Video: Canon 7D vs 60D (or maybe T3i?)

<p>I am diving back in to DLSR because of using video.<br /> I heard that 7D has more control during shooting video than 60D but 60D has other newer features.</p>

<p>Anyone could provide some insights in to these two options?</p>

<p>I have a 7D, have used the 5D Mark II a lot, and have had my encounters with 60D and T2i as well (all for video purposes). One thing must be understood: the newer the camera doesn't necessarily mean the better the camera.</p>

<p>The first DSLR with video capabilities, the 5D Mark II, still remains the best for shallow depth of field and best low-light management (that's if you don't take the 1D Mark IV into consideration, with it's steep price and all). The 7D is much easier on the controls than the 5D Mark II, plus it also gives your lenses an extra reach with the 1.6x crop factor. It's also much more compatible with PL lenses such as Zeiss CP.2 primes and zoom lenses than the 5D Mark II <em>and </em>the 1D Mark IV.</p>

<p>Now, under what circumstances would I consider a 60D or T2i as a substitution to the afore mentioned camera models? Two probabilities: [1] either I have no possible way to afford a 5D Mark II or a 7D (which is hard to believe, at least for the 7D since it's $600 dollars away), or [2] I want to record videos as a hobby during personal time (in other words, I don't make my living out of it). The image quality in these cameras is still HD, yes, but it suffers from a lot more artifacts than the others, limits your ISO usage due to extreme graininess, and represent a much less sturdier camera body making it much more vulnerable to accidents that may occur during a recording set.</p>

<p>If I were to choose tomorrow again, <strong>I'd buy the 7D </strong>(again). The 1D Mark IV is excellent, but costs too much and the benefits don't really weigh as much as $5,000 dollars extra. You're better off buying L glass with that extra money.</p>

<p>P.S.: I mentioned the T2i instead of the T3i because it hasn't come out on sale and I haven't been able to try it myself. However, it shouldn't be too different. Also, if you're not in a hurry, there are a lot of rumors (from "secure" sources) that either the 7D Mark II or the 5D Mark III will come out during Q3 or Q4 of this year (the latter being much more probable).</p>

<p>I don't know where you buy your 7D's, but my experience is they go for ~$1500 for the body. If they were $600, I'd own two :-) Did you mean $600 <strong><em>additional</em></strong>?</p>

<p>I bought the 7D with an eye to video, for a few reasons:<br>

Video is my work, I already have broadcast cameras, I have used the 7D for a few jobs, but 8/10 its the conventional camcorder that is used.<br>

At the time I was buying the 5D didn't have a PAL 25fps mode or decent exposure controls.<br>

The footage that I saw from both gave me the impression that the 7D had less issue with rolling shutter, though you still need to watch what you are doing.<br>

The 7D still had depth of field control a plenty. Compared to any video camera out there. The shallow dof look is great when used selectively and for a purpose, it's not the absolute be all and end all. Check out vimeo, lots of shallow dof, bokeh lights and accoustic soundtracks. For most video use the edge the 5D2 has over the 7D is negligible.<br>

Finally, apparantly the 7D also takes photos. This is my main pastime. I like speedway. I like nature. For fast moving subjects the 7D trounces the 5D2's AF and frame rate.<br>

Purely in terms of video, if i were buying now, I would probably go for a 60D over a 7D, as it has the useful flip out screen and audio level control with agc off.<br>

But for my needs I would probably buy the 7D all over again.<br>

I very recently bought a T2i, but this is for jib and steadicam use (the 7D with tokina 11-16 is quite a heavy chunk) and for those rare occassions I need a second angle.</p>

<p>There is the recently announced T3i with the same flip out screen and manual audio. Not reviewed yet and I gather it has a different low pass filter from the 7D, 60d, 550D which may be a statement of intent regarding video use (the lowpass on these cameras is optimised for 18MP stills, not 2MP HD video) so i would hold off if you can, as it's a good bit cheaper than the 60D and will only drop further after launch, usually I advise to wait until the early adopters have broke it and Canon have updated the firmware accordingly.</p>

<p>There are a few hits and tips for 7D use:<br>

Keep the profile as neutral as possible, don't use AWB<br>

Up to ISO 800 is great for video, a bit rough beyond that.<br>

You'll need to adapt the camera for pro audio, I went the beachtek route to keep all the files self contained. This takes care of the AGC and headphone socket issue as well.<br>

