SB700 diffuser problem - help!

Taken 1000's of photos in church social hall with D7100 + SB700 with no problem. Changed to D750 and my first batch are terrible. The main thing I did differently (other than Auto ISO) is, previously, I used bounce flash w/ catch light panel 90 degrees from flash head (the flash was pointed straight up and the catch light panel was facing subject). This time I used the included diffuser accessory w/o the catch light accessory. All the peoples heads have an awful yellow glow around the top. This is the first time taking pictures with the diffuser. Should I have set my filters different? I am shooting in RAW. Please help! The setting for the D750 are similar to my previous camera (D7100).

Could you post a couple of sample images, showing what you don’t like about those images?

It doesn't happen when the flash is far away (image 64). Only when the flash is close (image 13).

 

 

The diffuser does very little with bounce flash, except cut the light down. What you're seeing is a reflection of the yellow ambient lighting showing more because the flash is weaker.

 

The fix is to stop using the diffuser.

 

If it wasn't bust, why try to fix it?

 

BTW, RAW can do nothing to alter the different white balance between ambient room lighting, at around 2700K, and flash at 6500K. If you correct for the room lighting, then the flash will look blue. You need to 'overpower' the room lighting by increasing the flash power.

 

Maybe setting the shutter speed manually to 1/125th or 1/250th would help. Looks like the camera is setting a long shutter speed and wide aperture. Auto-everything rarely works well with flash.

Edited December 26, 2018 by rodeo_joe|1

Could you post a couple of sample images, showing what you don’t like about those images?

It doesn't happen when far away (image 1). Only when closer ( image 2). See above.

The diffuser does very little with bounce flash, except cut the light down. What you're seeing is a reflection of the yellow ambient lighting showing more because the flash is weaker.

 

The fix is to stop using the diffuser.

 

If it wasn't bust, why try to fix it?

 

BTW, RAW can do nothing to alter the different white balance between ambient room lighting, at around 2700K, and flash at 6500K. If you correct for the room lighting, then the flash will look blue. You need to 'overpower' the room lighting by increasing the flash power.

 

Maybe setting the shutter speed manually to 1/125th or 1/250th would help. Looks like the camera is setting a long shutter speed and wide aperture. Auto-everything rarely works well with flash.

Thanks. Leave the diffuser off. Simple. KISS. "Keep It Simple Stupid" HaHa. Guess I can't leave well enough alone. Thanks for I think this is the answer I was looking for.

...You need to 'overpower' the room lighting by increasing the flash power...

Another option is to gel the flash and colour balance it to the ambient light.

 

The SB-700 comes with colour balance filters and it knows when you attach which filter and it adjusts the white balance accordingly on your camera when your white balance is set to auto or flash.

I am not sure how tall the ceiling is at this location, but I am a bit concerned that the SB-700 is on the under-powered side. I would favor a more powerful flash. At least I wouldn't add a diffuser, and adding color gels to it could be an issue also.

 

I would set exposure mode to M so that you have full control. ISO to maybe 200 or 400 or, if necessary, 800. I doubt that using Auto-ISO would be helpful in this case. (I use Auto-ISO frequently outdoors when I need to guarantee a minimum shutter speed for action photography, under varying lighting conditions.) For my taste, I would use 1/30 or 1/60 sec shutter speed so that ambient light will have some contribution to the overall exposure. Usually that generates more pleasing results than mainly having harsher contribution from the flash. Bouncing off the ceiling should help.

 

With a new camera, I would test it under different flash and exposure settings under casual situations to find what you like most. Being FX, the D750 should give you much better high-ISO results than the D7100.

Taken 1000's of photos in church social hall with D7100 + SB700 with no problem...

I doubt flash output power is the problem since it worked satisfactory with the D7100.

