Advice for Novices

Discussion in 'Wedding and Event' started by chris_l|4, Jun 12, 2011.

  1. Hi,
    A friend of mine has asked me to take photos for his wedding in lieu of a professional photographer. Before I ask though I will state my background (Just finished reading the "OMG" thread...)
    • I'm not a professional, I'd consider myself an avid amature,
    • I don't intend on making a career out of it and don't intend on stepping on toes or competing with businesses.
    • I've made it clear that for better quality shots they should hire a pro however they simply can't afford it.
    • I won't have the luxury of an assistant
    The equipment I have or will have is;
    • 50D with grip (2 if I get my way)
    • 50mm 1.8f
    • 18-200mm 3.5-5.6f
    • 70-200mm 2.8f
    • 430EX II (though I am trying to use only natural light)
    So after all that..
    Where would I best position myself during different parts of the ceremony?
    What should I be looking out for as far as lighting?
    What tips can anyone offer for crowd control as I won't be able to move the masses as I have seen some do in the past?
  2. 1. What kind of ceremony is it? Church, inside but not church, outside? Makes a difference. Plus with churches (and other situations, too) you can only do what the officiant tells you is allowed. So if in a church, what are the rules? You can only answer this question if you know the above.
    2. Again--inside, outside? Time of day? I will say that going only with natural light is difficult with your lenses.
    3. Be polite but firm. Ask nicely, and if you don't get the behavior you want, get firmer in small steps. Let people take their pictures and then do yours, but keep it moving. Exert your status as "official photographer" if necessary.
  3. What would you have answered if your friend had asked you to do some dental work, as he couldn't aford a professional.......Just askin'?
  4. What would you have answered if your friend had asked you to do some dental work, as he couldn't aford a professional.......Just askin'?​
    Do you know many amateur dentists?
  5. I don't think that's a fair question, Robert.
    Dentistry is a licensed profession whose practitioner is accountable by law and by the governing body of their profession. They are also liable for faulty work and malpractice.
    Chris's question is entirely reasonable. It's more akin to substitute catering or a neighbour's teen providing DJ services; both are common occurrences in lower budget weddings.
    I don't have specific pointers to offer except to suggest diligently practice low light photography before the event in order to gain as much experience as possible, and to look at as many high quality wedding pictures to get some ideas on composition and subject matter.
  6. I found myself in a similar situation last year, being an avid amateur as well. First of all, if at all possible, scout all the locations before wedding. If the ceremony is in a church, check with church officials on their rules regarding photography. Check where you are allowed to stand and take photos.
    Also, remember that you can only be in one place at a time. I managed to get a bunch of good shots of the B&G walking down the aisle after the ceremony, but missed most of the cheering crowd outside the church door, as I was stuck behind the B&G.
    So, get as much facts about the venues as possible, and talk with the B&G about what they consider essential shots, and what they can live without.
  7. Rent or borrow backup equipment.
    Practice at all locations in the same time of day/light situation.
    Don't do any dentistry at the wedding.
  8. The only thing you can really do is practice taking pictures. Any pictures. Take at least 20 or more pictures per day. Learn your camera inside and out. On the day of a wedding, if you don't know what you are looking for, forget it. The pace is simply too fast. And a wedding is more about interaction than it is about photography. Meaning you either work well with everyone to get the best out of them... or you don't. The term "herding cats" is often used. I am not saying you don't need to know photography. But what you do know will fade into the background as you take your shots. You don't want to be learning it, or fiddling with it the day of a wedding. Besides that, get everything in writing. Including your lack of experience. Don't make any promises. The comment "though I am trying to use only natural light" scare the pants off me... why? This is often used when someone hasn't studied lighting so therefore will use only natural light because it's the best... according to someone somewhere. Light is light. What will you do if the natural light stinks?
    Anyway, get it in writing to cover you but, even if you aren't being paid. Clarify those expectations. As someone once said, there is a big difference between a bride before the wedding and one after. And do your best to simply learn your camera.
