My fungus lens, is it fixed? ...and a day with Youxin Ye

Nice that this thread settled down. Poor Gus. It's enough that he has DAG and Golden Touch extolled so often at his

exclusion. 'Master' rightly hit a nerve. I wouldn't work on a Leica shutter when I know that some finesse is required just to

perfectly adjust the gears on my bicycle. The only good work done on a film Leica of mine was by a Wetzlar born and

trained technician with years of experience. Happy shooting everyone.

<p>I have used several of the mentioned individuals for Leica repair work. Fortunately I've been able to discuss what the cameras (and lenses) needed prior to contracting for repairs. The discussions have helped identify the problems and resulted in fine work being done. The services involved cameras and lenses that were 40-60 years old and none were in collector condition. Sherry K. has a reputation of being not only a skilled repair person, but an expert with the Leica CL series. I was willing to pay extra for her internal upgrade parts and services. Before Leica stopped LTM repairs, I sent a IIIf in for CLA with the understanding it was to be used for winter, very cold usage. At that time Leica would prepare a camera for extreme cold usage and it has worked well for that purpose. John van Stelten at Focal Point did good work to clean condensation out of a nice Elmar 50 2.8 and restored a scratched 50 1.5 Summarit to usable condition. I am happy to say all repairs were done at agreed upon cost, in the time promised and have held up over the years since. Now I have a IIIg that is one of the first 100 made and a user heirloom with an interesting motor sports history well known to Leica. I've known of the camera since new. The camera and it's Leicavit have seen over 2000 rolls of film in professional usage and it shows in the patina and wear. Once I've set aside the $$ to have both CLA'd, I'll be talking to one of the mentioned individuals about the process for the internal restoration to Leica factory specifications.<br>

The above is to illustrate that the skills necessary to bring old Leica equipment back to Leica specifications require the same type of skills and work enviornments that high grade watch repair people have acquired through schools, apprenticeships and experience. Top camera and lens repair technicians have very specialized training and knowledge and have acquired the necessary diagnostic equipment, lubricants and tools to properly do your repairs. I applaud their willingness to continue applying their skilled professions on our behalf as I'll need their help in 2015.</p>

<p> </p>

<p>Without making any comment on the abilities of the mentioned repair persons, it seems to me that more people who can do simpler work for lower prices is a good idea.<br>

I have some cameras that I might find $50 to pay someone to do some work on. They could even be worth $100, but probably not more. They might just need a little lubrication, maybe no cleaning, and I could even live with the shutter speeds a little off. It is unlikely that any Leica master will do what I want for what I could afford to pay. <br>

I have bought quality SLRs for less than $20 that seem to work fine. (Canon FTb for $11, Nikomat FTN for $16, both with lens.) With good cameras available in that price range, how much would I want to pay for a CLA?<br>

The early Leica's are relatively simple to work on, compared to modern SLRs. It might be that someone less than a master could do what needs to be done.</p>

 

<p>Glenn - whether a film camera is $10 or $1000, it is still exposed to dust, dirt, corrosion, hardened grease and oil (e.g. Agfa's notorious green grease that hardens up like Lock-Tite). A mere relubrication may get it working temporarily, but you are only making an abrasive oily solution that will accelerate the wear. To do it properly, you need to strip it down, clean it off, then reassemble. Only then should you lubricate (sparingly). Too much oil and you create a new dust magnet.</p>

<p>For the record, when I sent my IIIF to DAG (to change to a new wind knob, as the old one was worn and brassed), the winding gears were found to be swimming in oil. DAG rectified the situation for me.</p>

<p>You may never get the shutter timings right if there is still dirt in the mechanism. Quick and dirty techs merely increase the shutter curtains' spring tension, increasing the wear even further. The old silk shutter curtains may then rip from the strain. You certainly won't have reliable, precise shutter timing. A lot of good techs have replaced mainsprings from Compur leaf shutters for me. The old ones couldn't provide the correct speeds any more, even after stripdown and cleaning. You'll never get there by just flushing with lighter fluid and shooting some oil in.</p>