 

Since the FX D750 should manage with less flash power (better at high ISO) I suggested adding a gel to the flash. I have not looked at any EXIF data to get an idea of how close to the flash’s maximum output the OP might be. I know the ”general rule” says gel the most powerful lightsource when using lights of different colour temperature, In the OP’s case, that is really not an option hence my recommendation to gel the flash.

Why would you 'gel' an already underpowered flash, and lose 1.5 to 2 stops of light from it?

 

The issue appears to be that of mixed CTs, and if flash is necessary we must assume that the ambient light is too dim to use on its own. Therefore the solution is to completely overpower any ambient light and use flash alone as the illuminant.

 

Bounce flash has a soft character with good covering power if there's a matt white or light-coloured surface to bounce from. It's no more harsh than artificial room lighting, and can actually be softer and more pleasing.

 

Ideally I would choose something with more power than an SB700 (true GN 20 in metres @ 100 ISO), but if the ISO is pushed to 400 or maybe 800 then lighting a largish space is entirely doable.

 

I really fail to see how a recommendation to drag the shutter and deliberately get the mixed lighting that the OP obviously objects to, is going to help.

 

P.S. In the shot of the lady and gent, the lady's eyes appear slightly blurred, as if caught in the act of blinking. That indicates an already too slow shutter speed to me.

Edited December 27, 2018 by rodeo_joe|1

Couple shot in Manual at f/2, 1/125 sec w/ flash diffuser over head of flash. From everyone's comments I think I just need to remove the diffuser to increase strength of flash to overpower ambient lighting. Will try this first because I didn't have a problem until I put the diffuser on. All the others turned out fine for my taste. Thank you, all.

Will also add I shot with my NIkon 85mm prime at 320 ISO.

It doesn't happen when far away (image 1). Only when closer ( image 2). See above.

Rodeo_joe, I aim to base my replies on input given by the original poster and the original poster’s needs rather than my way of doing things and my needs.

 

There are multiple ways of achieveing indoor photos with a neutral colour balance. I do not always use the same method and I therefore presented an alternative way to achieve that.

 

Since 10974017 first claimed everything worked well with the DX camera and then concluded the problem was most visible with the FX camera up close, could you elaborate on why the flash itself is underpowered for the OP’s use on FX up close since it is not on FX from a distance?

I am not sure how tall the ceiling is at this location, but I am a bit concerned that the SB-700 is on the under-powered side. I would favor a more powerful flash. At least I wouldn't add a diffuser, and adding color gels to it could be an issue also.

 

I would set exposure mode to M so that you have full control. ISO to maybe 200 or 400 or, if necessary, 800. I doubt that using Auto-ISO would be helpful in this case. (I use Auto-ISO frequently outdoors when I need to guarantee a minimum shutter speed for action photography, under varying lighting conditions.) For my taste, I would use 1/30 or 1/60 sec shutter speed so that ambient light will have some contribution to the overall exposure. Usually that generates more pleasing results than mainly having harsher contribution from the flash. Bouncing off the ceiling should help.

 

With a new camera, I would test it under different flash and exposure settings under casual situations to find what you like most. Being FX, the D750 should give you much better high-ISO results than the D7100.

The yellow Colour Cast near the heads of the people in the second image is most likely from the ambient ceiling lights.

 

In that second image there is evidence of Subject Movement (already noted the woman's eyelids) also the man’s head appears to be moving evidenced by leading edge trails on his Eye Glasses and his R Ear.

 

Both these facts are good evidence that the Flash 'power' on the Subjects was too weak to overcome the room ambient and to arrest Subject Motion Blur.

 

In other words you were making shots beyond the limits of the Flash's capacity to be Key Light.

 

The simple solutions are:

 

> bump the ISO

> do not use any the diffuser, gel or filter on the Flash

 

***

 

EXIF indicates that the second image was pulled: F/2 @ 1/125s @ ISO320.

 

Notably, whereas the first images was pulled: F/2 @ 1/200s @ ISO320.

 

That Shutter Speed difference can be enough of a difference to allow the Ambient Room Light to make a Colour Cast on part of the image.

