Thoughts on the Leica M10-P

Today, Leica announced the M10-P - an M10 with these enhancements:

- Quieter Shutter

- No red dot

- Touch screen for control during Live View and Playback

 

The sensor is unchanged, as is the body (except for the missing red dot).

 

I am not tempted to upgrade, but I wonder what others think?

Hmm... no red dot, no

order from me...

http://bayouline.com/o2.gif

Quiet is not silent. The rangefinder is not accurate enough for a 90 mm lens at the widest aperture. You still need two spare batteries for a day in the field. For $8000, you could get a Hasselblad X1D, which is totally silent with C/CF lenses, and cover most of the cost of a native lens as well.

 

On the positive side, losing the red dot is a step back from Leica as a symbol of conspicuous consumption. The touch screen is an excellent addition for live view, including moving the focusing spot and tap for magnification.

I'd be upgrading from an M-P 240.

 

Personally, although I've been offered a fantastic deal on an M10-P, I'm hard-pressed to justify the expense the upgrade would set me back. I'd have to sell my M-P 240 body and at least one lens (maybe two) in order to prevent from coming out-of-pocket. And I'm pretty much unmoved by the upgrades over the M10.

 

My biggest issues with the M-P 240 have been dynamic range in bright sunlight (improved on the M10) and sensor dust (no help there). On a side note - having actually used the video, I've come to realize why Leica engineers chose to remove it from the M10.

Very fond of Leica, but I hate touch screens, it would be a disqualifier even if I cared to spend that much.

I wonder what others think?

Monochroms were so far based on the P models, so the 3rd one might become a quite desirable camera.

 

If I had an M10 and lots of pocket money to burn, I'd order an M10 P as the (usually desirable) 2nd body. - While the touch screen stuff sounds nice to have I am not sure when I'd use it for taking pictures. - Maybe in makeshift MILC mode with longer lenses? - For image viewing a smart device and extra camera battery seem cheaper than the the extra money.

Although the M10 P sounds like the so far greatest digital M, its not really a reason to suddenly pick up that system from scratch; so most folks getting one should already be used to Leica dials and buttons, which weren't that bad as an UI, only processing power lacked in the older models (M 8 & 9). Its a bit sad to no longer get an option to shoot tethered. I'd really like to try that some day.

While I was making plans for investing on Leica M10, the new Leica 10M-P arrival seemed to be something I need to consider. If the prices were same, I definitely consider new -P version but I don’t think touchscreen and quite shutter is something I would be investing on. Even M bodies are very silent compared to most of the street cameras. With additional 700 Euros, I would rather investing on better lens than touch screen gimmicks. Even I do not mention red dot graphic games on body design.

Still waiting for the monochrom version of the M10 so all the M246 owners can let go of those bodies and the used prices drop a bit so I can nab one of those to use alongside the M262 and/or MP240’s I still enjoy using way too much to feel the urge to move to any version of the new body.

 

M240/262 batteries go and go on a charge. The new M10 batteries are definite downgrades in that one instance.

Well, I think a sweet-looking, used M246 is about to make it’s way to me shortly.....LOL....

That shutter and VF should make their way to 35mm bodies - stat!

 

I have heard a comparison recording of the shutters of the M10 and M10-P, and the difference is noticeable. I do prefer the latter. For the small premium over the M10, I would go for the M10-P without blinking.

I just watched a video of the two shutter sounds. To be honest, I’d like to hear a comparison between the M10-P and M262.i think people not familiar with or having used an M262 would be surprised.

 

I own both an MP240 and M262 and the M262 has a more refined, quiet shutter compared to the MP240. The M262 is a newer model than the M240 variants and there’s a definite difference.

I’d like to hear a comparison between the M10-P and M262.i think people not familiar with or having used an M262 would be surprised.

Interesting point. You've got me curious.

 

Here is a comparison between the shutters of the M10 and M10-P:

 

The M10-P definitely seems like it's be one sweet body to use.

 

I just mounted the 35mm f1.4 FLE on the just received (about an hour ago) M246 and plan to go out on a long walk around the city during my lunch hour today

The M-D is an excellent camera and a great concept, but evidently it's too much of a niche even for Leica since they're not making it anymore. I doubt they had more than 1-2 batch runs of it and it's liable to be driven up in value over time more by collector than user interest.