<p>There is no way to get around a proper overhaul on these old cameras. These days, film and developing is not so cheap that you want to risk getting unreliable exposures with any camera.</p>

<p>I agree Robert, MANY good points there! But there are folks who look at their equipment as "transitory" and "expendable" and thus have no interest in the care and maintenance aspects. For me, I have a large collection of 35mm Canon FD, Nikon and of course my fantastic Leica M3's and lens' items. I use each and every piece of my equipment and consider its care and maintenance of paramount importance. Another point is that I intend to pass these on to another generation in the best condition possible for long term reliability and photographic "consistency". To that end I will only use the services of factory trained professional personnel. Besides the training, costs of education and time these folks have put into their craft, there are also other advantages of note. They put major costs into opening their businesses / shops. They learn finances, how to properly handle and inventory product and parts, how to PROPERLY deal with customers, and the finer points of setting up and maintaining a quality work environment. They are also heavily insured, which protects them, their businesses and the customer from loss, theft, and "accidental damages". When I utilize a professionally trained technician I know that my items will not be handled or serviced in a precarious or improper manner, and that the service person knows the product inside and out, how to clean and lubricate it properly, how to reset adjustments back to factory specs, how to ensure the item is 100% before it leaves his or her care. The training and other related costs of their business (including ongoing training to stay current as changes dictate) are of course passed on to the customer. The folks who are uninterested in what can be high costs of maintaining equipment will always seek the faster cheaper alternative. Nothing wrong with that, everyone has a choice and a reason, and that is perfectly OK. As to what you alluded to at the end, I find that having properly working equipment negates the constant experimenting and "adjustment" necessary to obtain quality images. This has to make the hobby much more pleasant. That is simply one opinion. Then again, perhaps the need to fiddle with equipment in order to obtain results is a form of fun challenge for some. Everyone has a choice and I have my reasons for mine. As long as is possible, we hobbyists (and some actual film pro's too) really need to support all of the "Trained Professionals" so that they will be around as long as possible, and continue to promote the "film" aspect pf photography so that it NEVER dies off.</p>

<p>This posting subject has really turned into quite an interesting read with all the different views, opinions and observations.</p>

<p><em>… factory trained professional personnel … faster cheaper alternative.</em><br>

What Keith says is true, but sadly there is no guarantee that an expensive slow job will be good. The worst Leica servicing by far that I ever had was from Leica UK, who took an insanely "perfectionist" approach to the quantity of new parts required for my M3, including IMHO totally unnecessary new shutter curtains, and to the amount of time required and the associated cost (over £400 some 20 years ago), but still failed to deal with the dim rangefinder prisms and sent to the camera back in a state where it jammed after one exposure.<br>

I returned it, it came back just as bad, same again after a second return, and in the end I had to send it to an independent repair service to get it fixed properly. This reliability record destroyed my faith in classic Leicas and for over 10 years I did not own any examples - it was only when I saw what Newton Ellis & Co. of Liverpool could do that I was persuaded that it was viable in any way to use classic cameras (they've done over 40 successful repairs, including many cameras such as Retina Reflex and Contax, which many repair services will not touch, and in only 2 cases was it necessary to return items for fine tuning, after which they were perfect).<br>

I would say an exchange of anecdotal experience such as is going on in this thread is vital in selecting a repair service to use. Repairpeople can behave in very odd ways - there was a well-regarded optical service in Croydon UK which was one of the few places that would repolish and recoat lenses but … they would accept work, dismantle and repolish the lenses and place the elements in a sputter chamber for coating but ONLY run the coating process when this chamber was full, no matter how long it took or how urgently customers needed their lenses back. It's pretty useful to know about things like this before you send work to the service in question!</p>

<p>Well David, the factory repair shops do have to train new hires somehow :-)</p>

<p>When I still used a Nikon F3 as my main camera, after about 20 years of continuous use it required some service. Sad to say, the local shop I used in Syracuse, NY didn't do a very good job. Nikon USA in New York was rather imperious and impersonal, and I thought that they did an acceptable, though uninspiring repair for the cost.<br>

I called Nikon USA in California, and I tried to order parts through a Spanish - speaking man with minimal English skills. Not surprisingly, I was sent the wrong parts.</p>

