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Pixii Digital Rangefinder


Colin O

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collapsible lenses?

Those are quite nice to have.and would IMHO go very well with a techy toy camera like the Pixii, to carry it concealed under your jacket, for example. OTOH: There are no frame lines for the 90mm macro.

can only use primes

Tri-Elmars too (but I am too cheap to get one of those).

They claim to have a global shutter sensor which is intriguing if true.

Good point! - The M8's shutter & recocking seem as loud as my EOS 5D IV and rolling shutter, as strongly experienced with other electronic ones, is no fun at all.

I imagine a wealthy person would just get an M10 or M10R, why settle for less than the "real thing"?

Imaginable reasons:

  • Your "playflow" demands the smart device connectivity offered by Pixii
  • You have to operate really silently, instead of "kinda quietly" as offered now by the M10 series.
  • How about being a collector / monopoly breaker / something else, not happy toting a Leica?

I'm not sure where to mentally sort the Pixii pricing. - I believe the Epson was "2 comparable mid range DSLRs", so Pixii appears more expensive although it lacks bells and whistles offered by the Epson back in it's day?

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I must admit, I'm following this one with mild interest. I miss shooting a rangefinder and this ticks a lot of my personal boxes, particularly if the whole smartphone integration is optional rather than essential.

 

I'll be very interested to read Hamish Gill's review when he posts it.

 

I'm curious as to how well the rangefinder will handle long, fast lenses like the 7artisans 75/1.25. That would be a deal breaker for me. Leica lenses are rather out of my price range.

 

I wonder if one of the Chinese manufacturers will launch their own rangefinder one day, perhaps based around an off-the-shelf Sony sensor and an existing shutter?

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I'm curious as to how well the rangefinder will handle long, fast lenses like the 7artisans 75/1.25.

Pixii page specifications: "Viewfinder

Optical viewfinder with coinciding rangefinder (magnification 0,67X)

Independent LED backlit framelines for standard prime lenses: 28mm, 35mm, 40mm and 50mm

Exposure indicators and focal length confirmation

Automatic parallax correction

Automatic LED intensity adjustment

framelines" <- Nothing beyond 50mm mentioned. Forget "long", which is a pitty because

Leica lenses are rather out of my price range.

isn't true in that field; 135mm Elmars don't fetch fortunes.

I wonder if one of the Chinese manufacturers will launch their own rangefinder one day

The Chinese industry proudly presented an now ultra rare M3 knock off under chairman Mao.

Konost seemed to have been another startup dreaming of having their RF built in China?

To me the easier money and safer bet seems to be what already exist: An AFing module, to be placed between great Japanese camera and (adapted to) M lens. Its kind of future proof, working with soon to be (or already?) 4 generations of Sonys.

 

What is there to gain in a me too camera project?

What would we pay Yongnuo for a new "EOS 5 D Mk 1.5"-ballpark body right now? And why would we?

 

Why are you dreaming of ultra(!) fast glass on a 3rd party digital rangefinder? That stuff doesn't work overly well (or likely) on original Leicas due to optical and mechanical challenges and limitations of the concept.

I suppose the way to get it handled gracefully (as the manufacturer!) would be coming up with a proprietary RF coupling, that doesn't translate the longer lens' movement into a 50mm's, paired with a longer RF base than the Ms'. Real world usability of the result of course still "questionable"; but at least it is all "user error" and not the camera to blame...

 

Why don't we dream using RFs for what they are really good for?

  • Focusing dim & compact lenses for flash photography in an available darkness, where the other concepts, ground glass or sensor based, have given up maybe already 3 to 4 f-stops ago.

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Why are you dreaming of ultra(!) fast glass on a 3rd party digital rangefinder? That stuff doesn't work overly well (or likely) on original Leicas due to optical and mechanical challenges and limitations of the concept.

I suppose the way to get it handled gracefully (as the manufacturer!) would be coming up with a proprietary RF coupling, that doesn't translate the longer lens' movement into a 50mm's, paired with a longer RF base than the Ms'. Real world usability of the result of course still "questionable"; but at least it is all "user error" and not the camera to blame...

 

Why don't we dream using RFs for what they are really good for?

  • Focusing dim & compact lenses for flash photography in an available darkness, where the other concepts, ground glass or sensor based, have given up maybe already 3 to 4 f-stops ago.

I think we have different ideas of what a rangefinder is suited to, which is fine, they're tools to be used as we see fit.

 

Personally, I like a rangefinder for candid portraiture in low light, no flash, as I want to preserve the atmosphere. I find a RF to be easier to handhold and focus, I'd be curious to see if the Pixii would have an advantage here as an electronic shutter has no shutter shock at all, if it is truly a global shutter.

