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How to start making money on photography?


BratNikotin

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What goes around, comes around!

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Vinyl Sales Are Not Just a Hipster Thing Anymore

But revenue from vinyl sales (14.3 million units) was only about 20% of revenue from CD sales in 2017, and CD sales are dropping like a rock. Physical media revenue totaled about $3 billion and digital (streaming & downloads) hit $5 billion for 66.2 million albums. Streaming revenue doubled from 2015 to 2017, but both physical media and downloads have dropped every year since 2012. As reported in Variety, as many tracks were streamed every day in 2017 as were sold in physical form the entire year!

 

The vinyl market is growing again, but it is and will remain a small specialty niche. The main reason it’s still here (apart from the “cool” factor) is serious innovation in both sound quality of good vinyl and the systems that bring it to us. And those 180 gram records cost a lot. You can get 3 months of unlimited Spotify streaming for the cost of one vinyl record.

 

Without innovation now, professional photography in social settings will also shrink drastically. Vinyl survives by delighting its customers. That business changed and innovated to survive. We need to do the same.

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I don't know where you are, but you can probably find at least a few "open mic" nights, jam sessions etc at which aspiring musicians and performers would love to get some good pictures of themselves on stage. Small club owners and local promoters / agents are also looking for high quality pics for their marketing, websites etc - and many (OK - most) are too "frugal" to hire a professional photographer. Show up early enough to find the best vantage points before the performers start and get some great shots. Carry a tablet to show them to the subjects as soon as they leave the stage. Do not show them on your camera's display! Then promise & deliver prints and/or digital files within 24 hours at a fair price, and you'll probably be able to build a local following within months if you're good. Print up some cards and get out there!

 

[ATTACH=full]1261150[/ATTACH]

 

PS: Editing can really help sell this kind of pic - here it is with the blemishes "adjusted":

 

[ATTACH=full]1261152[/ATTACH]

This isn't going to get you paid. Not to mention, an open-mic event doesn't have a lot of serious professionals performing. If they do buy any prints, it's purely just for the "Look, I did this!" for their social media platforms.

 

Giving out free prints or digital copies will obligate them to share your photo and your name, giving you some strong branding / exposure opportunities, leading to paid gigs. Like what if the open-mic VENUE wants to hire you to photograph their events every Friday? Now that's better than individuals paying you peanuts.

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I welcome thoughtful criticism of both my thoughts and my work - it makes me better. I hope you feel the same way, Joseph. Just like the OP, half of the performers at open mic events are looking for paid gigs, and at least one or two have or want a press kit. Optimists look for the pony in the pile.

Like what if the open-mic VENUE wants to hire you to photograph their events every Friday? Now that's better than individuals paying you peanuts.

Absolutely - that’s what I said:

Small club owners and local promoters / agents are also looking for high quality pics for their marketing, websites etc

Open mic nights are usually held in small clubs, bars, restaurants etc.

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Everybody's got a camera that works pretty well these days, so whatever is easy isn't worth anything anymore. You need to do something that not everybody has access to. One possibility is to get some lighting, learn how to use it, and do product/catalog photography. No doubt there are other niches that are less accessible to the casual photographer, and those might be where the opportunities are. It's not about the camera anymore.
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  • 1 month later...

Such a naive thread!

Consider this: now the number of photographers are higher than the number of customers!

There is strong oversupply on the photography market - on stock sites, on wedding market, at schools, colleges, newborns photography, everywhere!.

 

You can not make serious money on photography. As a example (wedding photography now):

 

Wedding Photography is Dead

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Such a naive thread! . . . You can not make serious money on photography. As a example (wedding photography now):Wedding Photography is Dead

 

The one man motor mechanic working at the petrol station doesn't do so well, either: but one example doesn't a case make.

 

Peter Lik; Ken Duncan; and Monte Luke Studios, are three in my neck of the woods whom I believe would disagree with the comment, "You can not make serious money on photography."

 

Restoration and Forensic Analysis fares pretty well too.

 

One key (of many keys) is to reinvent the business so you can differentiate yourself from the competition . . . that’s akin to knowing which trees to shake: both these points were previously made.

 

WW

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Peter Lik; Ken Duncan; and Monte Luke Studios, are three in my neck of the woods whom I believe would disagree with the comment, "You can not make serious money on photography."

 

Let's face it:

Do they have yachts or new Porsche Carreras 911? Are their children in Ivy League universities? Are their wives wearing mink and Chanel tote bags? Are they seriously rich and all they have they earned by photography? Really?

 

I strongly convinced that making serious money in today's world of photography and by means of it is absurd, chimera.

 

Oversupply - is the key word here.

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During my life I have communicated with many, many, many and many photographers. I can not recall anyone of them who is/was wealthy. I remember the words of Vladimir Godnik's (a professional photographer from Israel).

and he said:

"any top photographer can not come close to an average entrepreneur (in terms of earnings)" - and I consider him to be one of smartest people I met.

