5DII My "Last" Camera?

Discussion in 'Canon EOS' started by bill owens, Sep 19, 2008.

  1. I used to own an Olympus OM-2 35mm film camera and was happy as a clam with it (and with the tiny, sharp Zuiko
    lenses). I was planning on keeping it forever...until the digital age dawned. Since then I've let myself get caught up
    in the DSLR "trade-up frenzy", enjoying the improved resolution and other features with each upgrade (and enjoying
    the nice resale opportunites afforded in this eBay age). I am reasonably confident, however, that once I can justify a
    20+ MP camera with truly low noise and good durability (like the 5DII), I will not feel compelled to trade up for many
    years to come. I'm curious how many amatuers like myself will also reach similar buying decisions, and if
    consequently the volume of sales might start to decline signiificantly for EXISTING amatuer DSLR owners--especially
    as the xxD models move into the 20+ MP range (as competition will force them to quicker than most might predict).
    Higher frame rates, better autofocus, improved dynamic range, etc. certainly will keep many trading up from the 5DII
    down the road, but we've clearly reached the point of diminishing returns on the BIG TWO: resolution and noise. I'll
    probably wait about a year to see where 5DII prices end up and buy my "last" digital body (well, maybe for a
    decade). Have any of you other posters on this forum from the xxxD or xxD worlds been "waiting" for the
    right "permanent" xD camera to show up before paying the big bucks?
     
  2. Well, I got a 10D, and liked the idea of the 5D, but decided to get an Epson R-D1 instead. So I decided to wait, and wait I have!
    Seriously, though, the 5DII seems to be a marked improvement, it has decent weather sealing, and appeals a lot to a person
    who would rather not haul around a chunky brick of a 1D(whatever). The high ISO will be great, even if the images are a bit
    noisy they can always be converted to B&W.

    So, yeah, I am a person who wanted the right camera to come along, and $2600 is a lot sweeter of a deal than $8000. It's also
    about the size of the unit. 22 MP is more than enough, and of course rivals or exceeds many medium format solutions for a tiny
    fraction of the cost.

    PS - waiting a year will only save you $100 or so at the most if past history is any indication.
     
  3. The 5D was my first digital, and was certain it would last me a decade (I still use my T90 and RT) until
    self-cleaning sensors came out. Now I am torn; 22mpix and self-cleaning sensor are certainly compelling reasons
    to upgrade, but I find myself thinking instead of the 50D. I am still content with film, and if I have to resort
    to film to shoot wide angle, that's easy. With the money saved, I could buy the new 24 f/1.4L II; if I skipped
    upgrading the camera altogether, I could also add a 50 f/1.2L. The 5D is certainly good enough for me (probably
    more than I deserve), and I'd rather have the lenses.

    To reconsider your original question, I guess there is no real 'right' camera for me, just a whole lot of 'good
    enough'.
    Of course, new toys are always fun.
     
  4. I actually somewhat feel the same way. I may also end up upgrading to the next 1D series in a year or two, but for a second body, i have a sneaking suspicion that the 5D2 might be 'it'.

    On a side note... don't let canon hear that :)
     
  5. Excellent question and one which I've often thought about. I guess the digital era is different to the film one where SLR feature sets were relatively constant within a price range, and you would keep a body essentially until it wore out. I thought when I finally converted from film to digital in the form of a 5D that I would keep using it for a long time, possibly even permanently. The 5DMkII, however, appears to be a major development at this price point, especially in high ISO performance as well as video (which we all say we don't need but I suspect we'll all find an excuse to use...). Until the DSLR sector matures (not for some time yet), there will continue to be significant improvements, and useful new features introduced. That "permanent" xD camera will not appear for a little while yet...
     
  6. i own the 5D.....amazing images at high ISOs....if the mk II does things that much better I'm buying it. having said that....my main concern is high ISO quality.....I shoot a lot of low light photogaphy and High ISO and fast primes are my main concern. Canon is pleasing me no end in this category.
     
  7. " but we've clearly reached the point of diminishing returns on the BIG TWO: resolution and noise."

    I sincerely doubt either of these are true. And even if they were, big boys want their toys so fancy cars, bikes, airplanes,
    cameras, guns, women or whatever, we will keep trading up to the latest and greatest. That's the way of the world and how
    we roll.
     
  8. "PS - waiting a year will only save you $100 or so at the most if past history is any indication."

    There are other FF players in the market now so there's a possibility that prices are going to be much more
    competitive. But even if the price goes down for $500 in a year that's a year without the camera... and when the
    price starts looking just about right there's an upgrade coming. You either buy what you want or wait forever. ;)

    On the other hand digital market feels much more mature now than when 5D came out. 5D mkII has good screen,
    plenty of resolution, faster operation... It looks like a camera that will be seriously good for many many years.
    Yes, even the 5D is but it still had annoying in-the-digital-beginning features - mkII feels much more all around
    ready, it's not about the resolution (for me).
     
