scouting trip as you suggested I would

have saved myself a lot of time and money.

<p>

Thanks

Stephen, I'm not sure where you get your idea that you should, or can,

take 1-6 exhibition quality images per day. Without getting into the

definition of "exhibition quality" (which arouses my suspicions right

off the bat), if you can accomplish this, you'd be the first

photographer ever to do it. Ansel Adams said he was happy if me made

one good photograph per month. If you read Edward Weston's daybooks,

he photographed almost continuously for 25 years and the total of his

life's work is about 100 images. Look at the work of any great

photographer, or other artist for that matter, and you will see a

similar pattern-- a challenging goal for a full-time artist would be

10 new pieces per year. For a part-timer, one or two really strong

images per year would be a happy result. My personal production

follows this pretty closely-- I've been photographing for 10 years and

my work to date is about 120 images (which you can see at

www.chrisjordanphoto.com if you are interested). I recently spent ten

days in the canyons of the desert southwest, and took a photograph

only on the ninth day. I exposed two sheets of film (both the same

image at different exposures), and got one of the best photos I've

ever taken. That, for me, was an extremely successful trip.

<p>

My belief is that if you are out there pushing yourself to take 1-6

killers per DAY, then the intellectual side of your mind will be so

filled with pressure and stress and dreams and fantasies about shows

and galleries and success, that the intuitive side of your mind will

never get a chance to take over the controls and see the really

magical scenes that you encounter, and so you will walk right by the

real killers that would stop a focussed artist in their tracks.

<p>

My recommendation would be to try to forget about artistic goals, and

learn to enjoy and love the process of making art. Set an impossibly

high standard for yourself that applies to every image you make, and

then meet that standard by looking really deeply wherever you go and

not taking a photograph until you see real honest magic in front of

your lens. And then, adopt a brutally harsh throw-out standard for

when you get the film back from the lab. In five years, if you have

50 "keepers" then you can consider yourself an asskicker.

<p>

It might help you also to try to define what that magic is that

you're looking for, through some form of spiritual study as well as a

comprehensive study of photographic history. Spending a few years

studying the history of painting wouldn't hurt either. Without these

ingredients, you're inevitably destined to simply take a bunch of

pictures that you "recognize" as being good because you've seen them

in calendars. In other words, to break out of the formula, you have

to go deep into yourself and your medium.

<p>

The goals will happen by themselves, if you really care about what

you're doing, and do it sincerely.

<p>

Best of luck,

<p>

~chris jordan (Seattle)

<p>

www.chrisjordanphoto.com