  9. remark was illustrative and somewhat tounge-in-cheek. But photographers have been in courts too....especially wedding photographers....for failure to provide work of an acceptable standard. Weddings are a major undertaking for the photographer, and he/she needs to know what they are doing to a standard of some sort.
    I saw a sign in a resturant once that said "fine food takes time and experience to prepare......Your order will be ready in a moment"........More humor, but you take my point...robert
  10. 430EX II (though I am trying to use only natural light)​
    Chris, natural light is great but this is by far an away the thing you need to practice with MOST. Yes anyone can slap a flash on their camera and put it on ettl and have it go off. Executing flash WELL is another story. Try to avoid the impulse to angle it straight forward. Just because that is how the pop up flash is angled on other prosumer models doesn't mean it is the best position. Either get a diffuser for it, or make a bounce card yourself. This is very easy for the 430. Just get a white index card and take a few rubber bands and put them around the top of the flash. Then when you are shooting have the flash pointed straight up so you bounce most of the light up, but some of it will bounce off the card and provide some fill flash as well. The quality of this light will be MUCH better than just pointing it straight forward. If you choose to have your flash on ettl, rather than manual mode and you are bouncing the light, you will likely need to set a positive exposure compensation. The other trick to try during the reception is if it gets dark, bring your iso down to say 500 or 800. Put your shutter speed down to around 1/30th, and then put the flash on about 1/2 power in manual mode. The flash will stop the motion, and the slower shutter speed will capture the ambient light.
    Practice bouncing the light and taking pictures of people with flash both indoors and outdoors. Do it until you get it right. Also, SHOOT IN RAW that day. It can really save your butt!
  11. Chris,
    Backup equipment is key. If your camera body malfunctions at any point during the day, you'll have no way to photograph the rest of the day.
    Next, you need to speak with the officiant. He/she will let you know where you can and cannot stand during the ceremony.
    Together with the B&G, put together some type of list so all of you know what the expected outcome will be in terms of who is photographed with who. Typically, the couples who are the most easy going upfront are the pickiest afterwards. That's because they have ideas in their head that they assume are "normal" and assume that you know that as well. You don't want to lose good friends over the "favor" you're doing for them.
  12. I hope you are not charging any money. If you are not, the liability/contract issues are out the window.
  13. "...are also liable for faulty work and malpractice." And if a professional photographer does the un-thinkable at a wedding, i.e., lose a couple of rolls of film or loses a memory card, life if full of roses? Lawyers make a living, too.
    "Put your shutter speed down to around 1/30th, and then put the flash on about 1/2 power in manual mode." Without knowing the non-pro's skill level ... unless you use a tripod or monopod, going to a slow shutter speed is not the best way to handle a wedding. People looking at wedding proof images like crisp images; a very experienced photographer may get into the 1/30th second range without a hitch. A wedding is not the place to see if it works...
  14. Robert, perhaps professionals are more sensitive to this sort of thing than amateurs. I simply see it as a case of a couple getting married on a limited budget and have likely set their expectations accordingly. I've attended backyard weddings with no photographer, just family taking happy snaps. Nothing wrong with that either.
    Chris stated he is an avid amateur, and by the sounds of it, preferred not to have been asked. But having committed, I can entirely understand why he'd want to responsibly do the best possible job with limited experience, and coming to for suggestions. It's true that fine food takes time and experience but sometimes you just need to eat thus doing the best you can with what you've got.
  15. Whether you are charging any money or not, you still need a contract and you need to set very specific expectations in that contract. If you set the expectation, in writing, that you are not a professional and will not be providing professional equipment/insurance/experience/results then there SHOULD be no wailing or gnashing of teeth.
    Remind the bride that the only thing that will last after the wedding day are the photos - is that really where they want to skimp?