 

Fast glass gains me another stop or two, that I can put into ISO or shutter as appropriate.. It's not always about the shallow depth of field.

 

The real king of low light is the EVF, it can see even when I can't. I still like rangefinders though.

 

Smartphone connectivity is a bonus, as it allows me to print photos with my Instax SP-2 and give them to people, immediately, but I wouldn't want it to be essential to the operation of the camera.

 

I'm seriously considering the 7A 75/1.25 as my next lens purchase, it would work well on my Fujis, there is currently no native lens option in that focal length and the M mount makes it future proof, as opposed to Fuji X, which is, sadly, an evolutionary dead end.

 

What can I say, I like my lenses fast and a little soft and glowy wide open.

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Why are you dreaming of ultra(!) fast glass on a 3rd party digital rangefinder? That stuff doesn't work overly well (or likely) on original Leicas due to optical and mechanical challenges and limitations of the concept.

 

Reasonably confident that ultra fast lenses do work quite well on Leica Cameras, certainly not suitable for sports or fast action: especially for Available Light Portraiture ultra fast lenses do work well on Leica Cameras, albeit they do cost a wad.

 

Extract below:

 

 

Leica has specialized in producing some of the best optics in the world, and is specifically known for some of the fastest aperture prime lenses available … all of which are optimized for wide open shooting in available light. They are also know[n] for making lenses with very desirable “character” which makes some of the older Leitz and Leica lenses must sought after.

Many M lenses are super fast . . .

 

The Leica M has been a mainstay in my gear bag for a really long time. Others come and go, but the M is always there . . . upload_2020-8-7_10-30-5.jpg.45e27719a782623a3f99f542b7061bb1.jpg

upload_2020-8-7_10-30-5.jpg.2edc97f5ca8770402b55184a965d1c5b.jpg

 

 

Marc Williams,

 

REF: MASTER LESSON: Wedding Equipment

 

Discussion in 'Wedding and Event' started by fotografz, Dec 1, 2009.

 

[LINK]

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It takes some practice, and I use a 1.25x magnifier for telephoto lenses. I find it easier to use my Leica for moving subjects in low light because the VF does not black out and you can Pan in the direction of motion.

 

canon85F15.thumb.jpg.b3cb8dafc6fb2a3c48a002c95a92843e.jpg

 

Canon 85mm F1.5 wide-open on the Leica M9, ISO2500, 1/45sec. Subject was moving.

 

I'll use the Canon 85 F1.5 and 7Art 75/1.25 on the M9 as it is more limited in ISO than my M Monochrom. I use the Nikkor 85/2 and Canon 100/2 on the M Monochrom.

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I have a theory: the faster the lenses get, and the more sensitive the sensors get, the more we complain that we can't get photos in low light.

Too funny. The first Digital Sensor I worked on in the early 80s was a thermal infrared sensor.

SO- the first Digital sensor I used could record images in complete darkness.

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It takes some practice, and I use a 1.25x magnifier for telephoto lenses. I find it easier to use my Leica for moving subjects in low light because the VF does not black out and you can Pan in the direction of motion.

 

 

I never understood why the blink black out of EVF and SLR mirrors effected picture taking. Once you press the shutter release, its taken regardless of what you see. Its not like you can take it back. How does it matter what you see after the pic is taken?

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I never understood why the blink black out of EVF and SLR mirrors effected picture taking. Once you press the shutter release, its taken regardless of what you see. Its not like you can take it back. How does it matter what you see after the pic is taken?

With longer exposures, it helps to be able to track the subject.

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When you loose your visual reference there’s an almost automatic flinch. Competitive target shooters know this and train to avoid it. A blink as you fire will generally cost you a 10X (bullseye). The worst firearm for this is a flintlock, there’s a puff of flame and smoke from the powder in priming pan as you fire which blocks your vision. People who shoot the things often jokingly refer to them as flinchlocks.

Perhaps shooting a flintlock would be good training for hand holding a camera at slower shutter speeds?

 

I did an experiment using a DSLR to see how slow a shutter speed I was capable of hand holding. After doing this looking through the lens I repeated the experiment using a viewfinder in the hot shoe. At slower speeds there was a noticeable improvement, the flinch was either eliminated or reduced substantially.

 

Glenn

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I never understood why the blink black out of EVF and SLR mirrors effected picture taking. Once you press the shutter release, its taken regardless of what you see. Its not like you can take it back. How does it matter what you see after the pic is taken?

 

I am not answering for Brian: what I noted as key words in Brian's Post were (my bold): "I find it easier to use my Leica for moving subjects in low light because the VF does not black out and you can Pan in the direction of motion."

