Which camera should I upgrade to?

<p>I've photographed 4-5 small outdoor wedding ceremonies and one big 8 hour indoor wedding and reception with my Olympus E-500 and the standard lens that came with it (14-45mm) f/3.4-5.6. It was tough getting sharp shots in a dark church with a slow lens like that, but I managed and the photos turned out wonderfully for my friends. After doing a few weddings, I've decided I really want to get into photography as a business, but I know it's supposed to be the photographer that makes the photos, but I feel that I have an eye for it and that my camera is limiting me as far as ISO and my lens as far as aperture.<br /><br />Consequently, I'm in the market for a new camera and because Olympus just doesn't offer any lenses faster than a 2.0, I don't want to waste my money buying lenses for the camera I currently have. I will be keeping my camera as a backup but I'm looking into Canon for the new one. I'm thinking about either the 50D or the 5D. The 5D is vastly more expensive and I'm wondering if it will be worth it in the long run if I'm wanting to do wedding photography on the side or whether the 50D with the same nice lenses (around f/1.4) would be sufficient?</p>

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<p>I'm in the market for a new camera and because Olympus <strong><em>just doesn't offer any lenses faster than a 2.0 . . .</em></strong>I'm thinking about either the 50D or the 5D. The 5D is vastly more expensive and I'm wondering if it will be worth it in the long run if I'm wanting to do wedding photography on the side <em><strong>or whether the 50D with the same nice lenses (around f/1.4) would be sufficient?</strong></em></p>

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<p>The 50D with the "same nice lenses around F/1.4" will be VASTLY different.<br>

You cannot get wide at F/1.4 using a 50D.<br>

However, a 50D and the: EF24F/1.4L; EF35F/1.4L; EF50F/1.4 and EF85F/1.8 would make a good, fast kit: if 24mm is wide enough for you.</p>

<p>WW</p>

 

<p>By 5D do you mean the MK II? You can get the 5D MKI for a little more than the 50D. My suggestion would be spend less on a body and more on glass. Lenses hold their value much longer and are generally a better investment. Especially starting out I think you'd be fine with the 50D. Once you start getting more gigs then go for some bigger better stuff. </p>

<p>- Joseph Molieri</p>

<p><em>"After doing a few weddings, I've decided I really want to get into photography as a business, but I know it's supposed to be the photographer that makes the photos, but I feel that I have an eye for it and that my camera is limiting me as far as ISO and my lens as far as aperture...."</em></p>

<p>Typical story, heard it several times before. Would suggest that before you make any purchases that you continue to do your homework. You could start by reading: <a href="../learn/wedding/equipment">http://www.photo.net/learn/wedding/equipment</a> You also need backup gear and the knowledge of how to use lighting...... Operating a studio requires a completely different skill set. You might want to look into finding a mentor and an apprenticeship of some sort. Welcome to P-net & Good luck.</p>

<p>Please read Marc Williams' great post about gear.</p>

<p><a href="00V98v">http://www.photo.net/wedding-photography-forum/00V98v</a></p>

<p>Then rent suitable candidates and then you'll know. Hard for anyone else to make this decision for you. A large part of it will fall into place when you get the camera(s) in your hands.</p>

<p>I am not trying to be discouraging, but frankly, the business of photography has next to nothing to do with photography. The better you are at business, the better you will do. The better you are at photography will mean little to nothing without the business skills. There are plenty of great photography's that can't make a nickel and plenty of so-so photographers making a living from it.</p>

<p>That said, I agree: rent the gear first. Just don't rent it for the first time @ a wedding!</p>

<p>Andi --</p>

<p>I've visited your profile and noticed that you joined the community yesterday. There is a wealth of information here and this question has been asked many, many times. Please do a search of the forums and you will find probably 20 discussions like this one in the past few months.</p>

<p>As for your question...<br>

I went to your profile to see the style of photography you shoot. There are no photos in your profile yet. Please upload a few photos so we can get an idea your style. Without this information it is very hard for me/us to suggest a set of lenses and a camera body for you.</p>

<p>A few questions:</p>

<p>~Are you shooting with available light only or are you shooting with a flash?<br>