  16. It might be worth it to read this:
    And while slightly out of date for specific gear, this:
    And if you care (since it's a bit more about the business/career end of things) this:
  17. Your 18-200mm should be very useful. You'll find yourself often going quckly from group shots to closeups of the couple, or an expression on mom's face.
    I'd say, be sure to attend any rehearsals. You can possibly do light readings, determine good shooting angles, etc. as well as familiarizing yourself with the agenda in advance.
    If weather and lighting are good outdoors the day of the event, take the party outside for photo shoots also. scout the area in advance at rehearsal to choose some possible good locations for such shooting. Use auto fill flash outdoors also.
    I'd say shoot RAW+JPEG. Some shots the JPEG might do fine, others you might want to process.
    I'm not a pro, but I have shot a few weddings of friends which turned out well.
  18. John Deerfield wrote: Take at least 20 or more pictures per day.​
    I had about three months to prepare for my first wedding. I was determined to do my best and not screw up.
    So I took more than 10000 practice shots :) Deliberate practice as they call it. Not just going around shooting flowers, sunsets and whatnot. A lot of work but fun as well.
    The wedding turned out to be a 15 hour baptism by fire but I didn't screw up and the B&G was happy with their images.
  19. William Michael

    William Michael Moderator Staff Member

    1. Considering your lenses and your passion to shoot without Flash: If inside or outside and evening or low light etc you'll be using the 50/1.8: Within 8ft to 25ft SD and the ability to move. The ability to move being the more important factor. You might need to negotiate that. If there is a Practice / Rehearsal go to that and nail the shooting positions for the key shots. If you have to make a choice between the B and G to be facing the camera: ensure the Bride’s Face is in shot.

    2. Considering your lenses and your apparent experience - shot with it; or use it to sidelight or rim the side of the subjects: do not shoot into it.

    3. Polite and Firm

    Also: everything that Nadine wrote and also more information please, as she requested.
  20. How well do you like your friend and do you want to keep your friend after the wedding? I'd stay away from this. There is almost no way you can take the wedding pictures and keep your friend. No matter how well you think you did, someone close to the bride, the groom or their neighbors will complain that you missed this or missed that. As a friend you can't walk away and you don't have the experience to point to as to why you took the pictures you did, or did not take.
    You cannot win this. Say you'd love to but you loaned your camera to your uncle in Tahiti and he won't be sending it back until after the wedding.
  21. Chris, Don't make any one scare you in not doing the Wedding. Pratice and know your camera's Aperture, speed and Iso, Learn how to use your camera and flash indoors and outdoors. Try not to fight with the Sun. If it is a group, use small aperture as 8 and up. Nadine is right check out all those things. Have the bride give you a list of who she wants to be done. Make sure you take the people on the list first before they vanish and can't be found, then take the bride and groom only and go crazy. But you have to give yourself a time limite of taking pictures so you don't slow the wedding down. Chris everything in the world is a learning process, even pro when they first started out had to get that first shot of what made them a pro. Good luck!
  22. Chris
    Get a family member committed to you to round up people for the various shots. How do you know who uncle Bill is?
  23. I've been in the same situation, and if you've stated your disclaimer and you end up losing them as friends, it's not your fault.
    To find the best position, well, you need to visualize what kind of photos you want to take. Start searching for complete wedding photos. This blog usually post slideshows of wedding photos. Go to a bookstore--plenty of resources in photography section (at least at Borders).
    I would rent a fast 17-55 (or equivalent) because I think a prime will make you the inexperienced lose shots. Go to the rehearsal, or arrive early on the day of. Plan your position and which lens. In the dim environment, know how much you can push ISO higher, and how low you can go with the shutter speed. If you use aperture priority, keep an eye all the time at the shutter speed you get, otherwise you'll get unexpected blurred shots.
    You have to know your camera really well and how to manipulate exposure quickly. I got my practice from shooting hiking and dancing events. You have to practice with moving subjects, too. Probably follow and shoot someone around the house. Good luck.
