Photographer Andrew Sweet

One would only see them in pictures of the beach.

Sure, I'll buy that, given the colors recorded are dependent on the equipment used, so may not exactly match what the eye sees (just as Portra and NPH (and other films) recorded colors differently). There, we've reached agreement.

And I'll also agree that my shot would have been much more interesting if I'd have used a wider frame that showed other people watching the subject as he walked by. But since the beach was pretty much deserted save for my wife and I and this fella, I just wanted to record his 'look' (i.e. not just his tush), because I found it rather bold for a public beach.

Some people here are dismissive of Andy’s work. I tend to believe, they may have some sort of a vision of their own for this kind of projects. So, let me throw this question in the air, if one of you were to take up such a project of photographing holocost survivors and other senior people in a beach community, sort of documenting a fleeting era, how would you do it. What would you have done differently, and how that would have enriched the goal of the project?

I'd do it just like Sweet did - walk around taking random shots of scenes I found interesting - which is why I see this particular work as quite ordinary.

I'd do it just like Sweet did - walk around taking random shots of scenes I found interesting - which is why I see this particular work as quite ordinary.

Well, this is what I don't understand. If you would do it exactly how Andy Sweet did it, why do you find his work ordinary. I would expect, if you find something ordinary, you will have a better way of doing it in mind?

if you find something ordinary,

the easy part

you will have a better way of doing it in mind

the hard part

Well, this is what I don't understand. If you would do it exactly how Andy Sweet did it, why do you find his work ordinary. I would expect, if you find something ordinary, you will have a better way of doing it in mind?

That's my point. As a photographer, I'm totally 'ordinary,' so if I see a portfolio of work that looks like something I might have done, it doesn't strike me as being particularly notable. It would be like having a meal that tastes like something you might have cooked up yourself, and you aren't a particularly good cook. You have no idea how you'd have made it differently, but you know it didn't do anything special for your taste buds.

Enjoyed the photos in a historical way. Thanks for posting.

But, they are somewhat remote from the subjects matter;

I did not feel a connection on any level.

Some people here are dismissive of Andy’s work. I tend to believe, they may have some sort of a vision of their own for this kind of projects. So, let me throw this question in the air, if one of you were to take up such a project of photographing holocost survivors and other senior people in a beach community, sort of documenting a fleeting era, how would you do it. What would you have done differently, and how that would have enriched the goal of the project?

Take a look at Bill Aren's "Shlom Y'All" a documentary of Jewish life in the Southern U.S. Its on Amazon.

Some people here are dismissive of Andy’s work. I tend to believe, they may have some sort of a vision of their own for this kind of projects. So, let me throw this question in the air, if one of you were to take up such a project of photographing holocost survivors and other senior people in a beach community, sort of documenting a fleeting era, how would you do it. What would you have done differently, and how that would have enriched the goal of the project?

Well, I wouldn't have them stand there like you see in the typical snapshot pose. First, I would ask permission to photograph them, then I would try to catch them doing common beach activities. I would have to play it by ear, since normally I very rarely photograph people.

What would you have done differently, and how that would have enriched the goal of the project?

I would have interacted and speak to them, ask for permission, take a number of close-up portraits. I would have used thirds rule, align the horizon (while manual printing), maybe dodge and burn method locally, captured them during their activities. But for maximum results, some unusual angles of of view might be just right (wide-angle, unusual vantage point, etc).

Well, this is what I don't understand. If you would do it exactly how Andy Sweet did it, why do you find his work ordinary. I would expect, if you find something ordinary, you will have a better way of doing it in mind?

I did a project about school life. This was my work. I delivered 90 photos based on that approach plus portraits.

Then in 2006 "thirty boxes with contact sheets of Sweet's work were accidentally discovered in a family storage unit..." I am guessing that the current images have been made from the contact prints, which is perhaps where the marginal color quality is coming from.

Based on this, from Bill C, I wonder if many of these shots would have ever made it into public view had Sweet been the one to determine it. Perhaps many were 'throwaways.'

the easy part

 

the hard part

Indeed!

That's my point. As a photographer, I'm totally 'ordinary,' so if I see a portfolio of work that looks like something I might have done, it doesn't strike me as being particularly notable. It would be like having a meal that tastes like something you might have cooked up yourself, and you aren't a particularly good cook. You have no idea how you'd have made it differently, but you know it didn't do anything special for your taste buds.

I see your point. However, I have seen works of several eminent photographers, and not all of their works come off as aesthetically or compositionally extraordinary or special to me. What does come off is their dedication and consistency, and a deep understanding of their subjects. I understand, for certain subject matters, it is probably beneficial to avoid creative angles or compositions and remove the photographer's ego from the results.

I personally don't mind snapshots (or selfies), if I can make some sort of a connection with the subject. How we connect with (unknown) subjects in photos depends a lot on the photographer's skill and engagement with the subject, sometimes at subtle levels. In this case, I was able to connect with Andy's subjects in several of the photos and I understand you couldn't, and I will leave it at that.

Take a look at Bill Aren's "Shlom Y'All" a documentary of Jewish life in the Southern U.S. Its on Amazon.

Thanks for the suggestion. Shalom Y'All, right? I saw a few photos from the preview. Would like to take a detailed look, in the weekend.

Well, I wouldn't have them stand there like you see in the typical snapshot pose. First, I would ask permission to photograph them, then I would try to catch them doing common beach activities. I would have to play it by ear, since normally I very rarely photograph people.

