What Mediun Format should I buy?

I had a Hasselblad 500 C twenty years ago(hobby). Children grew up,

interest faded. Now I again have interest beause of grandchildren.

I am only interested in black and white and my grandchildren. I do

my own darkroom work.

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I can afford(?) a Hasselblad?501 CM but is this wastful? Should I get

a Bronica or a Mamiya.

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It is important to me to get sharp images and I guess I would prefer a

Zeiss lenses.

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I can't believe I have people like you to guide me

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Thank you so much

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Robert L. Lombardo

baymeadow@riconnect.com

Robert - If I were you I would buy another 500C - I recently got

a 1969 500C and have found it to be the best built, best optics

that I have ever experienced. I have have had other medium format

cameras, but the Zeiss optics are superb. My 50mm Distagon is by

far the best lens I have ever used. I had to change to a lower

contrast paper in the darkroom due to its added inherent contrast!

You can get a 500C kit for about $1000 US and most places will offer

a warranty on Hasselblad equipment. Parts and service are still

available also. You might find a "quicker" camera or more "bells and

whistles", but Hasselblad is still the best.

Robert;

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There is a great resource on the net to read about all of the options available for MF cameras. http://smu.edu/~rmonagha/mf/gindex.html. Danny Gonzales has put together a really comprehensive write up on both current systems and older systems. He has a section listing what you can get for $200 on up! And he has personal experience with most of them!

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Happy hunting!

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P.S Pentax has some of the sharpest lenses going at fraction of Zeiss optic prices.

Without question, Hassy is the answer. For the most important

subjects you will want the best! Square pictures are definitely the

answer for me. You won't regret the expense when you buy the best.

You may be aware that there are very good used pieces out there.

tom

Spend an extra dollar or two and move up to the 500 CM body and put an

AcuteMatte viewing screen in it. You won't believe the difference it

will make, especially if your eyes are getting a little older like

mine. By comparison, the original viewing screens of the 500 C and CM

are like looking into a dark hole. I've just come back to Hasselblad

after a seven-year detour, and I'm so glad I did.

Robert,

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Some thoughts on the matter.

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I need to identify myself as a Mamyia RB67 owner up front.

I guess I can identify with the Hassy (sp?) owners who love

their equipment and that equipment is obviously very good, but ...

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I would go to a store which sells several different models and

try to get the feel of each. It might be that the "best" one

is the one which seems most natural for you to use.

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Also, the format of the camera should be considered. Personally, I

like the 6x7 format with the rotating back which allow my (mostly)

landscape and outdoor photos to pick the best size and placement.

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Lastly, while the expensive cameras might seem to be the natural

choice, it might do to consider that Edward Weston created some

of the all-time greatest pictures on equipment which most of us

would consider "junk". Comfort and fit matching your needs will

allow you to do your best work.

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Good Luck!

If you're shooting grandkids it seems to me that none of the choices

suggested so far will best siut your stated application.

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Go to a good camera store, hold and 'feel' each type of camera that

suits your interest, rent & test the one (or several) that feel the

best. Pay particular attention to the RF's like the Mamiya 7 and the

multiple Fuji RF's.

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20 Years ago there was probably a big gap in sharpness and contrast

between Zeiss optics and those of other manufacturers. Thanks to

modern design and manufacturing techniques these gaps have vastly

narrowed and have arguably disappeared making the choice of cameras

virtually completely dependant on application and system choices. The

Hasselblad is inarguably a fine camera but the arguments for it in

this forum seem to center much more around issues of 'feel' than those

of superior image quality.

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I am a Pentax 67 owner and can also 'afford' the Hasselblad. My choice

of system was based on my choice of system flexibility as it suits my

shooting style.

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I do not own a Mamiya 7 but have seen several original B&W images shot

with one and can attest to the top performance of the Mamiya optics

(no way out-performed by Zeiss or Pentax). That camera is highly

portable and very fast handling with an acceptably wide choice of

lenses including what would be my favorite, a 43mm.

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You will find no shortage of opinion on this forum which is exactly

the reason I enjoy it so much, we all vehemently defend the system we

have loyalty to.....but....

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The photography industry has changed a great deal in twenty years and

it has all been for our benefit. Take your time reading the threads in

this forum, then test and feel. You may come away from it w/ a sixties

vintage or brand new Hasselblad, then again you may find one the other

choices will suit grandkids more effectively. Most of all, have fun in

the journey to the new system.

