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LF lenses for Architectural Models?


michael_duggleby

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<p>I'm about to begin building scale models of interior architectural spaces which will be around 70" squared and would ideally like photograph them with a LF camera. What I would like clarification on is whether I will find a lens with a minimimum focus distance small enough to photograph the entire model sharp. I am yet undecided on which camera to purchase (if indeed LF cameras are compatible with this form of photography at all) but I will be restricted to a 4x5 field camera as this will give me more of a chance of getting in nooks and crannies than a 10x8 although I know its going to be a squeeze.<br /> <br /> Any advice much appreciated.</p>
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LF lenses do (generally) not have a focusing mount. The close focus limit is set by the camera, by the amount of extension it can provide.<br>Using LF mono rail cameras, there is no limit to that.<br><br>70" squared, i.e. about 8-and-a-bit" x 8-and-a-bit"? That's not very small, requiring a magnification of about 0.6x on 4x5". Using the 4x5" format's 'standard' 150 mm lens, that requires a total extension of about 254 mm (lens-to-subject distance of about 40 mm, or 16"). You don't even need to do something special to achieve that with most LF cameras, including field cameras.<br><br>To mimic a real life perspective, you will have to set a lens-to-subject distance that is scaled down to the same scale as that of the model. That probably means closer than those 16", so a shorter lens than that 150 mm with less extension needed (for instance: a 90 mm lens, with 140 mm of extension at a lens-to-subject distance of about 230 mm, or about 9").<br>Also not a problem with most LF cameras.<br><br>Assuming that you will not have to fit a camera into the model, an 8x10" might do as well as a 4x5".
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<p>The first section of the Lens Tutorial, http://www.photo.net/learn/optics/lensTutorial, has the equations for magnification versus object distance, image distance and focal length. As already explained, if your view camera has enough extension, the lens will work. If the focal length is too short, the subject distance might be so small that lighting the subject becomes tricky. With a longer lens the studio space needed increases ... the sum of the subject size, subject distance, image distance and space for the photographer can become large.</p>
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<p>A key to realistic perspective is to put the camera at a scale observer's eye level. This is why compact cameras are now popular for model railroad photography, the lens is at eye level, and the small sensor means lots of (desperately needed) depth of focus. You can use the slowest ISO to avoid the sensor noise.</p>

 

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<p>Several answers, but I do not understand the question, so can not give an opinion.<br>

I assume that you are talking about a scale model room about 6 feet by 6 feet in size. But then what?<br>

a, Do you want to photograph it from the perspective of someone standing inside the room?<br>

b, Do you want to shoot down into the room from above.<br>

c, Do you want perspective controlled shot from outside the room (seems most likely as you are asking about a view camera)?<br>

d, if c, will you be able to remove a wall or shoot through a window in the model?<br>

e, Something else?<br>

All of those require different answers. if you want all those answers a good text book on architectural photography is probably what you need.<br>

You will need answers about what camera, what lighting, and other things as well.</p>

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<p>I do understand the intention but I would also point to my issues of suspicion. I am an architect and I have practiced model making and photography.</p>

<p>1. I think that the level of detailing that LF provides is surpassing the level of precision in model making. You would be seeing a lot of well rendered torn edges and material inconsistencies - unless Your model is a superb piece of handicraft - which is usually not the case.<br>

2. You will get all the drawbacks of the large sensor/film with LF - the diminished DOF at similar viewing angles being the worst of them. The smaller the sensor the longer the DOF (depth of field) at similar apertures. <br>

3. Clumsy and cumbersome operation of the equipment being a very important issue too - You will not be able to choose Your viewpoint because it is hard to fit in with the camera. With this and previous point considered I would call small sensors a godsend for model photography.<br>

4. The qualities of LF like the DOF control is not very useful for interior images. Perspective control - alright, but You have unlimited opportunities of positioning the camera in vertical direction -ie. You can choose an angle where no PC is needed (this claim can be totally inadequate for Your needs). It is also very easy to do correct perspective in photoshop - since You will not be whining about the lost pixels (see pt. 1, the level of detailing)<br>

But if You are still convinced to use LF I would suggest that You should get the widest angles You can - Super Angulon 58XL is what I have used for indoor shooting. Firstly You will have sufficient amount of space in the view and secondly You will need less extension and have longer DOF (than with longer lenses).</p>

 

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<p>Check model railroading magazines and you'll find lots of information on doing this type of photography. Rarely, if ever, done with large format by the way.<br>

You'll probably be better served with a digital slr, internal focussing macro lens, and image stacking software like <em>Helicon Focus</em>. There's a new system on the way called <em>StackShot</em>, check it out at:www.cognisys-inc.com. Might be what you need.<br>

JD</p>

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<i>"Does increasing bellows draw reduce minimumo focus distance?"</i><br><Br>Yes, and no.<br>Increasing bellows draw reduces focusing distance.<br>"Mininum" focusing distance depends on the <i>maximum</i> to which you can extend bellows draw (and the physical size and shape of the lens. But that's another matter, that you will not have to deal with in the scenario described. Just mentioned it because else, someone else will.)
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<p><em>do you find drop off a problem with 58XL and sharpness around the edges?</em></p>

<p>You mean light fall off?<br>

I personally do not. But I have usually taken pictures on 6x9 with 120 film back. No center filter. I kind of like the fall off - it contains the real LF feel.<br>

The sharpness is superb all over the frame at least to my standards.<br>

A totally uncorrected office flatbed scan of a 4x5 slide can be seen<br>

- http://www.ata.ee/temp/3.JPG <br>

to evaluate fall-off.<br>

Don't mind the dark area noise - it's the scanner.</p>

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<p>I am worried that you won't be able to get your depth of field with a 4x5 camera. A 47mm lens at f32 has enough depth of field for everything from 1-3 feet in focus. That may be enough, but if the nearest object needs to be closer than dof gets smaller, like .7ft to 1.5 ft.<br>

Also, consider the lighting because f32 is quite a small opening, and it may be hard to use flash. Good luck and have fun.</p>

 

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Assuming your final image size is not huge, I'd suggest looking at a used Canon 5D and a Canon 24mm tilt shift lens. You

will get the depth of fiels you need and the perspective control. Shot on a tripod and lit well, you will have a very high

quality image.

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