denny_rane Posted September 20, 2021 Share Posted September 20, 2021 For some reason i have never done it. I have metered cement, my hand, a few different pairs of shorts that are virtual gray-cars, but never blacktop. For "Typical" blacktop that is a few years old, like in a parking lot, what Zone does it seem to fall in, 3...4...5.? Thank You Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rodeo_joe1 Posted September 20, 2021 Share Posted September 20, 2021 Wet? Dry? Lit at a high angle? Or a low one? All these factors, and more, will change its reflectance by a factor of 10 or more. It has no standard Reflectance. And surely the whole point of the Zone system is to place an object's tone exactly where you want it to be? Otherwise you might just as well take an incident reading and be done with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sanford Posted September 20, 2021 Share Posted September 20, 2021 Digital camera? Just take the photo and adjust exposure to taste. If film, you could apply the "Sunny 16" rule. Worked well enough for slides. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JDMvW Posted September 20, 2021 Share Posted September 20, 2021 Unless you're shooting transparency films, film latitude and sunny-16 will almost always produce adequate images, especially if you're scanning them in. Digital? forgedaboutit. Use the sliders in post processing. rodeo_joe asks the right questions, as he often does.:rolleyes: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
conrad_hoffman Posted September 20, 2021 Share Posted September 20, 2021 But like many gurus, mystics and wise men on top of the mountain, his questions probably have no answers. :-) I've seen blacktop in just about every shade, from bleached to very black. Whether it's been sealed recently will make a huge difference. Put it in any Zone that works. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ed_Ingold Posted September 20, 2021 Share Posted September 20, 2021 Asphalt can range from dark (5) to light gray (8). Do you care what it is? Asphalt makes an uninteresting subject. When in doubt measure the palm of your hand (8) or use an incident meter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
denny_rane Posted September 20, 2021 Author Share Posted September 20, 2021 I was just, simply, curious. I shoot 35mm film but that is meaningless. Blacktop top "during the day" compared to a gray card. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
q.g._de_bakker Posted September 20, 2021 Share Posted September 20, 2021 Green foliage (grass, tree leaves, shrubs, etc.) is a good grey card substitute. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inoneeye Posted September 20, 2021 Share Posted September 20, 2021 r_ j has a very lucid response for day or night. 2 i n o n e e y e Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary Naka Posted September 21, 2021 Share Posted September 21, 2021 I was just, simply, curious. I shoot 35mm film but that is meaningless. Blacktop top "during the day" compared to a gray card. As was mentioned, "blacktop" has MANY different shades, from very faded light grey to BLACK. Age, the other "stuff" in the blacktop, and the amount of visible asphalt affect how light or dark it is. What shade of grey/black is YOUR blacktop? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rodeo_joe1 Posted September 21, 2021 Share Posted September 21, 2021 But like many gurus, mystics and wise men on top of the mountain, his questions probably have no answers. Not sure if that's a compliment or a sideways insult. I don't mind either way Conrad, but I lay no claim to anything more than a (hopefully bit less than) lifetime's involvement with photography. If you want some more mysticism - The best answers make you question your own question. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
denny_rane Posted September 21, 2021 Author Share Posted September 21, 2021 Wow.! You guys have some REALLY F'd Up blacktop where you live. We have 100s of miles of highway, county road and strip-mall pavement that is 97% the same color. Took several readings yesterday.................it all hits about Zone-4. Well, now i know. :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
conrad_hoffman Posted September 21, 2021 Share Posted September 21, 2021 [uSER=2403817]@rodeo_joe|1[/uSER] - Hey, nothing but the greatest respect here. We fossils have to stick together. As for our blacktop, this is the northeast, where everything gets weathered, not to mention it's salt country. The sealer guys have all been out in force the last few weeks, getting driveways ready for winter. I wanted to say guys & gals but I've never seen a gal sealing a driveway. Ever. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
httpwww.photo.netbarry Posted September 22, 2021 Share Posted September 22, 2021 "Black" top can really be a range of tones as Rodeo_Joe and other stated. But if you want a rule of thumb of where it might be, take a tonal Zone chart in your bag, and just eyeball it and meter accordingly. If you just want a decent exposure you can use and averaging meter or just use the sunny 16 rule. I agree with JDM, with most film lattitude, especially b/w as long as its decently close it will be fine. When shooting digitally, you can, if your camera lets you, set your exposure mode on spot and use your wysiwyg finder and you can just move it around and set the exposure wherever it looks good to you, sort of an instant visual zone system. If you are using medium format or large format, especially large format, using the zone system is the way to go, I would say. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rodeo_joe1 Posted September 23, 2021 Share Posted September 23, 2021 (edited) Not to labour the point... But. There aren't many real life objects that even get close to being true black - i. e. having zero or very little Reflectance. Closest you're likely to get 'out in the wild' is probably something like 2% reflectance (maybe an animal with black fur or someone's black woollen coat). Which is just under Zone 2, taking 18% Reflectance as Zone 5. So Zone 4 makes it "Darkgraytop", rather than Blacktop.:cool: However, a rainy day will soon change all that, and reflections from a wet and shiny surface can have almost any possible Zone value. Just stick to TTL or incident metering. Even Saint Ansel couldn't get his Zone number sums to add up straight! Edited September 23, 2021 by rodeo_joe|1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
denny_rane Posted September 25, 2021 Author Share Posted September 25, 2021 Not to labour the point... But. There aren't many real life objects that even get close to being true black - i. e. having zero or very little Reflectance. Closest you're likely to get 'out in the wild' is probably something like 2% reflectance (maybe an animal with black fur or someone's black woollen coat). Which is just under Zone 2, taking 18% Reflectance as Zone 5. So Zone 4 makes it "Darkgraytop", rather than Blacktop.:cool: However, a rainy day will soon change all that, and reflections from a wet and shiny surface can have almost any possible Zone value. Just stick to TTL or incident metering. Even Saint Ansel couldn't get his Zone number sums to add up straight! I am pretty much a "Street Photographer". And yeah, i use the camera meter 99% of the time. Generally speaking, i am either in some type of sun or some type of shade. I meter both and usually do not take another reading unless the light changes pretty drastically. The "Blacktop" question was merely academic. It is so ubiquitous, i was surprised i had never metered it before. I carry an incident meter, but i rarely use it. In the right situation though, i am glad to have it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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