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Here's our hope for many happy shots!

Robert:

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You have a great camera; I don't know what lenses you have but if you

still retain what you used 20 years ago for your children, theres no

reason not to use them again. Sure lenses have improved somewhat, both

in terms of flare resistance as well as contrast/resolution but in MF

portraiture, you would have a hard time telling the difference.

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But screens have become much brighter in MF SLRs. You could just

upgrade with a Beattie or Brightscreen though.

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I have a Rollei 6003, which I picked over a Hassy system, because the

automation really does improve functionality and handling over a

manual MF system. Try it out, you may like it/ or you may hate it, for

it does not have the terrific 'feel' of the Hasselblads esp. the

older ones.

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For portraiture of small children though, a rangefinder is a very good

idea. I've often considered the Mamiya 7 (and sometimes Mamiya 6

used), which handle much like the Leica M6 I use for this purpose.

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The unfortunate drawback of the Mamiya 7/Mamiya 6 for portraiture is

that the long (150mm) lens simply does not focus close enough for a

head or tight head and shoulders portrait of an adult, let alone a

child. Also, focusing the rangefinder patch gets more difficult as one

grows older, something I'm just beginning to notice.

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On the other hand, if I already had a Hasselblad, I would not have

gotten anything additional.

Most other medium format systems (particularly the Rollei 6000 series

and the various 645 systems) are more automated than the Hasselblad

500 series cameras... but that didn't stop me from recently buying a

Hasselblad. (I dunno, maybe I get all the automation I want from my

35mm gear...)

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If you are considering buying a new Hasselblad, then the 501 CM "kit"

is a good value now. Complete camera (lens, back and body) for

roughly $2700, and a rebate program provides you another back or

prism finder for free. That's at least half of what it would cost to

buy all the pieces separately.

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(Although it's probably blasphemous to say this here, I rather think

a modern 35mm autofocus system would be an easier way to keep up with

the grandkids... <g>)

Hi ,Robert welcome back to the joy of photography.

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Your concern is to be able to shoot pictures of your grandkids and

get nice sharp pictures.I just assume that your grandkids are quite

young and being a grandfather ,you probably would like to be in the

picture yourself as well.hasselblad is a great system but I trully

believe in using the right camera for the right occasion .While most

people in this forum have more than one use for their camera system

you only have one.

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This camera does not need to have interchangable backs and should

allow you to blend in with the rest of the moms and dads and kids

because the best picture you can take is not ones that are sharpest

or technically the best but one that most allow you to capture that

specific moments of their smiles and expressions.

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Kids activities will be around parties and outdoor activities .so

how about a combination of a fuji autofocus 645 that will allow you

to blend in and be in the picture yourself and a 35 mm slr that will

allow you to use long zoom lens with ease around the hockey rinks,

the soccer field or in the hall where they graduate !

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happy shooting.

If you have already owned a Hasselblad, then you know they are wonderful cameras. The new lenses are far superior to the older lenses as they have multi-coating, asymetrical elements, floating lens elements etc.

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However, before you buy the camera, you owe it to yourself to look around. There are many marvelous medium format cameras available, and the really great thing is -- they're all pretty good! At this point in time, it's kind of like trying to buy a bad motorcyle - you'll have to work hard to do it.

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Ask yourself why you are buying the camera and the functions it has to have. I own a Hasselblad because I do things that require extension tubes, interchangeable film backs, and Polaroid backs. At the time I bought my Hasselblad the Rollei prices made the Hasselblad look like a bargain. But today? I'd really have to look around as the prices I paid for my equipment are 1/2 of today's prices. The Rollei 6000 series cameras are pretty nice and have many advantages over the Hasselblad until you get to the 200 series which is really serious money.

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Likewise, Bronica and Mamiya make good cameras also. If you don't need interchangeable backs or the ultimate flexibility of a total systems approach look at the Mamiya 7. It is fairly light weight and easy to carry, and has a useable range of lenses.

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Also look at the Pentax 6x7. Its a giant 35mm in styling, but the people who use them love them and Pentax has a great range of reasonbly priced lenses for it.

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I would suggest that, if you can, go to a camera store or stores that have some of these type of cameras in stock. Spend some time getting the feel for each one and when you find one that seems "just right," tell them that you would like to take one out for a "test ride."

