New B&W film: 80 ISO, CatLABS

Looks promising. Thanks for the link.

Funny enough it was published today in a Parisian photo magazine....

Posted here nearly 2 weeks ago: CatLABS X FILM 80 is a New B&W Negative Film

A bit skeptical about "new." Would love to see developed negs. Edge codes seldom lie.

I'm suspicious this is rebranding of Afga Aviphot Pan 80(Rollei Retro 80s)

May I ask you to try this new film and then show us some negatives comparaison with your comments? That would be great!

May I ask you to try this new film and then show us some negatives comparaison with your comments? That would be great!

That's a fair suggestion but I'm not going to go way out of my way to obtain this one film just to evaluate it. I evaluate films for astrophotography and it's of particular interest to us to find films with extended red sensitivity that can either be used out of the box or benefit from enhancement techniques. It has been apparent over the last few years from personal testing and datasheet comparisons that Agfa Aviphot aerial films are just being rebranded all over the place to the point that any new film hits the market with the same atypical ISO and/or same extended spectral response; I've become more confident that it's likely the same old rebranded stuff.

JCH Streetpan400/Rollei Retro 400s/ Rollei Infrared film are the same Agfa Aviphot aerial film. I suspect Film Washi "Z" is likewise. I contacted Film Washi to clarify this but no response.

Agfa Aviphot 80s is Rollei Retro 80s and most likely Adox Hr-50 with Speed Boost(based on comparison of datasheets).

That's a fair suggestion but I'm not going to go way out of my way to obtain this one film just to evaluate it. I evaluate films for astrophotography and it's of particular interest to us to find films with extended red sensitivity that can either be used out of the box or benefit from enhancement techniques. It has been apparent over the last few years from personal testing and datasheet comparisons that Agfa Aviphot aerial films are just being rebranded all over the place to the point that any new film hits the market with the same atypical ISO and/or same extended spectral response; I've become more confident that it's likely the same old rebranded stuff.

 

JCH Streetpan400/Rollei Retro 400s/ Rollei Infrared film are the same Agfa Aviphot aerial film. I suspect Film Washi "Z" is likewise. I contacted Film Washi to clarify this but no response.

 

Agfa Aviphot 80s is Rollei Retro 80s and most likely Adox Hr-50 with Speed Boost(based on comparison of datasheets).

Thank you!

No small online photo equipment retailer has the resources to make their own film at an economical price. So obviously this is just a badge-engineered rebranding of another, and existing product.

Not many 80 ISO films about, so the Agfa/Rollei film is a prime suspect.

What's almost dead certain is that this is in no way a 'new' and unique product.

There are coating facilities open for companies to use...so it could be a small run batch.

Coating with what?

This small company has set up a research lab? And populated it with experts from where? To develop a novel emulsion that's noticeably different from any of the current regurgitations of 1980s technology?

I find that highly improbable.

I'll debate about taking one for the team and ordering some.

Shipping hits hard enough on something like this that I hate to order less than 10 rolls, but I also don't know if I want to commit to that much.

I wish some of these boutique retailers would stock at least through Freestyle, which seems pretty supportive of them as a whole. I spend a few hundred dollars on film at Freestyle a couple of times a year-sticking one or two $5-6 rolls of film on to try it out doesn't really even register, but having to order from the manufacturer/distributor directly makes a $5.55 roll of film a lot more expensive.

I'll debate about taking one for the team and ordering some.

 

Shipping hits hard enough on something like this that I hate to order less than 10 rolls, but I also don't know if I want to commit to that much.

 

I wish some of these boutique retailers would stock at least through Freestyle, which seems pretty supportive of them as a whole. I spend a few hundred dollars on film at Freestyle a couple of times a year-sticking one or two $5-6 rolls of film on to try it out doesn't really even register, but having to order from the manufacturer/distributor directly makes a $5.55 roll of film a lot more expensive.

Yes, it was the same with the JCH film a while back. Now I can get it everywhere it seems. That is a nice film as well by the way. I use the Rollei 80s once in a while and will be adble to tell if the emulsion characteristics are the same.

They’ve already said they don’t own the equipment that made the film, but they also said it’s not sold under any other labels. They are a well regarded company and I don’t see why we shouldn’t take them at their word. There are plenty of scenarios that could result in them commissioning or ending up with a batch of a unique emulsion made by one of the large companies.