  24. Don't do it. You will try your best but the chances of it being even remotely good enough are so slim that only problems and heartache can ensue. There is certainly going to be someone in the wedding party who has been pushing for the images to be taken by some other friend or other "professional" who will create havoc and then, even the best intentions of the couple will definitely go completely down the drain...
    UNLESS, you have something like 4 months to practice and start attenting weddings one after the other, rent about 3,000 worth of equipment and learn how to use it inside-out, take more than 5,000 images for practice, learn how to use remote flash....oh, you get the idea...
    Seriously, stay out of it...if anything, gift them something towards getting a professional...
  25. Whether you are charging any money or not, you still need a contract​
    Two points:
    1. If there is no payment (or consideration) there can be no contract.
    2. Don't be daft. No one needs a contract just to take some pictures for a friend.
    Don't do it. You will try your best but the chances of it being even remotely good enough are so slim that only problems and heartache can ensue.​
    I have a different point of view: Do it!
  26. " If there is no payment (or consideration) there can be no contract."
    I'm no lawyer, but it would seem to me that a favor rendered with the mutual understanding of future reciprocity might constitute consideration, thereby forming an important element of a contract.
    I agree with the rest: Do it in the spirit of friendship and community.
  27. Thanks to all for providing some direction. Wasn’t expecting such so much so fast. I shall try and elaborate on some points:
    As far as trying to talk them into getting a professional photographer, I have made it very clear my level of inexperience and offered to chip in for a paid pro as a wedding gift. B&G say they can't afford it. After some quick research, a little under $1000 will get for a couple of hours work and a hand full of prints (event is in Brisbane, Australia if there are any recommendations). To that end I am going to try and compromise and talk them into at least doing this for the ceremony or getting protraits in thier wedding attire afterwards. They have asked far enough in advance that the uncle in Tahiti can find another camera, also there is still may be time for me to change their minds on getting a pro (It is in mid Aug. Very short notice for a professional I know..)
    The service will be in a church starting around midday. I have done a recce and there is a garden on site which I will be using which will also time in well for afternoon light and is the right orientation. I haven't been able to see inside the church yet though. The reception is on site as well so group shots can be done straight after the wedding and not eat into time as much. I have done several christenings and functions in low light with success (a far as the recipients were concerned) without flash. I will continue paractising as has been brought up several times.
    They have given me a rough itinerary for how they plan the day to go and a rough "who’s who" in the family. The brides mum has offered to help muster if need be. However, this is a couple who aren’t exactly punctual themselves.
    The use of natural lighting is my first choice because, as John rightly pointed out, I have a lot to learn about lighting. I should (organised but not yet confirmed) have access to a diffuser. I did know enough not to have the flash pointed directly at the subject. I still need to find out if I can use a flash inside. Slowing the shutter speed I can bring it down a fair way, I have steady hands. Again continue practise.
    I intended to shoot RAW for it as it’s basically set to that constantly anyway. However, where there may be an issue is, I have Paint Shop Pro as my editing. While this works for my hobby shooting I’m trying to get a hold of Adobe Photoshop CS5 as I find it easier to work with the layers with that then with Corel.
    Thank you all for your help so far.
  28. One last bit of advice. When I was working as a professional advertising photographer, I would get requests from friends to shoot their weddings and be paid for it. I always turned it down -- their friendship was more valuable. The only wedding I did shoot was on assignment for a national magazine. The magazine got the output, not the bride and groom. There is so much emotion tied up in the wedding that you cannot possibly please everyone in the family. They don't have to have any connection to the professional photographer after the ceremony and will feel free to criticize and forget. It is different with a friend -- they can't criticize and forget because the friend is still around. Nothing good can come out of this and regardless of the quality of the photographs, it will strain the friendship on both sides.
    Maybe suggest that all guests bring cameras and take some photos -- that way you won't be singled out as the guy who will not do as everyone pleases. I did go to a wedding some years ago where the wedding couple gave every guest a disposable camera when they arrived and collected them when everyone left. They has some of the best wedding pictures I have seen.
