Received D850 grip + XQD card issue

I received my MB-D18 grip today and inserted an EN-EL18b battery to test the frame rate. Sure enough, it is 2 frames faster than the camera without the grip as advertised. While testing I started getting Crd Err messages on just the Lexar XQD card. I tried to format it in the camera but it gave an error and said to replace the XQD card. I formatted the card using my laptop and then the camera recognized it. I started shooting high speed again and the camera froze with the Crd Err message again which required formatting again on my laptop. I have been using this card without issues since getting the D850. Is it possible that the grip or EN-EL18b battery could be causing the issue with the card? I will change out the XQD card and see if the error presents itself again, but was just wondering if anyone had any thoughts.

I don't have an MB-D18. I wonder whether you have this issues if you use SD only. Perhaps your news MB-D18 is malfunctioning.

Barry, I haven't seen any comments regarding the indication that the 850 with the grip and battery is able to shoot 30 frames per second in crop mode with live view. Have you tried it?

I moved the XQD card to my D5 to shoot a basketball game tonight and it functioned without issue. I have a different XQD in the D850 now and will try to recreate the problem when I get a chance. As Shun suggested I will also try it with the SD card only in the camera.

 

I have not heard about the 30 frames per second, but while I am testing the cards I will give that a shot as well.

I don't believe the 30fps mode requires the grip - it's just mode 2 under "silent live view photography" here. You get DX crop at 3600x2400 for up to 3 seconds with AF and exposure fixed, JPEG only and no custom settings. Aside from the slightly different aspect ratio, it's like recording 4k video, only more restrictive...

 

(It doesn't have to move the shutter or mirror fast, and doesn't focus the lens, so I wouldn't expect the grip to contribute.)

Edited November 29, 2017 by Andrew Garrard

I find it odd that the buffer capacity actually shrinks (why?) when the EN-EL18b is used in the MB-D18 grip: Optional MB-D18 Battery Packs

 

Wondering if the same XQD card issues surface if an EN-EL15a is used in the grip instead?

Edited November 29, 2017 by Dieter Schaefer

I find it odd that the buffer capacity actually shrinks (why?) when the EN-EL18b is used in the MB-D18 grip: Optional MB-D18 Battery Packs

Of course the actual memory buffer, which physically doesn't change, is not going to "shrink" when you power the D850 with a more powerful EN-EL18b battery inside the MB-D18.

 

The problem is that Nikon has been using a very misleading definition for buffer. They are counting the number of frames you can shoot before the buffer fills up such that your frame rate will show down, limited by how fast the camera can write into the memory card, not how many frames the buffer can actually hold without writing anything into the card.

 

With Nikon's definition for buffer, their "buffer size" depends on how fast you shoot and how fast the camera can write into the card. For example, if you use 2933x type XQD card, the D500 essentially has a limitless buffer because the D500 can write faster than it can accumulate frames at its top 10 fps rate.

 

Since the D850 is 45MP instead of 20MP like the D5 and D500, it takes longer to write the huge D850 raw files into memory cards. If you shoot at 7 fps with the D850, it takes a little longer to fill up the actual buffer, which in turn has more time to write more frames into the memory card. If you use EN-EL18b batteries to shoot at 9 fps, it fills up the buffer faster and it has less time to dump frames into the card. Hence the buffer "shrinks."

 

It all boils down to the incorrect way Nikon uses the term buffer.

I do not think it is the grip that is causing the problem but rather the grip is revealing a problem with the camera as it fails to write to the XQD card when operating on the higher Voltage form the EN-EL18b.

Whatever it is, it's a weird combination. Nikon did have some kind of race condition, as I recall, with the D500; maybe the increased data rate from running at 9fps has the same effect here?

 

Barry: Have you reported this to Nikon? If it's a genuine glitch, I'd quite like Nikon to produce an update (whether firmware or a new grip) to fix it before I get around to buying a D850 myself. :-)

Barry, Interesting and frustrating problem. I do not have the D 850 and its grip, but I do have the same XQD card for my D 500 and grip. I have not used it yet, but will test it to see what issues

At NikonUSA, the manual for the MB-D18 is different from the one at the link in Dieter's post. In it , I could not find any reference to buffer being affected by battery choice.

The D850 menu guide shows the buffer capacity at 9fps (with EN-EL18b and grip) at the end. The figures given in the user manual are for 7fps.

At NikonUSA, the manual for the MB-D18 is different from the one at the link in Dieter's post.

It's in the Menu Guide, not the User's Manual: Nikon | Download center | D850

Joseph, I have been using the Lexar XQD card for a couple of months in a d500 and it has been flawless. I have the vertical grip and use a second standard battery there. Andrew, I'm with you on that and it will probably be timed to a price drop.

Andrew, I have not reported it yet because I have been tied up all day and have not been able to run more tests with a different XQD card. I plan to do that shortly and will let you know the results.

Okay, I moved the XQD card back from the D5 into the D850. I ran off several high speed bursts without issue, then suddenly the card error appeared again. I moved the card back to the D5 and turned it on, and immediately got the card error on it as well. I then moved it back to the D850 and it worked through several high speed bursts without a problem. At this point I suspect it is a card issue. If it is this is the first card problem I have had after more than 16 years of digital photography. Unfortunately it is a Lexar 64GB XQD card, so getting it covered under warranty is probably out of the question.

 

As an aside, I have had trouble getting on PN today because I am using Ad Blocker. For a few days it has just put a banner across the top, but today it is refusing to let me get on without turning Ad Blocker off even though I pay an annual fee for PN. It is getting very annoying.

I don’t see why Lexar warranty wouldn’t still apply.

I have had a few memory card failures over the years, both CF and SD, Lexar and SanDisk, especially SD cards cracking and dip switch malfunctioning (the little sliding switch that locks the card). However, I have not had any XQD failures, but I have been using XQD for less than two years.

 

That is why I use dual cards in the backup mode.

ilkka, you are correct. Lexar (now Longsys) website says to return to seller for warranty issues. I am in the process of doing that now.

 

Shun, I too only use backup mode for this very reason.

 

By the way, the website is now letting me back in without ads after I sign in as paying member. Glad they corrected that.

Picture made with the D850, it is amazing what the camera does .....