Z 7ii ergonomics

I was recently at B&H and got to handle the Z 7ii.

I had my d810 with me. In short I was disappointed by the "feel" of the camera when not shooting.

My digital progression has been d200, d700, d810 and in all of those cameras the body just fit my hand. They felt familiar and comfortable. That comfortable feel has kept my with Nikon for many decades.

 

The Z7ii is smaller and I expected a bit of an acceptable different feel, but what "stuck out" was the textured joystick button between the "AF-ON" button and the "i " button. Pun intended. It really seemed to stick out. A lot. I could feel the texture at the base of my thumb.

I'm not sure what this button does and cursory web search does not help out, moves focus point maybe?

When I am walking with my camera I carry it with a wrist strap and hold it down by my side, fingers around the grip in the front and thumb across the upper third of the back. It hangs at the end of my arm.

Holding the Z 7ii that way had that button sticking into the base of my thumb in kind of an annoying way ergonomically and with enough pressure that I fear my thumb could be changing whatever setting that button controls, maybe adding a step to undo when I pull the camera to my eye to shoot. I shoot a lot of street and quick action, for example Mardi Gras

Does anyone else have this comfort issue; does it happen that the button is accidentally engaged to change settings? Have you changed your grip?

I will quickly add that when I put the camera to my eye my thumb falls right on that button as I am sure it was designed to do.

Any info appreciated and TIA

It's great to have access to a full line camera store to try this stuff out.

Hi, Sanford, I agree. I wish the regular Nikon rep was there--see my other posting

The button is the "sub-selector," whatever that is

I love that textured joystick. My D500 and D850 both have it. Its location and construction features makes it so much easier to move that focal point quickly and accurately. And having it close to the AF/ON is another plus if you use back button focusing.

My D500 and D850 both have it. Its location and construction features makes it so much easier to move that focal point quickly and accurately. And having it close to the AF/ON is another plus if you use back button focusing.

I like it too - but prolonged use really does a number on my thumb!

I love that textured joystick. My D500 and D850 both have it. Its location and construction features makes it so much easier to move that focal point quickly and accurately. And having it close to the AF/ON is another plus if you use back button focusing.

Thanks, Joseph & Deiter, for the responses.

I understand the functionality of it when shooting, but that is not what I am talking about.

It's about when NOT shooting, ie walking along just carrying the Z. I felt it poking into my thumb--so a "comfort issue"-- and I am asking if inadvertently pressing it can change a setting that must be undone before shooting, thus slowing you down and potentially missing shots?

For example, pressing in on that textured button...doesn't that lock focus and or exposure, or moves the focus point, etc? If I carry the camera at my side like a gun, turned on and ready to shoot, could inadvertent pressing that button just from holding the camera at my side cause exposure and focus to lock, or move the focus point far to the side, and when I lift the camera to shoot I have to "unlock" that inadvertent button press to get the camera to focus and set exposure?

That is my question.

 

I only played with the Z 7ii for about 10 minutes, so maybe I was misreading it, but in that 10 minutes I knew I didn't like that button pressing into my thumb.

I like to have the camera ready to go, so that I can lift and shoot immediately; if my thumb, because it rests on that button, changes a setting that, if unnoticed would create focus and exposure issue...that would not be good. In a studio, or if one uses a neck strap, that would not be a problem, but that is NOT how I am shooting.

Have you found that to be an issue at all? Is that a potential problem in your experience?

Edited December 23, 2021 by John Di Leo

Like you, I usually carry my camera in my hand - never had an issue with the joystick causing an issue as my thumb isn't resting on it when I just carry the camera. But most of the time I use the D500 and the D850 with long lenses and carry them by their tripod foot. Nonetheless, no issue even when carrying the camera by the grip; I just don't have my thumb on the joystick then.

 

For example, pressing in on that textured button...doesn't that lock focus and or exposure, or moves the focus point, etc?

Depends on how you configure it - I have it set to give me a certain AF area mode and that pressing down on it initiates focusing (acts as AF-ON). Moving it in either direction moves the focus points. My main issue is to press straight down on the joy stick so that I don't inadvertently move focus point. When the camera goes into standby mode; moving or pressing the joystick does nothing. So yes, potentially you could change a setting; for me, it was never an issue. I did test drive the Z7 - my main issue with it was that the body is just simply too small. Felt better in the hand than any of the Sony A7 bodies I've used though. And with those, pressing the wrong button certainly can creates issues.

I always thought it a bit odd that the rotary lock on the 4way on the D850 locked the little rubber joystick too....!

Hmm.

@dieter, so your thumb, naturally, does not fall right on that button-as mine does, or do you now remember to move your thumb away from it?

Stand-by mode...how long before it goes into that, is that user configurable and waking it up, if you see a spontaneous fleeting shot, takes how long and how is it accomplished? Does the operation hinder spontaneous street shooting, eg from the hip or put up to the eye? Walking around NYC I had my manual 20/2.8 on the d810, set at f8, utilizing a pretty wide hyperfocal distance, but what that allowed was very quick shooting, sometimes just aiming it from my hip and pressing the shutter; IOW no standby, no need to awaken, no worry about pushing some button that would throw the shot off. I do not want to lose that.

 

Sorry, for the basic questions, but the user manual online is very lacking. My dslrs had 400 page user manuals, but the one I found online for the Z 7ii was very skimpy. I went to ken Rockwell, that helped some, Youtube has reviews, but not on the nuts and bolts of operation.

Is there a site that goes into the day to day basic operations of the camera? I know this sounds very noob, but the progression from d200 to d700 to d810 (and probably d850) was a very natural progression in that if the operator was familiar with Nikon slrs and later dslrs, they could just pick up and shoot. There may be more menu choices and different capabilities, but that would be about it...at least for me it was that way. The Z seems to be a different animal.