  29. I've been reading this with interest as I got back into photography just over a year ago to help out a friend at their wedding. In hindisght was I ready? Not by a long shot. Even now I would turn down being a primary shooter. But the other side of the coin is if I didn't, they would have had to rely on whatever they could get from family members shooting P&S. While my work was not of a professional level, it far exceeded what they would have had without me.
    Yes, the photos (and video) are the things that are carried forward, and yes they should be financially a priority. But guess what. For alot of couples they don't understand that. Their focus is on the celebration which is the wedding. Where possible we must try to educate others, but to expect others to share the same perspective and priorities as us is being a little narrow minded. I was reminded of that again this weekend. What I saw as substandard snapshots were seen as truly awesome by others. (and no I wasn't being paid for this.)
    Chris I think your suggestion is a prudent one, but as long as you have made your situation clear, it is their decision. Your photos may not be of a professional standard, but better that than nothing.
  30. What I am just not getting in many of these friend helping out a wedding couple is why is the friendship likely to be damaged if the pictures are not that great. I mean these people are suppose to be friends or family, why would the couple end up sueing them.
    What the hell is the matter with people , if I asked a friend or family member of mine to help me out and shoot my wedding for free why would I sue them if the pictures are not great or don't even come out. Come it's my friend why would I sue my friend. I would accept his/her explanation and tell them not to worry about it and buy them a beer.
  31. I don't think it is about suing. It is about hurt feelings, missed opportunities, reluctance to be candid, or just stress on the friendship. My thought is that it is not the close friend that will complain, but Aunt Clara, who will give the newly weds a tough time, making them feel bad and that will be transferred to the friend who will feel bad, the bride won't talk to Aunt Clara for years and Aunt Clara will write the couple out of her will. I can see the movie rights developing here...
  32. With new info:
    1. After finding out what the officiant/church will allow, follow their guidelines. Usually, the processional and recessional, possibly including the kiss, can be photographed using flash. After the bride and dad get to the altar is when you stop using flash, if flash isn't allowed.
    If you are allowed to be at the altar when photographing the processional, shoot from there, including the hand off of the bride. The best place is where the MOB sits, looking toward the back of the church, to your right, since the groom usually stands to the left. Otherwise, you will be in the way when the groom makes his entrance. Immediately after the hand off, move to the back of the church, unless the officiant allows total free access. Then quickly photograph the parents sitting in the pews before leaving that area.
    If not allowed to be at the altar for the processional, you are generally relegated to halfway down the aisle and toward the back of the church. Choose an empty pew. Stay in the pew until it is time to photograph each subject in the processional. Step out, photograph, and step back into the pews. After the bride and dad passes you, you can photograph their backs, including the train.
    If allowed free access, take free access. However, I personally would not get on the altar unless it is otherwise impossible to get any decent shots. Typically, you aren't allowed on the altar anyway.
    If you are allowed to move (some churchs require you stay in one spot throughout the ceremony), do so quietly and don't cross in front of the parents/front area. If there is a balcony, the best time is during the pastor's sermon, so you can get up and down again. The sermon is usually before the rings, vows, and candle lighting, if any. You usually want to be down on the 'floor' for those. I would advise you to attend the rehearsal, where you can both ask the officiant for the rules, and scope out the best spots. If you know what is to happen, you know where to be.
    Always be in the aisle, ready to photograph the kiss and recessional, when it is time.
    While you seem confident you can photograph in low light with your not-particularly-fast lenses, I would test to be sure. Go to the church at the same time of the ceremony, and take test shots, making sure your images are sharp in post processing, and free from motion or hand shake blur.
    If you have a tripod, I'd bring it.
    2. Not sure what you mean re lighting, but even shade is always preferred. If you can find even shade in the garden, that's where you want to be. Your lenses will be fine in brighter light.