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Most stores will let you put one of their demo cameras on a charge card for the weekend either as a rental or "loaner." Then you can use it, evaluate it, show it off to your friends and family whatever you want to do to get the sense of whether this is the camera you really want to purchase in today's market. If it turns out you don't like it after using it - take it back and try out another one! Repeat the process until you're satisfied with a camera, then purchase it.

Robert-I own a Mamiya 645, but in your case I would go with the Fiju

rangefinders. I need the SLR because I use close up and polarizer

alot, but if I just wanted to shoot my kids I would choose the light,

flexable, Fuji. Without the hassle of a mirror slapping, you could

hand hold much better (I can not hold the 645 at all!) and it has a

huch better fit in your hands. The Mamiya 7 would be great, but look

at the cost!!! You could by the whole Fuji for what just the lens

costs on the Mamiya. Good luck in whatever you choose.--Ken Dunn

Robert, Gee, lots of opinions. From your question I gather you no

longer have the Hassy 500C. I would like to second the recommend that

you read the Danny Gonzalez MF camera reviews, in addition to the

reviews and relevant threads on this site. I do 35mm photography

(Canon and Contax) and MF; in MF I have a Mamiya 7 system, a Mamiya

RZ67II system, and a Pentax 67 system. I also have a much-loved

old Rolleicord Vb TLR which I bought new back in 1964 and which

still performs flawlessly. Much as I love the Mamiya 7, I wouldn't

recommend it for your purpose; there are definitely better choices for

people/portrait photography. Since you have a thing for Zeiss lenses,

as a cost-effective solution why not consider a Rolleiflex TLR, either

new or used?

Hi, Robert--

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You might consider an option that didn't exist when you purchased your

Hasselblad: an autofocus MF camera. Your grandfather's eyes may

be better than my relatively young eyes, but I often find it easier to

use an autofocus 35mm system to keep up with my toddler, although I

usually use a Mamiya 7.

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If I planned on only one camera system to use with children, my

experience suggests that an autofocus system would be the way to go.

The Pentax 645N is apparently quite good. You might also consider the

new Contax 645 that is due very soon. While it might have

Hasselblad-like prices (especially when it first comes to market), it

will also have the Zeiss glass that you prefer, and I understand that

it will have very fast-focusing USM-style lenses.

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You might want to check out the site listed below; it includes MTF

graphs for the many of the lenses available for the Hassleblad (as

well as the excellent Mamiya lenses, but not yet for the Contax 645)

and it has, I think, information on the the new Contax 645.

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http://www.photodo.com/prod/

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There should be descriptions of the Contax and the Pentax AF cameras

at the B&H website

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http://www.bhphotovideo.com/photo/navigation.html

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Good luck with your decision,

Brian

If most of your prints (or presentation media) will be square,

I would go with the Hassy. You are familiar with this and there

is lots of used equipment out there.

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However if you present results in rectangles, I would suggest

a 67 (or the largest format that fits within your weight limits).

I have handled the Mamiya RZII, and the view through the std view

finder is beautiful. And the image size of 67 is enough bigger than

6x6, that the decreased magnification for the same print size of

the larger image would more than compensate for any difference

in lens characteristics (that is, in my opinion, of course:).

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jdb

John, are you suggesting to Robert that he 'handhold' an RZII? I am

familiar with the RZ & RB 67's (I've never owned one but have used

them)and they are remarkable studio cameras but I would personally

dread any thought of handholding one. They are heavy and awkward (for

me) any time they are removed from a tripod.

For more years than I care to remember I used a Mamiya RB-67 hand

held to shoot weddings. The only time it went on the tripod was when

I put the 180mm lens on to shoot portraits. It was heavy, especially

after adding a flash bracket and flash unit. But, I did it anyway

because it would do most any shot that it wanted. It's heaviness

actually help a bit on those low shutter speed available light

shots. The bellows allowed me to get about as close as I wanted for

the more unique ring shots etc. Recently I bought the Hasselblad

501c, and I use it for almost all the hand held stuff and the RB has

been delegated to mostly tripod use, shots from the back of the

church, portrature with a backdrop, some alter return stuff etc. I

bought the RB with 9omm lens and back new for, I believe $475 about

20 to 25 years ago. No one camera will do every thing. Some will do

more than others. I too am a grandfather now with three that won't

sit still. The autofocus sounds mighty good. I want an autofocus

Hasselblad with standard lens and a good Zeiss portrait lens for it,

with a built in bellows. And I want to pay $475.