4,5/135mm Skopar lens filter size - Avus 9x12

<p>Hi All,</p>

<p>Is there any info on the filter size of the 4,5/135mm Skopar lens of Voigtlander Avus (9x12) camera?<br>

I made some research on the net and according to the original manuals, it has 36.8 mm filter size - I am not sure wheteher I would need screw-in or push-on filter.</p>

<p>Basically, I would like to use 37--->49 mm adapter - is it possible?</p>

<p>Please help - any info is highly appreciated.</p>

<p>Many Thanks,</p>

<p>Zoltan</p>

 

<p>Zoltan,</p>

<p>It requires a push-on filter.</p>

<p>Not only the 36.8mm Voigtlander, but any 37mm push-on type will work--although you may need to bend in (ever so slightly) the pressure tabs on the side of the filter, in order to provide a snug fit.</p>

<p>The traditional approach would be to obtain individual (non-interchangeable) press-on filters and lens hoods (designed to press onto the front of either the lens itself or a filter); or to get a push-on, 37mm "Series VI" filter adapter ring, and interchangeable (rimless) Series VI glass filters and lens hoods to insert in it.</p>

<p>To do what you're thinking of (i.e., create a "platform" for readily available 49mm screw-in filters), you can use the following approach: first, get a 36.8mm or 37mm push-on filter, and remove the glass; then, get a modern step-up ring whose shallow inside (male) thread will fit snugly just inside the front rim of the (now glass-less) push-on filter; then use contact cement to glue it there, permanently in place. You may have to use a little creativity in doing this (e.g., cut a tiny strip of thin leather or paper to use as a gasket, to ensure a snug fit before gluing; or perhaps, roughen the metal edges to allow the contact cement to grip securely, etc.) but it can be done. Once done, you'll have a press-on "platform" that can hold any modern 49mm filter. (You'll always have to handle it with care, of course, especially when pushing it onto the lens, and pulling it off. The contact-cement will not provide great strength, but if handled carefully, it will be plenty strong enough for the purpose.) </p>

<p>The old push-on filters vary in shape, rim configuration, outer diameter, etc., according to who made them. You should wait until you have a suitable one in hand, therefore, and then measure it (with glass removed) to figure out precisely what size step-up ring to obtain, and how best to cement the two pieces together.</p>

<p> </p>

<p>Ernest, thanks for your tips.</p>

<p>It seemed for me that there is a thread in the inner side of the rim of the lens - that is why I am thinking on the 37-49 mm adapter. I will doublecheck it and hopefully find the final solution.</p>

<p>Z.</p>

<p>Zoltan,</p>

<p>The thread on the inside of the front cell allows the thin retaining ring (the ring that holds the front glass element in place, with the lens nomenclature inscribed on it) to be screwed in or out. This is how the lens-cell was assembled.</p>

<p>I think you'll find that it doesn't have the correct thread pitch to accept a filter.</p>

<p>FWIW, Voigtlander designed the lens only to use push-on filters, and made the necessary 36.8mm push-on filters to fit the lens. These are the only style of lens accessories that Voigtlander sold, or advertised in the catalogs of that period (i.e., no screw-in type).</p>

<p> </p>

<p><strong>"I think you'll find that it doesn't have the correct thread pitch to accept a filter."</strong><br>

<strong> </strong><br>

You should be right, I just discussed this with the man who serviced my camera and told me the same. Most likely, I have to find a 37mm push-on filter for further conversion.</p>

<p>I am surprised a little bit since many people use Avus recently, but I did not find any useful info on the net about this issue.</p>

<p>Thank you again, Ernest.</p>

<p>Z.</p>

<p>Zoltan, you're welcome.</p>

<p>Below are a couple of examples of what you'll need (either to use alone, or to remove the glass and cement to a step-up ring). Both of these say "shipping to Germany only", but if you politely email the seller, they might say OK: </p>

<p>http://cgi.ebay.de/Gelbfilter-Voigtlaender-36-8_W0QQitemZ230454958487QQcmdZViewItemQQptZDE_Elektronik_Computer_Foto_Camcorder_Foto_Camcorderzubeh%C3%B6r_PM?hash=item35a82f9997</p>