    If the reception is indoors in darker rooms, or in low light, I would not shoot without the flash. You will be hard pressed to shoot action with shutter speeds that stop action, even with very high ISO. I don't know what the 'limits' are for ISO with the 50D, but I would not go higher than ISO 1600, ISO 3200 at the highest, if I could help it.
    For flash, go to Neil van Niekerk's blog and look for the tutorials about using on camera flash.
    3. I've already answered this, above.
  33. William Michael

    William Michael Moderator Staff Member

    Thanks for the additional information.
    1. I concur with Nadine's comments and suggestions.
    For clarity - I believe that Nadine is referring to what we might refer to as the "Sanctuary Area" when she wrote that she would not "get on the Altar" (during the Ceremony Proper).
    2. CHURCH I think that getting INSIDE the Church (at around midday) is a good idea, that will allow you to have some idea about the EV.
    I concur with Nadine, as I also am NOT as confident as you are, about shooting available Light, inside the Church.
    Let’s say this is a Church more suited to Available Light Shooting with lots of long and high windows in the style of the more modern Evangelical Churches – typically about EV 9 – 10 during day time when the Sun is shining.
    (Negating the 50/1.4) Assuming inside the Church we are using the 18 to 200, and will be at between 24mm and 35mm for most of the Full Length shots – we will be working at about F/4.5 as the fastest aperture available.
    That means (at EV10) we will be typically pulling about: F/4.5 @ 1/320s @ ISO800, which is fine and dandy right up to the point that the clouds come over and we drop three stops – or the B&G move to the front of the Church which is less illuminated by the side windows of the Church – and we drop 2 stops. Very quickly we can be at F/4.5 @ 1/80s @ ISO1600, which is doable for them standing at the Altar and maybe exchanging the rings, but very dangerous for the Processional / Recessional / the Kiss and etc.
    So keep, in mind that a Baptism and a Wedding are different in that a Baptism has fewer moving parts and is essentially in a smaller controlled area and also I expect the Baptism(s) you have covered have been in different Churches. So this is why I believe you need to assume you only have a 50mm lens - if you choose to shoot Available Light inside.
    2. OUTSIDE /FORMALS Outside - I agree that Open /even lit shade is best and safest.
    My first answer above was about using the Available Light more creatively assuming that you were skilled at it.
    If you are skilled and confident then yes use some side lighting and front lighting, if not then do not.
    Remember that front lighting can create squinting, or the need for sunglasses – neither of which is good for the Wedding Pictures – take these facts into strong consideration.
    And either way IMO do not shoot Available Light, shooting into the sun.
    2. RECEPTION At the reception I think you will be severly hampered attempting to shoot Available Light with those lenses listed - even more hampered than inside the Church.
    I belive unless the Church is very small - the shooting space you will have in the Reception Area, will be less than in the Church.
    The Rception Hall might be big . . . but the Recepetion has many more moving parts than the Wedding Service thus often rendering the space available in which to shoot, much smaller.
    A 24/1.4 would be more suited on a 50D.
    Or using a 5D/5DMkII with the 50/1.4
    3. Already answered.
  34. What I am just not getting in many of these friend helping out a wedding couple is why is the friendship likely to be damaged if the pictures are not that great. I mean these people are suppose to be friends or family, why would the couple end up sueing them.
    What the hell is the matter with people​
    It must be an American perspective. They seem to sue everyone over everything!
  35. It is not the friends that actually cause the problem. It is the relatives and other friends of the wedding party who will criticize the photos and directly or indirectly the bride and groom who will then feel bad for their friend and maybe their choice, then the friend who took the pictures will feel badly and the whole thing ends up with people who were good friends feeling badly about trying to do a good thing.
    Remember, no good deed goes unpunished.
  36. Remember, no good deed goes unpunished.​
    If every experienced pro can scare just one novice away from trying their first wedding, perhaps, together, we can stem this tide of newbies. (/sarcasm)
  37. It must be an American perspective. They seem to sue everyone over everything!​
    Steve, you can expect to hear from my lawyer about this horrible libel against Americans.