<br />~Do you want to cover a wedding with a set of primes or a set of zooms? Based on your post, I will guess that you haven't used primes yet.</p>

 

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<p>Olympus just doesn't offer any lenses faster than a 2.0</p>

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<p>~Do you really need faster than 2.0? If yes, why?<br>

Just an FYI, I currently have exactly one lens faster than 2.0 and I'm not sure I'll buy another for a while.</p>

<p>~Do you own a tripod? If no, why not?</p>

 

<blockquote>

<p> I feel that I have an eye for it and that my camera is limiting me as far as ISO and my lens as far as aperture.</p>

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<p>~I know nothing of your eye as I haven't seen a single photo of yours. As for the camera limiting you as far as ISO...well, photographers shot weddings before digital with 400 and 800 speed film. 1600 was very grainy and very expensive, so I know I never shot with it. So why is it that your ISO is limiting you? And how is the aperture limiting you? is it about shooting in available light or is it about DOF? Again...more questions need to be answered.</p>

<p>~ Have you ever shot as a second under an experienced professional? Your gear is probably sufficient to do so and I suggest a few weddings as a second prior to scrapping your current kit and buying a bunch of new gear.</p>

<p>There are many more questions that need to be answered, but I think we need the above questions answered before I ask any more. We also need to see a few photos. If you don't want to upload to photo.net, please send us a link to an online gallery or your web site.</p>

<p>Hope this helps and I look forward to your responses.<br>

RS</p>

<p>I look forward to your responses.. . .</p>

<p>Me too.</p>

<p>WW</p>

<p>Thank you everyone for replying so quickly! In response to Richard, here is a link to my blog:<br>

www.photographybykiss.wordpress.com<br>

The wedding I was referring to that really tested my knowledge of IS0 and aperture was the June Wedding (Mitch and Megan).<br>

I do have a tripod and I used it at the wedding but I still had to pump my IS0 up high because the church was so dimly lit and would not allow flash during the ceremony (which I know is a very typical situation, I just don't know what other option there is other than having a faster lens) So of course some of the photos came out pretty grainy. How do you capture the action minus the graininess without a faster lens?<br>

No, I have never shot as a second although I have actively called and tried to procure a position. Any advice on what other steps I could take to find someone to shoot under?<br>

I've resolved to just stick with outdoor ceremonies for now and as someone suggested, buying a 50mm macro lens f/2.0 for my Olympus that would help with portraits and engagement shots. I’m just going to stick with it until I have some more practice with this camera. I'm self-taught and only know what I've researched online and practiced in my spare time as I am still a student in college. Maybe it isn't time for me to go into business with indoor weddings yet and I should just stick with outdoor photographs until I can find someone to practice under for awhile.<br>

I have an old Vivitar flash that I sometimes add on to my Olympus, but it takes so long to recharge that it hardly works for capturing those fast moments. However, I’ve been considering just sticking with natural light photography. I really love the lens flare style and natural light that has become popular recently.<br>

Renting gear sounds like a great idea but the closest place to me rents for about $100 a day, which is a bit high for me at this point.<br>

Essentially, I'm still new, I'm still learning and any advice you could give me would help. I started getting into this because my husband is an officiant and we had a lot of friends asking us to officiate and photograph their small wedding ceremonies. I wanted to make it more affordable for them, so we agreed to help.</p>

<p>I definitely agree with John Deerfield that a photographer needs to have a business sense hand in hand with their artistic skill. That's what I'm working on; it's just hard to know where to start.</p>

 

<p>Thanks for more details. Some comments:</p>

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<p><em>“I've resolved to just stick with outdoor ceremonies for now and as someone suggested<strong>, buying a 50mm macro lens f/2.0 </strong>for my Olympus that would help with portraits and engagement shots.”</em></p>