 

If I had a Leica M10-P, the touch screen feature would likely stay on permanent disable. I would imagine many who buy this camera will do the same. Just because it's there doesn't mean it's needed. Every digital camera I've owned other than the M262 has had a move mode option in it and I've probably recorded about 3 minutes worth of videos in over 10 years of digital camera use.

Edited August 23, 2018 by Greg M

I mean, how do you think that to be able to touch control the screen ("WOW") is going to improve your photography?

I doubt it is, but I'm also sceptical that not being able to change anything that would normally be controlled by a menu or review an image in the field would, either.

Phil

 

All those copper coins in your pocket just not enough to buy for any Leica M.

Edited August 23, 2018 by Sandy Vongries

:))

how do you think that to be able to touch control the screen ("WOW") is going to improve your photography?

I am not exactly sure but I suppose it gets us more megapixels for sale? Focus and recompose is quite a no go without DOF. - Maybe that touch screen feature is welcome to move the focusing spot i.e the bit of the image that we'll see enlarged in the EVF, around for portraiture? - I am honestly not sure how that will be going to work out, though. So far I had a chance to dabble with an ordinary, image center enlarging, early MILC and was not happy enough to end shooting any manual lens adapted onto it because in average indoors situations the EVF became just way too laggy for my taste.

I know I won't fancy shooting anything long and or heavy hand held via a rigid rear display and am not sure if the touch screen will give a huge advantage moving the to be magnified focusing spot through the additional Visoflex.

 

Considering my height I'd be happy to hear how well the M10s can be shot according to Wi-fi coupled smart devices and if those feel laggier than the original display or Visoflex

Hmm... no red dot, no

order from me...

http://bayouline.com/o2.gif

 

NO? RED? DOT?

 

but see Leica red dot - Google Search

:)

NO? RED? DOT?

 

but see Leica red dot - Google Search

:)

 

Hmm... ooh, ooh, a $7 lapel

pin! But I don't wear coats...

http://bayouline.com/o2.gif

Hmm... ooh, ooh, a $7 lapel

pin! But I don't wear coats...

http://bayouline.com/o2.gif

 

A piercing, possibly? :D

Phil.

 

"All those copper coins in your pocket just not enough to buy for any Leica M". Allen

 

That was a very rude comment joking or not.

 

A poor reflection on me.

Quiet is not silent. The rangefinder is not accurate enough for a 90 mm lens at the widest aperture. You still need two spare batteries for a day in the field. For $8000, you could get a Hasselblad X1D, which is totally silent with C/CF lenses, and cover most of the cost of a native lens as well.

 

On the positive side, losing the red dot is a step back from Leica as a symbol of conspicuous consumption. The touch screen is an excellent addition for live view, including moving the focusing spot and tap for magnification.

Or a Fuji GFX and a lens for about the same $8000 USD as the Hassy X1D and I think its a more usable system.

I haven’t moved up from an M9 yet (and still have an M8). Interestingly, I heard someone talking about either the Hasselblad digital or the Phase 1’s sensitivity to infrared as a plus and that surprised me because I’ve always thought that way about the M8 (and have used it’s sensitivity to do some interesting infrared photography) but normally it’s considered a slight. I used to use an M2 normally and a CL for lightweight back when those were reasonably priced options for Leica use. Now I have the M9 which is a great camera but there is no real Leica CL like camera (not the new one, the old Leica/Minolta CL). The modern versions of that idea seem to be about $4K which seems excessive just to get a pocket camera. Probably would be better off with an RX100 of some vintage.

 

I am considering the M10 or M10P though. They look nice and I like how the M10 looks and shoots, but I’d miss the Red dot if I bought a P (and it would be more expensive to boot). I do like the engraving on the top though. And the P means a few 10s are cut loose on the used market.

Carbon, just get the P. ;-) The difference is not that much. You're spending thousands of dollars. An extra $500 will not kill you. And you'll probably love the refinements. Red dot? Yeah I love it but one thing about Leica users that I like is that they don't need to brand signal. Look at the straps that Leica users put on their cameras, and compare them to straps that DSLR users put on theirs. Just sayin'.