Advice pls on use of a work (church wants to use my image for their logo)

I have been asked by a church to use one of my images for their logo on their

signage, letterhead, etc. Sounds like pretty much perputual use and the image

will represent the church and be it's trademark. ("...We came across your

gorgeous photo and our search stopped immediately, it was exactly what we were

looking for. It would be used in a logo/image capacity for a community based

church...") Seems the name of the church and my image "gel". They end their

email by saying: "Please let me know what it would require to use this image

for our church."

 

I've sold my work often in the past (framed prints mostly) but other than a

local Sierra Club using one of my images for a postcard campaign, and a pub in

Korea using one of my images for an local ad I have little experience in

this. I'm guessing they are hoping out of the goodness of my heart, and for a

community-based church, that I'll just say "Go ahead!", but then again it's

not simply one-time use but seems they want my image to be their trademark and

represent all they are as a church from here on out. I'm a spiritual but not

religious person and have little interest in doing this out of any kind of

piety.

 

Any thoughts or ideas on how I should approach this? Or begin

communications? Or license such a thing?

 

Thanks to those who can share their experience in such matters.

"... but other than a local Sierra Club using one of my images for a postcard campaign, and a pub in Korea using one of my images for an local ad ..."

 

For starters ... I wouldn't mention either of those to the church ;-)

LOL! Good one Larry. Had not thought of that!

ask them for the going rate. What would you be happy with ? Tell them $1,000 for 20 years,

non-exclusively.

Hmmh good idea, don't let them know they are dealing with a published pro, that helps keep their expectations low.

 

I'd suggest looking at it as a business opportunity but not as a gold mine. One might expect them to be good stewards of their resources and unwilling to just throw tons of money at it. However, unless they have board members (whatever they may call them) with lots of related business experience, they probably won't be expecting the kind of proposal that might be extended to a large for-profit corporation for long term or permanent use of an image.

 

I'd also expect that there would be limited alternative markets for that image so.... maybe better something than nothing? And will they need staff pictures for other uses, events or weddings, etc.,?

Why not give it to them in exchange for a donation receipt in the amount of "the going rate". God will love you just a little more than he already does, and you can deduct your generous donation from your taxes.

Well, I do go to church! If it's a large one, then they'll certainly be willing to pay something...especially if they were searching, found you and made the effort to contact you. If it's a small church, then they might need a little grace. :)

 

A donation is a great idea and if you're local, they could direct people to you for more work. I'm doing a church Christmas event this week...for free! It's a great opportunity to network.

 

Tis the season to give!

The donation idea doesn't hold water s far as tax deductions go, at least in the US. If you donate a print you can only deduct the actual cost of the print (paper, printing, frame etc), not what you would sell the print for. The same goes for image usage, you can't deduct what you would license the image for to someone else. The rules might have changed since I checked with my CPA three years ago, so check with a local CPA to make sure.

I believe Michael is correct. Also, don't assume that because they're a church they don't have money. Many do, or will, or can persuade donors to provide means. Do what you think is best for your circumstances, your business and your heart. Some win-win options:

 

- If they balk at a price, offer to allow license payments over a number of years, that provides you a revenue stream over time.

 

- Many churches have great community ties and contacts. You may be able to network within their network, gaining more work or sales in exchange for an advantageous price to the church.

Rich-- You're going about this completely wrong. First of all, tell them your base price for that use would start at $45. "Gee, that's great!" they might say. But make sure they realize that is $45 PER THOUSAND printed copies, plus a yearly license fee. You can make that as small or as big as you want, for a church I'd make it about $25 if they go below 3000 copies, and not charge one if they have more useage.

 

So, the real question is, how much do you think you can make off of this? And how much useage do you think the church will get out of the image? If they print up 3000 copies per year, then you would net $135 per year for the image. Will they use the image for ten years? That's $1350. Will they use it for 20 years? That's $2700. You can even include an inflation factor in the price.

 

Also, you can offer them a long-term contract. You want to make $1000 off the image? Fine, then, offer them ten years at $120 per year if they sign the contract. You'll want that extra $20, as it pays for the fact that you won't get your money all at once.

 

See the posts on "The All-Inclusive Invoice Fee Addenda" in the archives of this forum. That should give you even more information to go on. Make sure you use the addenda so they can't squirm more useage without pay.

 

Happy shooting. -BC-

Thanks for all the thoughts and advice everyone. They have responded to my initial queries of more details on their use and budget with the idea that they are just starting, have little to no budget, etc. Oh well. I'll decide later what to do. (though they did send me a very not mock up of thier logo, business cards, etc. using my image. How nice.

 

Again this week I got another request. This time a little different. This one is a guy who wants to use one of my images for his commercial postcard campaign. It appears to be a kind of specialized

video rending service of some sort. He says I'll get a credit on the back and wants to know "what arrangements could be made if any". He's sketched up a sample postcard to show me his intended use. Looks preety good, and looks like it may get him some business, if I say so myself. I emailed him asking how many run of the postcard does he plan? Will he want to use the image more than once? Will he want to use the image in any other fashion? etc. Any thoughts on that one?

 

BTW, is there a website of pro's or something that discusses this kind of work and maybe some pricing guidelines anywhere you know of?

 

Perhaps I should get some of my images up on some stock photo sites? Can anyone recommend any?