  38. An added challenge for a Friendor photog is that the B&G know you are just that, a friend, and not a photog. Therefore they won't respect you as much as they would a hired photog.
    I started out the same way and you have to get used to take a commending role before the wedding. Sit down with them and layout your plan to establish your authority. Do not just show up there on their wedding day with your camera and expect a miracle.
  39. William Michael

    William Michael Moderator Staff Member

    Regarding all the peripheral comments re: helping a friend; being sued; B&G’s expectations; how much the B&G respect you . . . and etc -
    Firstly, the B&G asked for assistance – the OP did not tout for business.
    Secondly, unless we live in a glass cage, mostly all of us make at least one judgement call in our lifetime as to when and where to assist family or friends.
    Helping someone out could backfire, yes that is a possibility: but it seems from his dialogue, the OP has made a due consideration of the situation and his relationship (to which we are NOT privy) and made his judgement call, based upon the friendship and his position in it.
  40. Here you go. Left side diagram is during the ceremony, right side diagram is processional.
    A is the typical 'behind the last seated guest' position. This is where you photograph overall views that show the architecture. If allowed, you can creep up to B, where you photograph with a tele, couple standing there, when they turn to each other, ring exchange, candle lighting, kiss at end. Red area is where you do not typically want to go.
    C and G are where (if allowed to move) you photograph each face as they are turned. I personally like to photograph the face when the other is speaking (vows), because talking makes the mouth move in sometimes unattractive positions. This might not be possible because of the time it takes to walk behind the guests (dotted lines), but you can usually manage one and then the other sometime during the ceremony.
    D is where you photograph the groom putting the ring on the bride, if you can even be there. This assumes you have enough time to get to the front aisle for when the bride puts the ring on the groom. This means you walk in the red zone, but if you are allowed to move, this would be OK--making it quick and silent. Otherwise, don't try it.
    The actual 'putting on the ring' shots are difficult, particularly if the altar is raised. You hardly see anything, particularly with the groom. You can always re-create.
    E and F are only if allowed. These are good if the couple is kneeling at a kneeler. Realize that sometimes, with all the flower arrangements and if the altar is small, you don't get any good views with D, E and F.
    Position 1 is the best, if allowed, for the processional. You get the groom, possibly the parents sitting in the pews, each processional subject, and the bride and dad. When the bride and dad are at the altar, you fall back slightly (if you have the room), and photograph the hand off, then disappear around to the side and back.
    Position 2 is if you aren't allowed close to the altar for the processional. Step out to take your shots and then step back in. As the bride and dad passes, photograph their backs, with some 'architecture', then as much of the hand off as you can from that position. You can also sometimes get the groom's face as he waits.
  41. Sorry--here's the image.
  42. That's an excellent illustration Nadine, good work!
    You might want to put in the recessional there as well to make it complete.
  43. Hmmm...recessional is just going back to point B, photographing the kiss, and then I walk backward (carefully and looking back so often). I sometimes stop behind the pews, to one side or the other, to photograph couples (wedding party) following, and other times, I go to where the couple ends up, to get the hugging shots.
  44. Not sure why or how I posted that!
    I remember now. I was trying to post this:
    Steve, you can expect to hear from my lawyer about this horrible libel against Americans.​
    Which proves that it is not libel so I win!
  45. Thanks a lot, Nadine.
  46. Good for you for being so honest with your friends. My thoughts as follows: Light: there won't be enough or there will be too much.
  47. Apologies for the delay,
    Luckily the couple have made some drastic changes to their plans, notably they have moved the ceremony outside and have found a professional photog to be primary shooter (they do car and bike photography but hey they still have more exposure then me)
    Thankyou all for your helpful information, I will still be second shooter for the wedding so will still get a great learning experience.

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