 

The point being, the yellow Cast it is not necessarily about the flash being close or further away from the Subjects, probably more about the Shutter Speed that you are choosing to use.

 

WW

When I was younger I routinely shot at 1/60, sometimes handheld at 1/30 with pleasing results. Now I am 62 and have a bit of hand shake so nothing under 1/125. These two are among the first set from my new D750. In image of couple, the ISO was 320. Shutter speed 1/125 at f/2.0. Flash power was -0.7. Only I had my diffuser on. Simply removing the diffuser should give the results I want. Plenty of keepers before without it on the D7100. From there I can simply adjust the power of the flash directly (i.e. -0.3, +0.7). Thanks for the good info. And happy hunting.

. . . Simply removing the diffuser should give the results I want. Plenty of keepers before without it on the D7100.

 

I think that is a good plan.

 

WW

I am not sure how tall the ceiling is at this location, but I am a bit concerned that the SB-700 is on the under-powered side. I would favor a more powerful flash. At least I wouldn't add a diffuser, and adding color gels to it could be an issue also.

 

I would set exposure mode to M so that you have full control. ISO to maybe 200 or 400 or, if necessary, 800. I doubt that using Auto-ISO would be helpful in this case. (I use Auto-ISO frequently outdoors when I need to guarantee a minimum shutter speed for action photography, under varying lighting conditions.) For my taste, I would use 1/30 or 1/60 sec shutter speed so that ambient light will have some contribution to the overall exposure. Usually that generates more pleasing results than mainly having harsher contribution from the flash. Bouncing off the ceiling should help.

 

With a new camera, I would test it under different flash and exposure settings under casual situations to find what you like most. Being FX, the D750 should give you much better high-ISO results than the D7100.

Thanks for the heads up about reducing shutter speed to let in more ambient light. Will try this in future.

I doubt flash output power is the problem since it worked satisfactory with the D7100.

 

Since the FX D750 should manage with less flash power (better at high ISO) I suggested adding a gel to the flash. I have not looked at any EXIF data to get an idea of how close to the flash’s maximum output the OP might be. I know the ”general rule” says gel the most powerful lightsource when using lights of different colour temperature, In the OP’s case, that is really not an option hence my recommendation to gel the flash.

Thanks, but really not up to par on flash filters to correct ambient lighting. I don't feel quite comfortable using them at this time. Will try to investigate further.

Thanks, but really not up to par on flash filters to correct ambient lighting. I don't feel quite comfortable using them at this time.

 

- A wise decision, and you're in good company not being comfortable with flash filters.

 

In ye olden dayes, there was basically just tungsten incandescent artificial light to contend with, and even that came in three flavours - Photoflood @ 3400K, Studio lamps @ 3200K and domestic light bulbs @ around 2700K. So sticking an 85B filter on the flash and using type-T or L film would be near enough to match most artificial lighting.

 

Then along came wider use of fluorescent tubes in a multitude of phosphors. Requiring a green filter on the flash and a complementary magenta filter on the lens - the nightmare begins. Especially if a mixture of fluorescent and incandescent lighting was present.

 

Today we have LEDs, CFLs (that are impossible to match with most cameras), fluorescent tubes, high and low pressure vapour lamps, incandescents, and halogen bulbs - more than a nightmare, and impossible to carry enough flash filters to cope with 'em all.

 

The answer: To h*ll with the ambient light. Just carry a powerful enough flash or flashes to overpower it, and use a short enough shutter speed and small enough aperture that the colour of the ambient lighting doesn't matter a spit.

 

BTW, from your mention of using flash compensation, I suspect you're using Nikon's i-TTL to control the flash exposure. Not a good idea IMHO, since it defaults to BL (balanced lighting, or fill-flash mode). That's not what you want. You want the bounce flash to be the key lighting, and not just a fill to ambient light.

Edited December 31, 2018 by rodeo_joe|1