</blockquote>

<p>I do not suggest this. Your money can be spent more efficiently elsewhere, especially if you are determined to change camera systems. With no disrespect meant ask what Wedding / Portraiture & or Business experience was behind this suggestion.<br />Rationale: The 50mmF/2 is not going to give you great advantage for portraiture. The kit lens used at 25mm to 45mm (that would be at about F/4 to F/5.6) can be used efficiently to give adequate shallow DoF and Subject separation – if that is what you are referencing.<br />One key to Shallow DoF and nice background blur, is to select the location, lighting on the BACKGROUND and to allow adequate space between the Subjects and the Background.<br />As a low light lens (fast) lens for AL (Available Light) work in a Church for example a 50mm on your camera will be limiting – especially judging only from the AL work in the Wedding you cited – the three images I referenced were shot wider than FL = 50mm and at reasonably close quarters.<br />I am not totally familiar with the Olympus range of lenses or if there are third party lenses available – but a fast 20mm to 25mm lens would be a more flexible lens for inside a Church if (as it seems you did / do) have availability to choose the Camera Vantage Point and the ability to move. Remembering that 4/3 cameras have a FoV factor of x2 – so the 50mm macro give ether view of a 100mm lens on a 135 format camera – which is quite a telephoto lens for inside a medium to small venue.</p>

<p> </p>

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<p><em>“I do have a tripod and I used it at the wedding but I still had to pump my IS0 up high because the church was so dimly lit and would not allow flash during the ceremony (which I know is a very typical situation, I just don't know <strong>what other option there is other than having a faster lens</strong>) So of course some of the photos <strong>came out pretty grainy</strong>. How do you capture the action minus the graininess without a faster lens?”</em></p>

</blockquote>

<p>Well, if you can select a good vantage point your Kit lens will be at about F/4 around FL = 20mm and your camera can push ISO1600, so in a “dimly lit” Church that means you could be at 1/30s or even 1/15s. The TIMING of the shutter release is the key: such that there is minimal movement of the subjects. A remote release and Mirror Up function is also useful. <br />The absolute essential element is NOT TO UNDERexpose.<br /><br /></p>

<blockquote>

<p><em>“No, I have never shot as a second although I have actively called and tried to procure a position. Any advice on what other steps I could take to find someone to shoot under?”<br /><br /></em></p>

</blockquote>

<p>Keep trying.</p>

<blockquote>

<p><em>“I’m just going to stick with it until I have some more practice with this camera. I'm self-taught and only know what I've researched online and practiced in my spare time as I am still a student in college. Maybe it isn't time for me to go into business with indoor weddings yet and I should just stick with outdoor photographs until I can find someone to practice under for awhile.<br />I have an <strong>old Vivitar flash</strong> that I sometimes add on to my Olympus, but it takes<strong> so long to recharge</strong> that it hardly works for capturing those fast moments. However, I’ve been <strong>considering just sticking with natural light photography</strong>. I really love the <strong>lens flare style and natural light that has become popular recently</strong>.”</em></p>

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<p>Does the Vivitar take too long to recycle because of the age of the Flash or because you are not using HiMH batteries?<br />If the Vivitar is U/S then money would be better spent on a new Flash unit which could be used with the Olympus and also a new Canon Camera should you buy one in the future.<br />It is nice that you like the Flare Style & Natural Light Photography. I suggest you learn how to use a Flash both Indoors and Outdoors: All the Credentialed and Experienced Photographers whom I know, who shoot exclusively AL or almost exclusively AL: know how to use Flash it is no burden – it is often life-saving (in a business sense).<br /><br /><br /></p>

<blockquote>

<p><em>“Essentially, I'm still new, I'm still learning and any advice you could give me would help. I started getting into this because my<strong> husband is an Officiator </strong>and we had a lot of friends asking us <strong>to officiate and photograph their small wedding ceremonies</strong>. I wanted to make it more affordable for them, so we agreed to help.”</em></p>

</blockquote>

<p>For all the Weddings you do with your Husband as the Officiator, I suggest you negotiate that Flash can be used during the Ceremony. I further suggest that you learn how to use Fill Flash Outdoors.<br />For Church Weddings, I suggest that you introduce yourself to the Priest / Pastor prior to the event and attempt to negotiate two or three Flash shots - which are key to the B&G. Perhaps there are leverages you can employ as your Husband is also a Marriage Celebrant?</p>

<blockquote>

<p><em>“I definitely agree with John Deerfield that a photographer needs to have a <strong>business sense</strong> hand in hand with their artistic skill. That's what I'm working on; it's just hard to know where to start.”</em></p>