<p>http://cgi.ebay.de/Aufsteck-Farbfilter-Gruen-37mm-fuer-Kompaktkameras_W0QQitemZ350334020628QQcmdZViewItemQQptZDE_Elektronik_Computer_Foto_Camcorder_Foto_Camcorderzubeh%C3%B6r_PM?hash=item519188ec14</p>

<p> </p>

<p>The Kodak Series adapters are reasonably common on eBay, and are reasonably adjustable. Find one sized for the outside diameter of the lens barrel. Then either use Series filters with retaining rings (they are common), or get a Series to mm step-up ring.</p>

<p>John Shriver,</p>

<p>Have you ever actually seen a "Series to mm" step-up ring?</p>

<p>I ask, because I searched for years to find such critters (for a whole variety of older lenses) and have never found one in any size.</p>

<p>Sometimes "Series to mm" rings were/are listed by dealers and eBay sellers, but the actual items have always turned out (in my experience) to be the opposite: i.e., they're all "mm to Series" rings that enable a modern lens with an inner female filter thread to accept the older Series filters.</p>

<p>I realize that the male thread of a modern 44mm filter can be forced into the front of a push-on Series VI adapter, so a modern 44mm step-up ring (very scarce) could do the job. Or a modern 43.5mm step-up ring (common), with the help of contact cement to hold it in, also could do the job, similar to the jury-rig that i suggested.</p>

<p>But since you mentioned a "Series to mm" adapter, I'm curious to know if you have actually found what's been so elusive to me.</p>

<p>Information from another site that is presumed to be correct:<br>

Adapter ring outer size:<br>

from 3/4"-1 3/16", 19mm-30mm Series V <br />From 1 1/4-1 21/32",32mm-42mm Series VI <br />from 1 11/16- 2", 43mm-51mm Series VII <br />2 1/16-2 5/8", 52mm-67mm Series VIII.</p>

<p>Retainer ring thread diameter:<br>

Series IV 13/16" 23mm filter threads <br />Series V 1 3/16" 34mm filter threads <br />Series VI 1 5/8" - 44mm filter threads <br />Series VII 2" 55mm filter threads <br />Series VIII 2 1/2" - 65mm filter threads <br />Series IX 3 1/4" - 85mm filter threads<br>

Thread pitch unknown; step up rings of the above sizes may be close enough to fit into the series adapter securely enough to use standard thread in filters.</p>

<p>For anyone who stumbles across this thread in future, who is not already familiar with the basics of the "Series" filter system--that is, for anyone whom I've confused--the following clarification may help, and is offered in penance:</p>

<p>1. <em>Series adapters</em> come in two styles: <em>push-on adapters</em> (which fit around the outside of a lens rim--used mainly on early lenses, pre-1940), and <em>screw-in adapters</em> (made to fit the various non-standardized female filter threads of later lenses--mostly 1940's-1950's--before the modern screw-in filter sizes, with their uniform thread pitch, were adopted in the 1960's). </p>

<p>2. A flat glass filter is laid into the recessed face of the adapter, and a <em>Series retaining ring</em> is then screwed down over the filter, into the front rim of the adapter, holding the filter in place. </p>

<p>3. Instead of a retaining ring, a <em>Series step-up ring </em>can be screwed into the front of any Series adapter. The face of a step-up ring is wider than the adapter it fits on, and is made to accept the next-larger-Series size of filter. (E.g., a Series VI-to-Series VII step-up ring will enable a Series VI adapter to hold Series VII filters.) </p>

<p>4. John suggested getting a "Series-to-mm" step-up ring that would screw into the front of a push-on Series adapter: such a ring would have a Series-standard male thread in back, and a wider female thread in front, made for modern-pitch, modern-size screw-in filters. (This kind of configuration in a Series step-up ring is what I haven't ever found, although I spent a lot of time and effort searching.) </p>