The greatest Rodney Smith was telling the same.

I consider pure bluff everything else .

Of course, a photographer can earn some money and he can earn even occasional good money, but in this case his connections and his support do matter (he should be a friend with fashion directors, editors, couturiers, designers, etc).

Oh, one photographer who is rich came to my mind - this is Karl Lagerfeld! Ha-ha, he is a designer really. And another - Seal. But he is a pop singer.

OP is like an astronaut stepping on the Moon, sorry.... :eek: Maybe this is why he is silent. Many people here said the right things though.

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. . . I strongly convinced that making serious money in today's world of photography and by means of it is absurd . . .

 

That's fine by me, no argument on your convictions, I merely quoted three (four) concrete, factual examples of what is possible: which was in response to one PetaPixel commentary and the statement that "You can not make serious money on photography."

Interestingly, the cited commentary was authored by Shelly Mantovani who states that she is "a wedding photographer in Yorkshire, UK."

 

It occurs to me an oxymoron at the least and certainly a function of the loss of some credibility, that after having scribed and published an Article; "Wedding Photography is Dead", that the author would tag the same article advertizing her services; "for business mentoring".

And, back to the main topic - "One key (of many keys) is to reinvent the business so you can differentiate yourself from the competition . . . that’s akin to knowing which trees to shake: both these points were previously made."

 

WW

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During my life I have communicated with many, many, many and many photographers. I can not recall anyone of them who is/was wealthy. I remember the words of Vladimir Godnik's (a professional photographer from Israel).

and he said:

"any top photographer can not come close to an average entrepreneur (in terms of earnings)" - and I consider him to be one of smartest people I met.

The greatest Rodney Smith was telling the same.

I consider pure bluff everything else .

Of course, a photographer can earn some money and he can earn even occasional good money, but in this case his connections and his support do matter (he should be a friend with fashion directors, editors, couturiers, designers, etc).

Oh, one photographer who is rich came to my mind - this is Karl Lagerfeld! Ha-ha, he is a designer really. And another - Seal. But he is a pop singer.

OP is like an astronaut stepping on the Moon, sorry.... :eek: Maybe this is why he is silent. Many people here said the right things though.

 

 

Now that's a load of BS. Ive been repairing cameras for hard working professionals for almost 50 years n most of them were doing very well for themselves. Perhaps today with digital cameras, anyone can be a photographer, n that may have over saturated the market... but not in my neighborhood.

 

Driving a Porsche is not the indicator of wealth either. Conspicuous consumption is stupid, usually something poor people do that came into some money. to mark success by material ownership, that's just insane. Carpenters, mechanics, truck drivers, garbage men, all make good livings and do very well with what they make. Buy a house, raise a family n retire comfortably trying to spend that million you worked so hard for. You don't have to become wealthy, just earn an honest living n strive to do well in whatever market you chose. Its a big market today and hardly tapped out yet.

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were doing very well for themselves

Why do you know? Did you checked their declarations and bank deposits?

You have been fixing cameras for 50 years? Really? Then you are in you 70s, right? Are you a certified serviceman?

So what times are you talking about - 1970s'? 1960s? 1980s? So you should know some famous photographers of NY in person.

I don't believe any of your words. Sorry.

I tend to trust Mr. Rodney Smith, a top-class world photographer and Vladimir Godnik much more, than you. Sorry.

Its a big market today

Why are you not on that market? Go!

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Driving a Porsche is not the indicator of wealth either.

So rich photographers drive old Chevrolets or old hondas. right?

Listen man, am not on my first day on Earth and in photography. So let's stop here.

 

Interestingly, the cited commentary was authored by Shelly Mantovani who states that she is "a wedding photographer in Yorkshire, UK."

 

It occurs to me an oxymoron at the least and certainly a function of the loss of some credibility, that after having scribed and published an Article; "Wedding Photography is Dead", that the author would tag the same article advertizing her services; "for business mentoring

I think it is a question of mentality. Not beaing an anglo-saxon, I clearly understand her. She is in profession and she does describe the present situation.

Oxymoron is a figure of speech in which apparently contradictory terms appear in conjunction (e.g. faith unfaithful kept him falsely true ).

Горячий снег, космические скидки, etc.

So oxymoron has nothing to do with it.

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poor people

buy new Carrera and Chanel totes? Really?

Peter Lik

Don't you ever consider this a mass media hype? I think it is all hype. BTW, I have never known his name though I study photography.

There are loads of such masterpieses (like his works) on stocks. Why pay 1000000 (anonimously)? 50-100 dollars is enough. World famous Jan Saudek's and Koudelka's works go for 8000-20000 dollars. But Saudek is not a rich person but we can call him a living legend for sure

How many photographers in the world and how many of them sell prints for so much?