 

I expect that the Viewfinder blocking out in this rangefinder is a substantial (period) of block out, when contrasted to the brrrrrrrrrrr block out of a pro DSLR shooting several frames per second. And certainly a big contrast to the no block out period of a typical Rangefinder.

 

I expect that this extended period of block out can easily unsteady what was a steady pan: moreover I reckon one would have to practice not anticipating the block out - the anticipation of the block out could easily throw a steady panning motion out of kilter.

 

I think it is about the ease of attaining a perfect pan: perhaps then making more than one shot, during that pan.

 

WW

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I never understood why the blink black out of EVF and SLR mirrors effected picture taking. Once you press the shutter release, its taken regardless of what you see. Its not like you can take it back. How does it matter what you see after the pic is taken?

Shooting at 1/45th second, moving subject, with a telephoto lens- being able to pan with the direction of the moving subject reduces motion blur. Being able to see the subject helps lock-on to the motion. Look at the lights in the background of my example photo- those lights are elongated because I panned in the direction of the motion of the subject.

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G1005483-Edit.thumb.jpg.76c76bc85ae7faba96fe56b49992fa50.jpg G1005556.thumb.jpg.6f15e152b299fc6a08073353328c44fa.jpg

 

Canon 100 F2, wide-open on the M Monochrom at ISO 10,000.

 

For shots like this- you are going to get some blur, and often do not get perfect focus.It's not for pixel-peeping. It takes some practice. I have used my Nikon Df and the Olympus EP2 with EVF at the same skating rink. My hit rate with the Leica is much higher, a factor of 2.

Edited by Brian
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Shooting at 1/45th second, moving subject, with a telephoto lens- being able to pan with the direction of the moving subject reduces motion blur. Being able to see the subject helps lock-on to the motion. Look at the lights in the background of my example photo- those lights are elongated because I panned in the direction of the motion of the subject.

 

When I learned to do pan shots, the purpose was to get an in-focus subject with blurred back and foregrounds. For that we used slow speeds, 1/30, 1/15. I can see if you are doing an extreme long pan with a really slow shutter like 1/8 the black out will cause you to lose sight and you could flinch and introduce blur into the subject as well. We were taught to do motion blurs with our pan shots. Such as this: not a perfect focus on the subjects but I was at a really slow speed with a Barack camera at about 1/8 hand held. Probably not the greatest example.

73716664_3baea0cccc_o.gifUntitled by Barry Fisher

Edited by http://www.photo.net/barryfisher
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Seeing as this thread has morphed into one about slow speeds and panning, thought I'd share a couple images.

 

Friends had an extra ticket to a horse show and invited me along so I brought my Leica and 90mm Tele-Elmarit.

Tungsten high speed Ektachrome was only rated at 125 ISO but I knew the lab would push process to 320. Even at that my meter indicated 1/15" @ f/2.8

Decided to try some panning shots and got a number of keepers. This was the best of the lot and I entered it in an international photo competition.

It was a regional winner and earned some $$$. I then entered a 16X20" print in a photo salon where it won best of show, a NAPA (National Association of Photographic Art) gold medal, and the Carveth Award. Not too shabby for a camera that people say is no good for fast action. I recall using the corner of the rangefinder patch as a reference point while following the rider.

 

IMG636.jpg.10555b85b3c10457748a65b728bf4280.jpg

 

I then wondered how panning would work for daylight shots of motorcycle racing. Quite well, just use slow film and stop way down to get a slow enough shutter speed.

Same Leica and 90mm combination.

 

IMG1910.jpg.ed72ac2984fe546cad3a616399778d0c.jpg

 

I feel there's more sense of motion to these shots than I'd have gotten using high ISO and fast shutter speeds.

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This tangent of the discussion was spawned when someone stated that rangefinder cameras could not be used with Dim light and Fast lenses.

My own experience is that it takes some practice, but is very do-able as several photographers in this thread have proven.

 

I came back to this thread and wondered what happened to the Pixii discussion. Ended up learning about a useful technique. Seems like there might be a bit of luck involved in getting shots like this, - at least for me.

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This tangent of the discussion was spawned when someone stated that rangefinder cameras could not be used with Dim light and Fast lenses.

My own experience is that it takes some practice, but is very do-able as several photographers in this thread have proven.

 

That used to be one of the arguments for using a RF camera over a DSL The lack of mirror slap meant you could shoot at lower shutter speeds then sir's. I believe it was Leica that developed the f1.0 Noctilux. In fact, RFs used to be the gold standard of low-light shooting w/o lighting and with fast lenses. Maybe they are surpassed by high end EVFs, but that didn't used to be the case.

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