Thanks Vincent for your input. I appreciate that you tried to engage in the ongoing conversation. My take is, beach is where young people go to engage in vigorous activities like volleyball, while seniors might prefer to relax and socialize more. Thats their normal activity I suppose. Some of Andy's pictures are full body portraits, while others, like these (the beach - Andy Sweet's Miami Beach the beach - Andy Sweet's Miami Beach the beach - Andy Sweet's Miami Beach people and places Miami Beach - Andy Sweet's Miami Beach) do show the subjects' activities. I love the 2nd and the 4th pictures.

I personally would like to see a mixture of both kinds in a series, the standing kind as well as the 'engaged in activity' kind. It would also depend on the subject in my opinion. Sometimes, a person photographed standing in their environment (with certain body language and facial expression) can make a strong statement, and some of Andy's photos of this kind come off as strong statements to me, for example this one: the beach - Andy Sweet's Miami Beach .

I would have interacted and speak to them, ask for permission, take a number of close-up portraits. I would have used thirds rule, align the horizon (while manual printing), maybe dodge and burn method locally, captured them during their activities. But for maximum results, some unusual angles of of view might be just right (wide-angle, unusual vantage point, etc).

Thanks, Ruslan for sharing your methodology. I have no doubt you would do that, so would other trained and experienced photographers like you. However, despite following all the rules, results do vary widely depending on whether you appreciate the significance of the theme and how you feel about the subjects in general. Most photographic rules are also overrated and great results can be obtained at times by ignoring them. I am sure you are aware of that. For instance, this one in my opinion works because the horizon is tilted. That tilted horizon conveys so much to me.

Both the pictures from your school life project are good and effective, but I don't think there is much conceptual similarity between Andy's project and your's, except that both are documentaries. I can totally understand if they benefit from different approaches.

Supriyo, there is a remoteness to his photos;sort of like I'm not really here

" for example this one: the beach - Andy Sweet's Miami Beach " Supriyo

I just see a half forced smile and a feeling of embarrassment. If you feel they have a art to them, and they work for you, that is all that matters.

But methinks you are being kind; and Phil can find a art in a photograph of a gravy stain;) And articulate it with prose.

Prose..."Cinderella" is a prose fairy tale.

Rusian, your examples, I felt had a connection between photographer and subjects, reflected in a natural candid way.

Because photographs were taken in historical times, does not make them, special, other than the photographs were taken in historical times.

A shoe box full of photos is a shoe box full of photos. Lets not be too carried away with shoe boxes;) Although you cannot help but think, someone is looking to make gold coins out of them, by proclaiming them as very special photography. Hmm.

A shoe box full of photos is a shoe box full of photos.

They are the most honest visual clues of other people's existence. No photographer with a bag full of lenses and a head full of strobist and bryan peterson can fake out a mom and her instamatic.

They are the most honest visual clues of other people's existence. No photographer with a bag full of lenses and a head full of strobist and bryan peterson can fake out a mom and her instamatic.

Conjured pathos for the camera, which is what a lot of photographers would have mindlessly resorted to here, doesn't always trump unvarnished simplicity.

Conjured pathos for the camera, which is what a lot of photographers would have mindlessly resorted to here, doesn't always trump unvarnished simplicity.

I wish I could have said it as well as you did!

Conjured pathos for the camera

Pretty pathetic, as always :-)

Thanks. The series might be interesting to someone connected with the places and the resort itself. Old stuff, looking like a thing of the past, nostalgic, yes, but techically very ordinary, ho-hum. Our parents and grandads took alike pics throughout the Crimea and the Black Sea long ago with Zenits (1970s or early 1980).

I might agree with your appraisal of Sweet's work from a technical point of view. Also, I may even concede that his photos may not have a great deal of artistic merit. But, as I suspect I stated in an earlier post, I find the real value - which certainly is a legitimate photographic purpose - of his work to be documentary. Between the time he started shooting photos until his untimely death, he documented both the history of South Beach. (southern Miami Beach, for those of you unfamiliar with the location) and the people who vacationed and/or settled there.

To add another historical note - - From its earliest history, Miami Beach was virulently antisemitic. Hotel owners would advertise that Jews were not allowed to stay there; some restaurants also excluded them. Miami-Dade County's Official Records included a deed restriction regarding property north of 5th Street. As a result Jews were not allowed to own property north of that boundary, which accounts for the creation of the unofficial name of the area south of it, namely South Beach. That very deed restriction partially explains the significance presence of Jews in South Beach during the time of Sweet's activity.

How do you deduce what any of the subjects went through in their lives by looking at these photos?

Jordan, I never have described myself as an artist. Nor have I held myself out to be an art expert. To qualify these two remarks, I am not at all saying that you attributed such characteristics to me. Yet, I get the feeling that no art form, including photography, can exist in a vacuum. I am using the term 'vacuum' in its broadest sense to include other art forms, history, sociology, philosophy, etc., etc. Hence, Supriyo's responding to one of your posts by mentioning reading about a certain art in history.

Some people here are dismissive of Andy’s work. I tend to believe, they may have some sort of a vision of their own for this kind of projects. So, let me throw this question in the air, if one of you were to take up such a project of photographing holocost survivors and other senior people in a beach community, sort of documenting a fleeting era, how would you do it. What would you have done differently, and how that would have enriched the goal of the project?

Supriyo, your questions are exceptionally thought-provoking and challenging. Sadly, I have no response at this time other than to reiterate my take on the value of Sweet's images.