</blockquote>

<p>All of what I have suggested is predicated upon: “business sense”.</p>

<p>WW</p>

<p>Andi --<br>

First of all, thank you for the link to your blog. I'll say first that I think you have a decent eye and know the types of photos that people expect to see from their wedding.</p>

<p>I think perhaps you could use a few classes on the technical side of photography or at least you should take the time to read a few books and get some more practice in.</p>

<p>Perhaps you could look at the following:<br>

<a href="http://www.amazon.com/Understanding-Exposure-Photographs-Digital-Updated/dp/0817463003">Understanding Exposure by Bryan Peterson</a><br>

<a href="../learn/wedding/">photo.net Wedding Photography Primer</a></p>

<p>Next, I'm going to second everything William has mentioned.</p>

<p>I also am not particularly familiar with the Olympus lens system, but I know SIGMA makes a few lenses for your camera. Perhaps you should look at the following:</p>

<p><a href="http://www.adorama.com/Als/SG2418OM.html">Sigma 24mm f/1.8</a><br>

<a href="http://www.adorama.com/Als/SG3014OM.html">Sigma 30mm f/1.4</a><br>

<a href="http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/463442-REG/Sigma_581107_18_50mm_f_2_8_EX_DC.html">Sigma 18-50mm f/2.8</a> </p>

<p>These lenses seem to have decent reviews and will help you out for low light. I also suggest a flash unit and learning how to use it.</p>

 

<blockquote>

<p> I’ve been considering just sticking with natural light photography. I really love the lens flare style and natural light that has become popular recently.</p>

</blockquote>

<p>I believe that this style of photography has become popular because new photographers don't know how to, (and likely don't want to take the time to learn how to), properly use a flash. I learned the hard way that you need to be the person in control of the light at a wedding. If you're relying on ambient/available light, you need to learn to look at light sources, light direction, and the subjects in relation to the light. Once you learn how to use flash, it almost liberates you to not worry so much about the light since you're in control of it.</p>

<p>I'm not sure what's available for dedicated flash units for your camera, but you may want to try a Sunpack or maybe another Vivitar.</p>

<p>Hope this helps<br>

RS</p>

<p>Why not stick with Olympus? You could get a second camera, perhaps the E-3 and that way you have a backup system where the lenses will all work and the flash (FL-50) will also work. To buy into another system will effectively relegate your current stuff to a shelf gathering dust.</p>

<p>It is not the camera that makes the image but the person behind the camera. I can take just as bad a picture with a $24K camera as I can with a $0.2K camera. In my opinion there is not a lot of difference between cameras among major vendors until you get to specialized situations such as sports and extreme low light. Weddings do not fall into any of these catagories. I have no need for 8 frames per second at a wedding. I have no need for ISO 64K at a wedding.</p>

<p>What you need in my opinion is backup to your current equipment. Staying within the same family will allow you do that with minimum cost. To change brands will entail significant expense when you have to duplicate much of the equipment.</p>

<p>IMO, there are some limitations with using ONLY the Olympus and 4/3 system, for Professional Wedding work.<br>

Firstly there are limitations as a business tool - (variance from area to area) - Nikon and Canon (as examples) will have more availability for: service, replacement, borrowing (from Colleagues or Guests - in an emergency) and renting.<br>

Secondly there is the lens choice limitation.<br>

Third there is the format size and (combined with the lens limitation) that limits artistic diversity.<br>

Considering that the OP designated <em>"I’ve been considering just sticking with natural light photography. I really love the lens flare style and natural light that has become popular recently."</em><br>

Then this last issue is a real and viable to point, for her to acknowledge.<br>

The later discussion, in this recent thread expands on one area of artistic limitations of the 4/3 System, pertinent to AL shooting: <a href="00X5IB">http://www.photo.net/wedding-photography-forum/00X5IB</a></p>

<p>WW</p>

<p> </p>

<p> </p>

<p>Get the most expensive body you can afford. It will make your photographs better because you will realize that even with the nicest camera you can take bad photographs. If you can't afford much thats fine too, just learn the limitations of your gear and adjust your style to optimize the strengths of your system.</p>