  9. "I'll probably wait about a year to see where 5DII prices end up"

    How many great pictures will you miss out on? If you are going to buy it, now is the right time. Think of all the enjoyment the camera will give you now.
     
  10. I'm guessing that there won't be much price change--if any--on the new 5D after a year. The camera is already $600 less than the first 5D and is enormously improved. Waiting for the price to come down is pointless.
     
  11. My 'last camera' will be the one in my hands when I die. Technology will render any DSLR purchase obsolete at some point.
     
  12. Although there are some appealing things about this camera, I can't help thinking 22 mp is overkill. I shoot raw, and I
    struggle with storage now at 8.2 mp files. I wonder if I am alone is this regard, or are there others who see the file size as
    a negative point?
     
  13. Dan,

    I think that the answer to your question is that hard drives and DVDs are so cheap now that most people don't care. Personally, as long as IQ continues to increase, I'm fine with the file size increasing. I must admit though, when it comes to CF cards I did struggle until recently when "cheap" 16GB cards became available! Is that what you meant perhaps?
     
  14. I have a 20D and a 40D and decided 6 months ago that I needed (well, at least wanted!) a body with a full frame senor. I have been waiting for the 5D replacement and suspect that it will be a Christmastime purchase. I expect to get several years of use out of it, though it will have a shorter life than, say, my 1V from film days.For me, it was a question of the 20/40Ds being fine choices for my transition from film. I wanted to take some time to relearn photography using a digital body before plunking down the cash for a full frame body.
     
  15. I am using a 20D and 30D (bought the 20D used as a back-up) and am 99.5% certain that I'll be getting a 5D mk II. The 0.5% reservation is my wife which might turn into a 0% chance of purchase. I think this new camera will offer everything I need.

    That being said, while the dSLR market is starting to mature I would not be surprised to see some truly evolutionary changes in technology in our lifetime. Say, dynamic range for example. These are really mini-computers as much as they are cameras and I think we have not even scratched the surface of what is possible.

    Lots of my glass is 10+ years old but I doubt I'll hang onto any body for that long and I shoot most of my images at iso 100.
     
  16. "Although there are some appealing things about this camera, I can't help thinking 22 mp is overkill. I shoot raw, and I
    struggle with storage now at 8.2 mp files. I wonder if I am alone is this regard, or are there others who see the file size as a
    negative point?"

    Yep, you're totally alone here. Massive hard drives are dirt cheap and plentiful. I have a mountain of FW drives on under
    my desk, configured to RAID and auto backups. Of course all this started in the 90s "film scanning era," so a 21MP RAW
    file is tiny compared to the 4000 dpi 16 bit scans I used to do. I still have thousands of those 125MB TIFF monsters on my
    drives!
     
  17. Sorry bill but I`ve only been takin pics since 1965, still got 2 om2n`s and T90`s and several digis, last a 40d, am getting 5d2 soon, its not finished and as long as they get better and easier to use you`ll keep getting, unless you plan leaving :)
     
  18. "i own the 5D.....amazing images at high ISOs....if the mk II does things that much better I'm buying it. having said
    that....my main concern is high ISO quality.....I shoot a lot of low light photogaphy and High ISO and fast primes are
    my main concern. Canon is pleasing me no end in this category."

    you say that your images are amazing at high ISO. Why upgrade? The new Mk2 will have worst ISO performance.
    What is it that you hope to acheive by going to the Mk2? Same camera mroe or less, just more pixels to make your
    image noisier and your memory cards seem half the size.

    But then again, that is Canons whole philosophy.....'baffle 'em with pixels'.
     
  19. For Me the EOS20D has been good Enough have not bought into the 30D nor the 40D nor the 50D since none of them have any type of weather sealing like the Pentax K20D , BUT now if the EOS5D Mark II has weather sealing like the Pentax K20D , I better start saving for it :
     
  20. "you say that your images are amazing at high ISO. Why upgrade? The new Mk2 will have worst ISO performance. What is it that you hope to acheive by going to the Mk2? Same camera mroe or less, just more pixels to make your image noisier and your memory cards seem half the size."

    Tom, every reviewer who has had their hands on the pre-production models has said the exact opposite. Not only do you get double megapixels, you also get another stop or 2 of usable ISO.

    There are plenty of good reasons to upgrade to the 5D2.
     
  21. "Canons whole philosophy.....'baffle 'em with pixels'."

    I think every manufacturer employs this philosophy.
     
