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In Desperate Need of Upgrade Help


rob_sharpe

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<p>Current wedding camera kit.<br>

Canon 40D with EF-S 17-85mm f4-5.6<br>

Canon EF 70-200mm L f4<br>

Canon Speedlite 550EX<br>

Back up Camera<br>

Canon 10D with 28-135mm f3.5-5.6<br>

I know I'm well behind in regards to current technology and kit, however I've successfully been photographing weddings for over 13 years and have had lots of happy clients throughout that time. I do feel I'm lagging behind the current, "modern" pros now though.<br>

I can't afford a 5D Mark 2 and some of the Canon L lenses, whilst highly desirable, are probably beyond my budget.<br>

Here are my initial upgrade thoughts, I'd appreciate helpful comments<br>

Canon EF 85mm f1.8<br>

Canon EF 17-40 L F4<br>

Not sure about a new back up or new main body (suggestions)</p>

<p>Thanks</p>

 

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<p>My main suggestion is to restructure your offerings and prices to make your weddings more profitable. More often than not, photographers don't include funding new camera and computer equipment into their actual cost of doing business. Your profit should not be used to buy new equipment. It's time to start saving for your next generation of equipment. Best of luck.</p>
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I would not buy a 17-40 as its about 28-63 equivilent on your crop bodies. You already have that. I have a 17-40 and aside from some barrel distortion when wide and open it works well on full frame. I have used it also as a walk around on a crop body. I have the 85 f1.8. It is sharp, good in low light, inexpensive and light weight. I did weddings for several years with the MF equivilent of 28 mm without having to go wider for formals. BTW Monte Zucker before he died did some stunning weddings with a Canon 10D. If it were me I would get a backup flash unit (cost of doing business). When I was in business my rule was not to buy equipment unless it got a reasonable(fairly short) return on investment, expanded my capability to serve customers within reason (this includes adequate backup), or was essential to delivery of the product. I have been successfully using a 5D for some time. You would probably need to go to a 24-70 2.8 if you went full frame, however. If your customers are happy I would tend to your backup needs. A single flash failure could be real trouble in dark venues.
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<p>I'd get the canon ef 50 f/1.4 or 1.8 before the 85 as that 50 is 80 on your cropped bodies. You'll get some very nice portraits out of those lenses and it's very good for walking around at the reception because they are far better in low light than any of your current lenses, just use your feet to zoom. </p>
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<p>I would get rid of the 10D (EF-S lenses won't mount on it). I would look to get perhaps a 7D as Nadine mentioned, and have that as main body with the 40D as its backup.</p>

<p>For wedding work you really should look to use constant max aperture lenses. I would not, in your case, consider the 17-40L. Much as I love mine, I use it for ultra-wide shots on my FF and film SLR. Consider instead the Sigma 17-50 f/2.8 OS - it has received some rave reviews so far.</p>

<p>You are also lacking truly fast glass so again I would concur that you need to add a prime lens to your arsenal: I would advocate for a 50mm first. I have been using my nifty fifty (50 f/1.8) for years now, on film SLR, APS-C dSLR and now full-frame dSLR, with great success. The 85 may be a tad long on your APS-C sensor bodies, especially if you find yourself in more confined spaces.</p>

<p>For flash, perhaps a 580EX I or EX II if you can afford it.</p>

 

<blockquote>

<p>Strange, just one wedding would cover you 5D body with a decent L</p>

</blockquote>

<p>Surely, that is overly simplistic and a tad presumptuous. A lot depends on what Rob's pricing model and subsequent profit margin is (and of course on what "L" would suit his style).</p>

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<p>There are three areas you desperately need upgrading, but they must be prioritized, IMHO, your lighting should be addressed first (since you have NO backup, compounded w/ NO fast lenses). a second 550ex should be ~$200, a far better alternative from a price/performance standpoint than any other Canon unit... the downside is that they are all used. If you can't afford that, some of the manually adjustable, digital ETTL bounce/swivel flashes avail on ebay are around $100 and would provide perfectly adequate backup lighting in a pinch.<br>

Second priority is glass. No fast zooms and no primes. ouch. I would suggest a 50/1.8, a tamron 17-50/2.8 then an 85/1.8. Then a 50-150/2.8 This is in order of priority & cost.<br>