<p>Apologies for any confusion caused.</p>

<p> </p>

<p>Charles, the chart provides the closest equivalences between Series threads and the threads on modern filters. But the pitches are different, and (in my experience, anyway) only the Series VIII-to-67mm coupling is a reliably smooth fit. The others can be jury-rigged (forced if too-tight, or contact-cemented if too loose).</p>

<p>It's probably worth noting that the precise size of male and female "Series" parts from different makers (Kodak, Tiffen, Ednalite, etc.) can vary. In a few cases, a Series adapter from Maker A may not accept a same-Series retaining ring from Maker B. The size-standardization of the "Series" system--such as it was--only applied to the glass filters, not to the supporting hardware.</p>

<p>Zoltan's lens, with its 37mm OD, calls for a Series VI push-on adapter, if he's going to use this system. A 44mm-to-larger-mm step-up ring can be screwed into it, although it's not a perfect fit. But 44mm is not a common filter size, and step-up rings with 44mm male threads are not often offered.</p>

<p>If Zoltan buys a Series VI adapter, then is unable to find a 44mm step-up ring to use with it, he could instead use a Series VI-Series VII step-up ring, and kludge a modern 55mm step-up ring (or an empty 55mm filter frame) into the front of that. However, this could become a rather wide, large, heavy setup for the front rim of a 135/4.5 Skopar.</p>

<p>All, thank you for the huge amount of input - I checked this forum just now since yesterday evening.</p>

<p>I am not familiar with Series XXX filters/adapters and they are available in the US mainly (I live in Hungary and tax is not an issue whithin the EU) so most likely, I will try first an old 37 mm push-on filter rim + glue + modern 37->49 mm adapter combo.</p>

<p>I promise, I will refer later.</p>

<p>Many thanks again,</p>

<p>Zoltan</p>

<p>Zoltan,</p>

<p>"The old push-on filters vary in shape, rim configuration, outer diameter, etc., according to who made them. You should wait until you have a suitable one in hand, therefore, and then measure it (with glass removed) to figure out precisely what size step-up ring to obtain, and how best to cement the two pieces together." (repeated from the first response to your OP)</p>

<p>A word of caution: almost certainly, a modern "37->49mm" adapter ring will NOT fit inside the opening of an older, 37mm push-on filter, as you seem to expect. It will be too wide.</p>

<p>In the case of the modern adapter ring, "37mm" is an INSIDE measurement (it refers to the diameter of the threads inside a lens barrel). In the case of the older push-on filter, "37mm" is an OUTSIDE measurement (it refers to the outside diameter of a lens barrel).</p>

<p>A lens barrel that is 37mm wide on the outside, cannot also be 37mm wide on the inside.</p>

<p>The most likely fit for your purpose (i.e., the size of step-up ring that can mate with a 36.8mm or 37mm (OD) push-on filter, with the help of contact cement) is one with a 35.5mm male thread, such as this:</p>

<p>http://cgi.ebay.com/35-5-49mm-35-5mm-49mm-Step-Up-Ring-Lens-Adapter_W0QQitemZ250517308262QQcmdZViewItemQQptZDigital_Camera_Accessories?hash=item3a53fec366</p>

<p>Again, however: the old push-on filters varied greatly from maker to maker, in their construction and rim size. That's why, if you want to avoid frustration and wasted money, you would do well to wait until you have a suitable push-on filter in hand, and then measure its front opening precisely, before getting the step-up ring.</p>

<p>Good luck with it.</p>

<p>Ernest,</p>

<p>I checked <strong><a href="http://www.heliopan.de/preise.shtml">Heliopan's website </a></strong>and found an interesting animal in their recent catalouge: filters with size of 35,5×0,5!<br>

Somebody mentioned on the APUG forum that the inner diameter of the Skopar's lens barrel is 35,5mm. As far as I know modern filter threads have a size of 0,75, so maybe this 0,5 version would fit???</p>

<p>I just contacted Heliopan - let see what they say...</p>

<p>Best,</p>

<p>Zoltan</p>

 

The 37mm accessories that fit the Avus also fit the lens of the rare Vito 3.