 

And the kill shot to my opponents (how to make money):

in this topic american professional wedding photoghrapher works with .... Nikon D90. Sad truth, gentlemen

Client unhappy with large group photo...

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We're wandering of topic, but, as an aside, and I'll leave it here -

 

. . . Not beaing an anglo-saxon, I clearly understand her. [the author of the PetaPixel Article] She is in profession and she does describe the present situation.

 

Actually she is describing her OPINION / INTERPRETATION of the situation.

 

As I stated I have no argument with your conviction: neither do I have argument with how Shelly interprets the Wedding Photography business in the United Kingdom.

 

Clearly I cited and noted, (even if not recognized by yourself), three or four Photography Businesses who are indeed making money: and as I see it, making "serious money".

 

Notwithstanding this little sidebar - The OP wants ideas on how to make money: your position has been clearly stated that, in your opinion, there is no possibility of making "serious money" in Photography: obviously the definition of 'serious' is thus far, interpretive, but . . .

 

The point remains that the OP was simply asking about - "how to start making money on Photography" - and that is where the crux of the conversation belongs.

 

WW

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Actually she is describing her OPINION / INTERPRETATION of the situation.

Yes, I have taken about 60 - 65 weddings during my life and here in my country the decline is even stronger, the situation is alike what she descrbes. She isn't the only one who tells me about the decline. In Moscow in winter the ratio between phographers and customers (newlyweds) are 10:1 in summer is 3:1 and everyone wants it cheap. Salary of the top is close to a good engeneer's salary.

OP can earn some money but I don't think he is into forensic analysys nor restoration, he might want to click his camera and take pictures for money.

As for forensic analyst here are salaries. I do not know if it is much for US.

Crime Scene Photographer Salary

 

 

The point remains that the OP was simply asking about - "how to start making money on Photography" - and that is where the crux of the conversation belongs.

Agree.

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have taken about 60 - 65 weddings during my life and here in my country the decline is even stronger, the situation is alike what she descrbes. She isn't the only one who tells me about the decline. In Moscow

 

 

i wish PN would put locations back. Moscow explains it all.

 

mr rusian, you make generalizations based on what youve experianced and read as if its the rule that applies to all. here 65 weddings is not a life time, its only a few months work. the wedding guys are racking up in quantity sales, not making a fortune but doing very well year round. most wedding togs get hooked up with catering halls or are affiliated with DJs as package deals. btw wedding halls here are booked so tight, you have to reserve them a year or more in advance.

 

as for other markets in photography, there is plenty of room but competition is fearce. unlike the old days of walking the beat, the internet has blowen advertising wide open, its not a local shop anymore. i think its amazing i can talk to you on the other side of the planet as if you were up the block. its much easier to make a place for yourself these days. make a web site n you have reached millions compared to stuffing flyers on windshields.

 

its a global market! think about it for a moment? my shoot is in nyc, then on to the retoucher in australia, back to me for review n off to china who tranfers the money directly to my bank. done deal!

The more you say, the less people listen.
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here 65 weddings is not a life time, its only a few months work. the wedding guys are racking up in quantity sales, not making a fortune but doing very well year round. most wedding togs get hooked up with catering halls or are affiliated with DJs as package deals

Here again.

There is one top photographer in NY, who came from Russia. He is one of the most paid photographer in New York.

And his name is Emin Kuliev. You can google up his level of price. He takes up to 5000 shots during the wedding day and even more.

Every photographer from Russia knows him and I do know him too (though we have not met in person).

And he speaks in his blog on youtube and tells his viewers a lot about NY photography and wedding market of NY.

I have watched this most important interview/blog.

And in his interview he is so skeptical about succes of a newcomer into wedding photography.

Here again, if there is someone who can translate his interview into English, I can give you a link, And we will discuss it later. Do you want?

I also have read about mamarazzi, about Uncle Bob etc... I believe every word of Shelly's on Petapixel and I believe Emin Kuliev. She speaks about UK market, not Russian. He speaks about himself and says weather a photographer can earn big $ now. He is a top class profi of the world. He gives lectures and workshops here.

There are also thousands on weddings in Moscow, but every second man/woman is a photographer. Uncle Bob, a neighbour, a friend, a student, everybody. Are things different in NY?

then on to the retoucher in australia

But Emin (5000 to 8000 dollars-tag photographer) retouches himself and less than a minute per shot. Did not expect?

 

Here he is.

Wedding photography rates in New York city, the Bronx — New York, Bronx, Manhattan wedding photographer Emin Kuliyev

Edited by ruslan
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Moscow explains it all.

Prague - the same thing, Kiev - the same thing, Minsk - tha same thing.

Even UK is the same thing (according to Shelly). If you want to know what Emin says - tell me.

 

I do understand that New York is a big megapolis but

but competition is fearce

your words.

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