This is the same idea as JCH 400 Streetpan. It isn't respooled. It was a new coating in small batch run of an old formula surveillance film from Agfa. This is becoming quite common...so I too am surprised that some people claim companies are lying about this...especially CatLabs as they are well respected in the film community. I guess some people prefer conspiracy theories over actual knowledge

This is the same idea as JCH 400 Streetpan. It isn't respooled. It was a new coating in small batch run of an old formula surveillance film from Agfa. This is becoming quite common...so I too am surprised that some people claim companies are lying about this...especially CatLabs as they are well respected in the film community. I guess some people prefer conspiracy theories over actual knowledge

Regardless if it's a new production run(s); same formula, same emulsion, more or less same film disregarding other variables like film base. With the rather lengthy development times these films have it wouldn't make much of a difference varying them plus or minus a few seconds from brand to brand as part of individual marketing.

Catlabs is also coming out with their X Film 320 despite there already being two other films on the market with the same atypical ISO ratings: Foma Retropan 320 Soft and Imago 320. What are they going to claim is special about theirs?

Regardless if it's a new production run(s); same formula, same emulsion, more or less same film disregarding other variables like film base. With the rather lengthy development times these films have it wouldn't make much of a difference varying them plus or minus a few seconds from brand to brand as part of individual marketing.

 

Catlabs is also coming out with their X Film 320 despite there already being two other films on the market with the same atypical ISO ratings: Foma Retropan 320 Soft and Imago 320. What are they going to claim is special about theirs?

The ascertain is that there are no companies willing to do small runs of films. That is untrue.

Regardless if it's a new production run(s); same formula, same emulsion, more or less same film disregarding other variables like film base. With the rather lengthy development times these films have it wouldn't make much of a difference varying them plus or minus a few seconds from brand to brand as part of individual marketing.

 

Catlabs is also coming out with their X Film 320 despite there already being two other films on the market with the same atypical ISO ratings: Foma Retropan 320 Soft and Imago 320. What are they going to claim is special about theirs?

Can you cite any evidence that these films are the same emulsions as other films on the market? Anything beyond speculation, I mean.

Catlabs is also coming out with their X Film 320 despite there already being two other films on the market with the same atypical ISO ratings: Foma Retropan 320 Soft and Imago 320. What are they going to claim is special about theirs?

I wouldn't exactly call 320 an atypical ISO-I have a fair 320 speed film in the freezer in yellow boxes, and a good bit of it is in date...

Can you cite any evidence that these films are the same emulsions as other films on the market? Anything beyond speculation, I mean.

For some films there is a lot of corroborating evidence in the datasheets. See the spectral plots for Rollei Infrared and Rollei Retropan 400s: practically the same. The spectral plot for Adox HR-50 Speed Boost and that of Rollei Retro 80s is largely the same. The Adox HR-50 spectral plot is cruder and more simplified but the curves more or less correspond to one another; That can't be a coincidence. I had tested both JCH and Rollei Retro 400 and came to the suspicion that they might be the same which was later confirmed with online search with hits going back several years.

I wouldn't exactly call 320 an atypical ISO-I have a fair 320 speed film in the freezer in yellow boxes, and a good bit of it is in date...

But, where are these other European ISO 80 and 320 films coming from in the last few years? It isn't Kodak.

The ascertain is that there are no companies willing to do small runs of films. That is untrue.

How many rolls is CatLabs likely to sell or ordered to begin with? How many rolls come out of even the smallest coating run? Has Agfa come up with a new means of efficient smaller production per demand? It's more likely their film is coming from a master production roll even if it was made within recent times(and perhaps made again to meet demand) and especially so with all the common characteristics among these films.

How many rolls is CatLabs likely to sell or ordered to begin with? How many rolls come out of even the smallest coating run? Has Agfa come up with a new means of efficient smaller production per demand? It's more likely their film is coming from a master production roll even if it was made within recent times(and perhaps made again to meet demand) and especially so with all the common characteristics among these films.

We went through this when JCH released Streetpan. It isn't from an old roll. Your search came up wrong. It was a new run of an old Agfa film...not from an old roll. You appear to not know what is going on here.

We went through this when JCH released Streetpan. It isn't from an old roll. Your search came up wrong. It was a new run of an old Agfa film...not from an old roll. You appear to not know what is going on here.

I don't want to argue around in circles but the the larger issue regardless of how and when such films were made is that they seem to be or suspected to be the same films/emulsions being rebranded.