Since you carry your camera the same way I do, do you find the balance of body:lens distracting, or again, something you get used to?

 

Thanks for the replies.

You may need to download two "camera" manuals. The Users manual and the reference manual I do not know if both are in the box with the camera.

And the firmware manual

 

Nikon | Download center | Z 7II

@dieter, so your thumb, naturally, does not fall right on that button-as mine does, or do you now remember to move your thumb away from it?

I don't have big hands and when I carry the D500 or D850 by the grip, my thumb rests just between the joystick and the AF-ON button. I can't recall where my thumb fell on the Z7.

Stand-by mode...how long before it goes into that, is that user configurable

Yes, C2 on the D500 and D850; C3 on the Z7. Waking up from stand-by for a DSLR is instantaneous by (half-) pressing the shutter release, AF-On or joystick (probably any button); not so much for any mirrorless I have encountered so far - certainly to the point where a spontaneously arising situation would be missed. At least for one of my Sonys it started up faster from the OFF position than it woke up from stand-by; both times were long enough to miss a shot that required an instant response.

 

The Z seems to be a different animal.

I don't own any NIkon Z body so I can't check what the wake-up times are.

When I tested out the Z7 I realized that it was sufficiently "NIkon" to let me shoot right away - but there are substantial differences when it came down to the details of operation (especially AF). The grip on the Z bodies I handled is fine but overall, I find the cameras to be too small. On my A7R3, I added a Meike grip extension that makes things more comfortable. Depending on the lens mounted, there can be preciously little space between my fingers and the lens body. Quite certain that won't be an issue with the Z9 (which is the only Nikon Z-mount body I am actually considering owning).

Just before Christmas I had an accident with my D750 falling with my largest lens on and breaking the coupling ring off the camera. I decided not to have it repaired and went for the Z7 II. I kept it for a week (the merchant had a 14 day return policy). Overall I really did not like the feel of it and did not like the AF system as I do bird photos. Not to mention that it is very light and when adding the adapter and my large lens it did not feel right... Battery life was also problematic (the digital viewfinder and the processor using a lot of juice), so I would have had to buy a grip for stability and a battery plus the adapter (of my current batteries only the genuine Nikon ones would work). I could not wait for the release of the Z9 to test it, so I returned and exchanged it for a D850. Overall I was disappointed with the Z7 II...

D850 to Z7 here. It's nice to have choices. As one who is backpacking and lugging the stuff around, I am delighted at the 1+ pound I shed going to the Z7. Smaller, lighter, IBIS, a great advance.

Startup time in landscape is not an issue. It is noticeable, but I just turn the camera on as I swing it up to my eye. My only "dislike" was a moment in the Zion backcountry when it was so beautiful that I shot for several minutes straight. When I took my eye from the EVF I had a moment of vertigo. Luckily I wasn't standing on a ledge or cliff.

I do find the sensor a little noisier than the D850, but the IBIS lets me hand hold longer at base iso to avoid that.

Textured button? I forgot about it immediately. Don't use it and don't notice it.

I don't think I ever hit the sub-selector accidentally with my thumb, I keep my thumb to the right of it. However, I understand people have different hands and different ways of gripping cameras that feel comfortable. I think we can for the most part adapt to things.

 

I don't have the Z7 II but I do have the Z6 II (which is probably identical in the shape of the body and controls) and I think it's great for hand-held shooting with relatively small lenses (such as the f/1.8 primes). However, for tripod use I find it annoying that the terminal for the cable release is sticking out from the left side and I find it quite fiddly to insert the cable release (MC-DC2) and use it with an L-bracket. So I mostly use now the exposure delay mode and ignore the remote release capability. Sometimes I would like to time shots precisely, e.g. how the water flows, or a flower moves within the frame, and the cable release is generally how to do it. I don't find the MC-DC2 to have as good a tactile feedback as the MC-30A I use on my DSLRs. Thankfully the Z9 has a front-side 10-pin connector so MC-30A can be used (and does not interfere with L-bracket use). One could ask why I don't use a regular QR plate and the answer is that I prefer that the camera both in my horizontal and vertical shots stands directly on top of the head. The tripod screwhole in the bottom of the camera is also very close to the front of the camera which means most L-brackets not specifically made for the camera don't fit, and one has to find a special one.

 

Also the Z6 II (Z7 II) is a bit too small for my taste and as a result of the limited real estate it has too few physical controls (lenses, too; VR switch is now in a menu rather than on the lens). I find myself often having to go to the i menu or my menu to change settings when I go from one subject to another and this is a definite step back from what I'm used to. It's a bit like Nikon didn't really think people would use a tripod with these cameras.

 

Regarding the "joystick" and focus point selection, many people seem to be happy that the focus points can be selected almost all over the sensor area but when I'm photographing moving subjects, I would like to limit the selection a bit so that the focus point doesn't accidentally move too far out, and then I'd end up chopping off someone's top of the head. If there could be a user-defined rectangle limiting where the focus point can be moved that would be helpful. Yes, it's good that the focus area is not so limited by the technology but I'd still like the option of limiting it in order to make it easier to ensure the most important part of the subject is within a reasonable area of the frame when trying to work quickly.

Edited January 3, 2022 by ilkka_nissila

I sort of solved the remote control issue by installing the WR-R10 and "hiding" it inside the L-bracket. Via WR-T10 it can be triggered with a better tactile response than MC-DC2. However, the 10-pin connector seems to me a more secure mount and I would like Nikon to offer it across the lineup. Anyway the good thing about WR-R10 and T10 is that there is no cable so it's less stuff hanging about, the drawback is the required battery in the handset.