<p>Similar to your situation with Leica UK, I probably would have given up on Nikon had I not moved to the midwestern USA. The repair facility here - Authorized Photo Service are simply fantastic. They used to be the midwestern USA Nikon factory repair facility before they became independent. They are still tightly affiliated with Nikon.<br>

When a "new" plain prism for the Nikon F came with decemented rear elements on the finder (apparently a common risk, similar to balsam separation for Leica M3 prisms), Authorized Photo actually had new old stock replacement items for the F prism still in their inventory. They have overhauled my F, F2 and F3, and all of these cameras function as good as new. They also leave the cameras, finders, and lenses exquisitely clean after their service. I had them service a large number of my older AI/AIS lenses a few years ago, when they were getting dried up or otherwise old.</p>

<p>Anyway, the Authorized folks are the ones that other Nikon repairers bash for "deliberately" throwing mail return parcels on the floor to damage them prior to shipping the repaired items to their owners.</p>

<p>PS: For you in the UK (and elsewhere), I highly recommend Sover Wong for Nikon F and F2 repairs.</p>

<p>Well, it is no surprise to me that one man's master is another man's schlepper, especially in the highly charged domain of Leica camera repair. But to each his own. I guess that's why Al Gore invented discussion forums (just kidding). Be that as it may, I plan to have Mr. Ye spiff up a hazy LTM 9cm Elmar lens I just purchased. I do not care if potential hazards await me such as peripheral acid migration from handling a lens element sans gloves. Perhaps I should, but I don't, because by the time said acid migrates, I will be breathing fixer fumes in the Great Darkroom in the Sky. The only master technician I have ever encountered (back in the 1970s) was E.C. Walter Mantz of Philadelphia, who I am sure has passed on or is retired by now. He sure seemed to know what he and his team were doing, as far as I could tell.</p>

<p>just want to share my experience with Mr Ye , he did a superb job on leica lenses.. i will not hesitate to place him on my top list repairer along with Don DAG . When Ye need parts for my lenses he would suggest me to Don DAG without any competition feeling. Don also very helpful even its not his service job. so i would recomend this 2 guys .<br>

Cheers Fella</p>

<p>I just want to add my experiences to this thread, particularly in response to the criticism of Youxin Ye. I purchased a Leica M2 on eBay that was listed as having the slower shutter speeds off. I used it for a year, snapping some great photos. Then it developed some aberrations in the shots that I thought initially were refections from using a UV filter in strong light with both 28mm and 50mm Zeiss lenses. I removed the filters from each lens and obtained the same result. At this point I was at a loss, thought maybe it could be the shutter curtains, but was not sure. I contacted Sherry Krauter with some questions about this, she confirmed that the camera was "dry", needed servicing, and said she would look at what was causing the aberrations. In the end she did a very good job with lubrication and the CLA; however, even with the photos I had sent her regarding the issue I was seeing, she stated there was nothing wrong with the shutter curtains. Initially I didn't question her assessment, as they did not seem to appear in every shot, but in fact they did, but were just not as evident in some due to being hidden in the more exposed (lighter) areas of the shots. The main reason that I did not send it back to Sherry for rework under some sort of warranty was she took much much longer to get my M2 back to me that she initially stated, and after she had my camera I received zero communication from her even after emailing and calling. Furthermore, I had sent her photos of the issue that clearly showed the symptom of the problem. Either she just didn't care whether she resolved it, or she was so busy that she just "forgot". This is not acceptable and I was not going to make the same mistake again. <br>

Then I contacted Youxin Ye and he emailed me back within 30 mins, assessed the issue as most likely being tiny pinholes in the curtains. I committed to sending it to him and he stated to indicate on the package that it was a rush job (since I wanted it back for a family get together). The turn around time was five days, and the camera works as new now. I am very happy with his work, communication, and price. I also sent the same camera to Don Goldberg to have the larger M4 style rear viewfinder installed, and he also made a quick turn around and does excellent work. So my assessment is that all three Leica "Masters" do great work, but my least recommended would be Sherry for her failing to resolve the light leak issue and poor communication. <br>

