photoriot Posted December 16, 2016 Share Posted December 16, 2016 <p><a href="https://www.buzzfeed.com/craigsilverman/lake-erie-beauty?utm_term=.pkydAV2oQ#.adO6EB0dw">Dave Sandford's dizzying photos of extreme waves</a> sometimes wrench me from the reality portrayed. Does anyone have an example of abstraction in extreme situations? The safety of the sidelines of a demolition site is as far as I've gone personally.</p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AJHingel Posted December 17, 2016 Share Posted December 17, 2016 <p>Most of these Standford waves, which I admire, are for me not abstract, but a few have early impressionist abstract features, like Turners works:<a href="http://www.caumont-centredart.com/sites/hdc/files/styles/partenaire_mav/public/tate_light_and_colour_goethe_s_theory.jpg?itok=t1MTEtBQ"> here</a>, <a href="http://ecoles.ac-rouen.fr/circ-neubourg/Animations/Histoire%20et%20Art/turner/tempete%20de%20neige%20sur%20l'armee%20d'hannibal.jpg">here</a> or <a href="http://ecoles.ac-rouen.fr/circ-neubourg/Animations/Histoire%20et%20Art/turner/tempete%20de%20neige%20et%20bateau%20a%20vapeur.jpg">here</a>, which are from the beginning of the 19th century, years before any impressionist dared showing something like it. Half a century later, in 1849, Eugene Delacroix horrified classic painters with water colour work <a href="http://www.the-athenaeum.org/art/display_image.php?id=14865">like this</a>. Yes, abstract didn't start after the Second World War with abstract Expressionism and all-over drip painting. </p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
photoriot Posted December 17, 2016 Author Share Posted December 17, 2016 <p>The picture of Turner tied to the mast of a boat navigating a storm comes to mind. I guess the extant roots of abstraction could be in cave art.</p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AJHingel Posted December 17, 2016 Share Posted December 17, 2016 <p>Cave paintings are all figurative. Here "<a href="http://s3.amazonaws.com/presspublisher-do/upload/2697/horses2.jpg">The Dappled Horses of Pech-Merle</a>" (France, near Cahors and the Lot river)) dating back more than 25,000 years.</p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
photoriot Posted December 17, 2016 Author Share Posted December 17, 2016 <p>This abstract <a href="http://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-28967746">Neanderthal art</a> dates at 40,000 years. </p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norma Desmond Posted December 17, 2016 Share Posted December 17, 2016 <p>Bill, I'd consider these, by Salgado, extreme situations which have much abstract quality, whether or not I'd consider them abstracts <em>per se</em>.</p> <p><a href="http://www.graphicine.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/10/sebastiao_salgado_018.jpg">SALGADO 1 FROM SERIES</a></p> <p><a href="http://www.graphicine.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/10/sebastiao_salgado_006.jpg">SALGADO 2 FROM SERIES</a></p> <p>It's interesting that, with the waves you link to, you say they "wrench you from the reality portrayed." I kind of agree, though much of the raw power/energy of the photos comes from my continued awareness that they are massive waves, which I don't forget for long.</p> <p>The interesting thing about the <a href="http://www.graphicine.com/sebastiao-salgado-genesis/">FULL GENESIS SERIES</a> by Salgado is that his use of abstraction, as or almost as prominent in only a small few of the photos to the extent of the links I included above, is in support of a very literal documentary (ecological/political/social) statement. One might see one of the above photos on its own and be wowed by its abstract nature, but when one knows the series and the purpose behind it, abstraction actually becomes a tool of expression in the aid of a very directed sort of representative and literal communication.</p> We didn't need dialogue. We had faces! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AJHingel Posted December 17, 2016 Share Posted December 17, 2016 <p>Bill, maybe you should be more careful when you state that the so-called abstract <a href="http://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-28967746" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Neanderthal art</a> ,dates back 40,000 years.<br> First al all, if you just read the article careful, one scientists is quoted to have announced that "it's useful to consider these structured scratches as deriving from abstract or symbolic thought", not that they are, but it might be a useful hypothesis - words are important! And secondly, one cannot date the carvings, apart from the fact that they were found in caves where also 40.000 years old Neandertal remains (teeth) have been found. </p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
photoriot Posted December 17, 2016 Author Share Posted December 17, 2016 <p>Fred, thanks for the Salgado links - inspiring humanistically as well as photographically. </p> <p>Anders, thanks for reading much more deeply than I did, but the caveats don't exclude the possibility that the marks are an abstract representation of Neanderthal minds we may only dimly imagine. Sufficient for a side point that there might be uncertainty about what abstraction is and was. I try to be more scientifically exact when describing my own work, as you have noticed. :-)</p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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