Third priority is of course a new body. Unlike the previous posts, since you are on such a tight budget, I wouldn't consider the 7D. instead I'd try the 50D. It's a far better pro camera than the 60D, and $600 less than the 7d. It's really not that the 7D isn't better, <em>but that it's not so significantly better that it's worth the extra $$$</em>, You'll find the benefit from getting an extra $600 worth of glass and lighting is far greater than getting the 7d vs. the 50D. Another benefit is that BP-511s run the 50D, so your 40Ds batts will work in both, saving you another $70-150. </p>

<p>As I said before, you need an upgrade budget. Once you have that figure, then you can make a prioritized list of purchases. No doubt, anything from $100 up will help, but how <em>much</em> it helps depends on where you spend it.</p>

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<p>Rob, why do you feel you want to upgrade?<br>

What is it about your current equipment that you feel could be better or different?<br>

Do you just want new equipment or are you in fact trying to accomplish something else like increasing your business or profit or perhaps produce another type of images? If that is the case please elaborate.</p>

<p>Giving equipment suggestions is rather pointless without knowing what the equipment is suppose to do for you.</p>

<p> </p>

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<p>Ok there are some valid points being raised so let's see if I can expand further.<br>

Firstly, thanks for the great input so far.<br>

Marcus Ian raises a good point regarding the budget.<br>

I guess I'm looking at approx £1000-£1500max (looking to add depth to my camera bag rather than one pricey upgrade, however if that's what I need then so be it)<br>

Pete S wanted to know why I want/need an upgrade.<br>

Requirements - Looking to improve the sharpness of my images. 17-85mm just isn't any good at 17mm end particularly for the big group shots and although much better optically the 70-200 just isn't practical to have attached all the time. Also on both the 10D and 40D there is quite a lot of noise even at 400ISO. Ultimately I'd like to increase the profit of my business as well as expanding the range or style of photos I can offer.<br>

Would I be guessing correctly in assuming priorities are<br>

1)a second flash unit<br>

2)some faster glass (50mm f1.8 seems a common suggestion)<br>

3)a body that can act as a new main (50D, 60D or 7D)</p>

<p> </p>

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<p>Re sharpness of a mid range, wide aperture zoom--Tamron 17-50mm f2.8 (I have and know this lens) or the Sigma 17-50mm f2.8 (new model) that Mark Anthony mentioned. These will definitely be sharp enough. These are also mentioned because they are cheaper (yet almost as good) as the Canon 17-55mm f2.8. Also, be sure you don't have focusing issues, which are common with cropped sensor cameras, particularly on the wide end. I thought the 17-85mm was at least decent.</p>

<p>Re noise levels with the 40D and 10D. If you are getting noise at ISO 400 with the 40D, you are underexposing and pulling up exposure in post, or you are pixel peeping too much. I have no problem using the 40D at ISO 1600 without applying any significant dose of noise reduction in post. The trick is to NOT underexpose, requiring no pulling up of exposure in post. In addition, prints don't show noise nearly as badly as images seen on a monitor.</p>

<p>If it were me, I would be buying the Tamron or Sigma first, then a 580EX (maybe used), then the 50mm f1.8 (or 1.4), and finally, replace the 10D with a 30D. You can expand the range and style of your images quite nicely.</p>

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<p>According to dxomark you will not see a visible difference in resolution (sharpness) at 17mm by using a Tamron 17-50mm f2.8 or Canon 17-55mm f2.8 IS or Sigma 17-50 f2.8 OS instead of your Canon 17-55mm f4-f5.6 IS. Sorry.<br /> However a 5D MkII with something like a 24-105 f4 IS would make a huge difference.</p>

<p>And regarding noise you will only gain a half stop improvement by upgrading to a 50D, 60D or 7D. If you shoot raw that is. For any substantial improvement in noise you really need to go full frame.</p>

<p>But when it comes to noise and sharpness you can gain a lot just by improving your post production and maybe shooting technique.</p>

<p>If you want substantial improvement I think you need to save up for a 5D MkII. Something like a Tamron 28-75 f2.8 would get you going. If you buy used I think you might be able to pull that off within your budget.</p>

<p> </p>

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<blockquote>

<p>And regarding noise you will only gain a half stop improvement by upgrading to a 50D, 60D or 7D. If you shoot raw that is. For any substantial improvement in noise you really need to go full frame.</p>

</blockquote>

<p>Over the 10D? um... no. Not even close.</p>

<p>Nobody suggested replacing the 40D, but if the 10D had to to primary unit service, it would be pretty incapable of doing even a reasonably proficient job, especially if paired w/ the glass the OP has available to use. </p>