  22. I probably would have to upgrade not only my computer, but also all my flash cards if I upgraded to the 5D II right now. I have a Canon 30D and the 5D. I patiently(well not so patiently) waited for a 5D update until I could not wait any more.

    Personally for the work I do, I prefer shooting with the 30D. It's a more responsive and faster camera. For critical jobs, of course I prefer the low light and resolution of the 5D. If I can put up with the dust, I don't see myself upgrading to the 5D II any time soon. There is allot of other equipment I would like to get, such as studio lights, and a couple of lenses to add to my repertoire.

    I'm still working with Photoshop CS2.
     
  23. I'm planning on buying a 5DII and hope it will be my last DSLR buy for some 7-8 years, replacing the EOS 3 135 format body. Using a 40D for a while now has convinced me of digital merits - less jetsam and flotsam cr*p in the image compared with scans from old negs and tx., no blocky lego-like enlargements from old tx., and time to recapitalize on some more L-series primes over the next 5 years which will work wonderfully with a full-frame DSLR.

    I loved my OM system of yore, but it had electronic issues (40), sticky shutter (the 10s), and I haven't regretted the changeover one bit since buying L-series to replace the initial standard USM lens acquisitions.

    Everything wears out with time, but I'm surprised at how long the Ls keep going like new (although I do baby them a bit).
     
  24. Leo, Actually, it has to do with backup on reliable media, like the Mitsui Gold CDs. I can easily spend $40 to $60 or
    more making backups of RAW images from weddings now using mostly an 8mp camera (and I confess I make a double
    set--perhaps overly cautious, but it was a promise I made to myself went I went totally digital). I distrust DVD--even the
    gold ones--so CDs are my choice for archiving. So if I were to make the leap either I'd have to restrain myself when
    shooting (and I don't want to do that) or burn a heck of a lot more CDs. I am value driven and if I were to upgrade from
    the 20D and 1D bodies I use I'd probably choose the 1D Mark III--which looks like a very capable camera, or buy a pair
    of 1D Mark II cameras used. For what I'm doing I just don't need such a big file--I still use my original 4 MP 1D a lot and
    it's a great camera
    Dan
     
  25. I've probably said this 10-20 times here in the past, but the 40D was the perfect upgrade from the 10D. Side-by-side, the 10D is not useful at all (to me) anymore.

    I can see your argument how, if the 5D2 tests pan out as expected, that this 5D2 could be a keeper for 4-5 years (10 years is not practical).

    The 10D is slow, small LCD, slow, only 6MP, noisy above ISO 200, and slow.
     
  26. In 1970 or so, I traded up from a Kowa SLR to a Beseler Topcon SuperD. I couldn't afford a Nikon, but worked and saved to be able to afford the Topcon with my parents permission. I got that permission because I was honestly able to say I thought I would never need to buy another camera and that it should last a lifetime. It's on my shelf today, nearly 40 years later, damaged from my mother dropping it at some point, but probably fixable. But it won't get fixed. It's just a piece of nostalgia now. I also thought my wife's 5MB hard drive bought at the cost of nearly $1000 would "last a lifetime". I mean...how many letters can you possibly need to store at one time ? So now I never think that way. Ever. Except maybe for the 5DMKII I have on order. I doubt I'll ever need more than 21mp. :)
     
  27. Dan, I don't trust any media 100%, and DVDs are no exception. I always make sure my files are backed up in at least two places, and using different types of media too if possible. I don't think there's any reason to distrust DVDs any more than CDs. Just make sure it's a proven dye (Ritek F1 dye for example) that works with your burner (buy a small amount to test first), and a manufacturer with a good track record. No need for TDK Mitsui etc - companies like Traxdata make good enough media that you can trust them. I've been using their CDs for many years now and can attest to that. I think Verbatum also have a good reputation, but I've never tried theirs, though I might have to if I can't find any of the Traxdata -R's that I'm after!

    Even if you still don't trust DVDs, get yourself an internal hard disk drive caddy (less than 20 bucks), and back up straight to dirt-cheap HDD space. I just got one for my newly built PC (and a second for my old box which has yet to be installed), and they are great! You can "hot swap" HDDs while the PC is running for instance. For around the same price you were paying for CDs, you could get a caddy and hard drive/s to go with it with at least 200 GB of storage to get you started. It would be just as secure as CDs, and a lot less hassle IMHO.

    I'm not sure what I'd do if it wasn't for DVDs and cheap HDD GBs. Last time I went away on a 12 day photography trip, I came back with 20 DVDs full of photos, and that was a relatively un-eventful trip - it could easily have been double that! If I had had to do that with CDs, the whole 12 days would have been spent burning them!
     

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