Keep your workflow progressive through out, timeline, interpretation of footage, BR or DVD encoding.. needs to be progressive or you will get awful results on interlaced tvs.<br>

If you do get aliasing a half pixel guassian blur in post is usually enough to fix it without degrading the footage.</p>

 

<p>@ Wayne Woodruff: Yes, $600 dollars extra besides the $900 dollars the 60D costs (body only).</p>

<p>@ Paul Russell: The additional features you mention about the 60D are not necessarily an edge on the 7D. In my case, for example, I own an external marshall monitor with an israeli arm, which gives me a much largar screen (Marshall 7") to pull focus, and to move it around however I want. The auto-gain issue is also irrelevant for me. Even if it can be manually control, the camera's audio is not half as good as if you'd record it separately with another equipment (I use Zoom H4n).</p>

<p>One other thing about tips of HD DSLR use, here are some more:<br>

[a] The ISO is cleaner in 160, 320, and 640 (after 800 is rather too grainy, like Paul Russell; I only use higher ISOs in emergencies).<br>

The video will be slightly smoother if you keep the shutter speed twice as fast as the frame rate you're recording (24/25p = 50/1s; 30p = 60/1s; 50p = 100/1s; 60p = 120/1s).<br>

[c] For best color results, always carry something white in order to place it under the lighting circumstances of the shot, and make a custom white balance.</p>

 

<blockquote>

<p>Edwin Marlin<br>

@ Paul Russell: The additional features you mention about the 60D are not necessarily an edge on the 7D. In my case, for example, I own an external marshall monitor with an israeli arm, which gives me a much largar screen (Marshall 7") to pull focus, and to move it around however I want. The auto-gain issue is also irrelevant for me. Even if it can be manually control, the camera's audio is not half as good as if you'd record it separately with another equipment (I use Zoom H4n).</p>

 

</blockquote>

<p>Em, I would say the AGC off is an edge as it is a feature the 7D hasn't got, and I would also say that the swivel screen is an edge as it's a feature the 7D hasn't got.<br>

If you want a larger screen then you would need to buy one for either camera, if you want to record on a zoom then you would need to buy one for either camera. Out the box, the 60D does indeed have advantages for video users.<br>

I'm not that taken by adding screens and zoom recorders, for a few reasons, it makes something that was fairly compact into something else that requires a rig etc. By that point I'm reaching for my digibeta in anycase.<br>

I'm not a huge fan of the zoom recorders, I prefer a beachtek, as the recording is still done with one button through the camera, no second device to forget to hit record on. I've read many theoretical complaints about audio quality on DSLRS ranging from quality of pre-amps (use a hot mic such as a K6/ME66 or external pre-amps such as on the Beachtek DXA-SLR thus bypassing the camera pre-amps) to the quality of MPEG4 audio, which in context, isn't any more lossy than H264 video.<br>

My own experience is that with a good hot mic you get very clean audio on the 7D with the beachteks AGC disable feature.<br>

Not any different to the audio I get from my other camcorders.<br>

Individual preference is all. But the AGC off and the flip out screen are benefits. Might not suit your technique, but will doubtless suit others.</p>

<p>Paul - which Beachtek do you use with the Sen K6/ME66? Researching options for decent sound on a Canon and still trying to get my head around the options. Thanks for any advice you can offer.</p>

<p>PS thanks for the useful info at top of post too!</p>

<p>Hi John</p>

<p>I use the DXA-5Da no problems at all with the K6/ME66 combo, also works well with the Rode NTG-2.<br>

However if you need phantom you are better with the DXA-XLR as this keeps your options open, it has it's own pre-amps which out-perform those of the cameras. I use this one with my ECM-77's as they aren't quite as hot as the rifles.</p>

<p>Cheers Paul - much appreciated.</p>

<p>Instead of going with the above both camera go with a better one <a href="http://blog.camerafobia.com/canon-eos-600d-rebel-t3i-preview">Canon Rebel T3i / EOS 600D</a> which Canon introduced a new camera for amateur photographers which features 18 Megapixels and a rotating and swiveling display. The Rebel T3i / EOS 600D enables continuous shooting at 3.7 frames per second. It provides new, fully automatic "Scene Intelligent Auto" mode for great pictures easy to Art Scene Intelligent Auto analyzes the scene and automatically selects the optimal settings, the photographer can concentrate on the recording.</p>