In thinking about the criticism of Youxin's work area practices, I find myself reflecting on my own habits and those of my maintenance repairman at work. We are both very messy and unorganized, yet I have to compliment that my maintenance repairman does brilliant work, showing a talent that perhaps comes naturally and not from formal training. What I mean by that is, just because someone has not attended the Leica Academy and been employed by Leica as a repair person for a long tenure does't mean that they cannot master the craft of repairing a Leica camera. Some people have learned the skills diligently through training, and consider their work their job. Others learn their skills through a yearning passion and studying, and they consider their work their lifelong love of the craft. </p>

<p>Just my 2 cents. <br>

Heinz</p>

I am compelled to add high praise for Youxin.

He has done a meticulous work on several Canon LTM lenses (85 f1.8, 19 f3.5, 28 f 2.8, 50 f1.4 Leica early summicron-M 35mm and Leica IIIf,) He is very responsive, sending detailed info on the results of his work. Very timely too.If he cant do something he will immediately tell you (for example not able to CLA 400mm Minolta AF lens) . All the rangefinder items were repaired to my perfectionist satisfaction (I am not a lens repair tech, but i seek perfection in the output). All the lenses i use to take pictures and not keep as "my precious.." . Granted these were not stratospheric collectors items, and had just haze dust and grime to clean out and adjust focus and aperture, and most were in $200-400 range. It just would not make sense to send lenses to so called "masters" at double or triple rate, might as well just buy another lens. Moreover, when i called Sherry, she said she is too busy and suggested i call in a few months and MAYBE she will be able to take something to work on. Another "master" just cussed me how dare i unscrew anything off a Leica lens (I told him that I had unscrewed the front element trying to remove flaked off black paint chip but could not get it out and replaced the element and needed his service to CLA the lens)" He was outright nasty, needless to say, the lens did not go to him..

On the other hand, John Van Stelten has a unique niche and i used him to polish and re-coat scratched up early version of Summarit 50 f1.5. It came back looking like it just came off assembly line! and yes he charges for the work.

I think comments about someone work space belong to a government agency bureaucrat and have no place in this discussion! Just google photos of Einstein's desk!!

So I felt compelled to bring some common sense into discussion,- I believe there is a place for a reliable timely repair service for a routine issue that will take care of 95-99% and there is a place for a work that can only be done by a an expert from a rarified group to rescue a heirloom to its glory, etc, and there is a place for someone who has clearly identified special service with special equipment like a recoating chamber.

Youxin, Thank you for the expert work you are doing!

Michael

Youxin has done excellent work for me on 2 or three cameras and several lenses. They've been used hard since and are holding up fine. A year ago he was pretty fast but like everyone else he's a little snowed under now.

 

I had an email exchange with Sherry last week, and she's not accepting work on lenses any more.

 

There are fewer and fewer realistic options. (Doing without my equipment for a year is not realistic.) I've sent a couple of lenses that just needed re-lubricated to Midstate in Warwick, Rhode Island. I'll follow up here when they come back.

Follow up on Midstate: I sent them a Nippon Kogaku (Nikon) 50mm f2 and two other Japanese LTM lenses. They did a fine job fairly quickly and at a reasonable price.

One tiny glitch: the Nikkor had a dented filter ring. They did a decent job on that but the guy told me that the filter was a "weird size" and he didn't have a filter he could use to test the repair. Fair enough, except that it was 40.5mm, virtually the standard size for Japanese lenses of that vintage, and several more modern ones, including the Konica Hexanon-M 50mm.

Not really a criticism of Midstate, but an observation. Things that were standard on older equipment seem foreign and strange to younger repair folks.

I sent another lens to Vermont Camera repair and they did a fine job, and I've sent several not-so-valuable Leica lenses with fog and failed lubricant to several other non-Master places that were well reviewed. They all came back in perfect shape, including one that I had been told would be impossible to clean.

Moral of the anecdote: cleaning and re-lubing a rangefinder lens, even an older Leica lens, ain't rocket science, and doesn't need a "Master."

Original Post Dec 24, 2014