<p>To blow the entire wad on a 5d2 is pure sillyness, especially when there are so many other holes in the kit. The 5D would also necessitate addtnl costs. (such as lp-e6s), also then you'd have dual format issues. A far more reasonable answer is to get a 50D/60D, a tamron 17-50/2.8 , a 50/1.8 (and maybe an 85/1.8), & a 550/580/430 ex. Not only does that address ALL the primary needs, but it allows a significant improvement in IQ, expands the OPs photographic capabilities, and meets the A #1 need in all business. The budget. </p>

<p>As far as proper backing up, at that point the only change I'd make is to dump the 17-85 and buy an 18-55/IS (to serve as a backup for the 17-50. Keep the 10D, as an emergency only unit.</p>

<p> </p>

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<p>I'm curious, how much are you charging for a typical wedding? I'm curious about your work.<br>

13 yrs of wedding photography with happy clients should net quite well to do by now. Then again, perhaps you have other priorities on expenditure.<br>

Anyhoo, as much as I hardly ever recommend replacing body, but your 10d really has to go. Even a cheap Rebel will outdo the 10d in IQ, speed, etc....<br>

A 5d Classic would be worth your while. With the extra $ you can get a 85 1.8. I do think from your lens collection you are speed limited on the tele-end. How do you get around dark venues that don't allow flash?!<br>

While you're at it, lose the 28-135 lens and the 70-200 f4L. With the sale of those lenses, get a 70-200 2.8L IS mkI.</p>

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<blockquote>

<p>I'm looking at approx £1000-£1500max looking to add depth to my camera bag rather than one pricey upgrade . . . Looking <strong>to improve the sharpness of my images. 17-85mm just isn't any good at 17mm end particularly for the big group shots.</strong></p>

</blockquote>

<p>5D (second hand). <br>

Maybe sell the EF-S 17 -85.<br>

How is the 28 -135 @ 28mm?<br>

Alternative suggestion: 5D + 24/2.8, that prime is sharp.</p>

 

<blockquote>

<p>Also on both the 10D and <strong>40D there is quite a lot of noise even at 400ISO. </strong></p>

</blockquote>

<p>Then something is wrong – I can push a 30D and 20D to ISO1600, a 5D to ISO3200 and make acceptable and saleable 10x8 and 14 x11 prints.<br>

My first guess is you are NOT nailing the exposure.</p>

 

<blockquote>

<p>Ultimately I'd like to increase the profit of my business as well as expanding the range or style of photos I can offer.</p>

</blockquote>

<p>Expanding Profit as a result of range and style <em>and linking that to new gear</em>: one suggestion a few fast Primes and develop your AL shooting.<br>

If you go with the idea of the 5D, then maybe instead of the 24/2.8 get the 35/2 (if 35 on a 5D is wide enough for you) and the 85/1.8 . . . then, in terms of FoV you do not need a 50mm.<br>

Alternatively if F/2.8 is fast enough at 24mm, then the 50/1.8 (or 1.4) and the 135/2L would be the additional pair for a dual format kit.<br>

Anyway, the kit is lacking a fast Prime or two . . . how do you manage NO FLASH during the Ceremony?</p>

<p>Increasing the Profit of your Business and not linking that to getting new gear is a different kettle of kippers.</p>

 

<blockquote>

<p>Would I be guessing correctly in assuming priorities are<br />1)a second flash unit<br />2)some faster glass (50mm f1.8 seems a common suggestion)<br />3)a body that can act as a new main (50D, 60D or 7D)</p>

</blockquote>

<p>1) Get a second Flash unit – yes - <strong>that is a critical weakness.</strong></p>

<p>2) I cannot see any Wedding Kit without at least two fast Primes, (preferably three) one slightly wide and one slightly long - as mentioned how does one manage when there is a NO FLASH rule?<br>

Buying the 50/1.8 might be a good idea IF that is the FL which will give you the most leverage – I very much doubt it will be the best<em> single choice </em>fast Prime Lens choice if you keep an APS-C kit</p>

<p>3) I cannot see any substantial <em>value for output gain</em> gain by investing the limited capital you have, in a 50D, 60D or 7D, if you already have a 40D AND the lenses you presently use and only ONE (older) flash unit: there are other priorities and other better and cheaper means of diversifying the kit. </p>

<p>WW</p>

 

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