K7, the "me too" camera...

<p>I'm of mixed mind about this one. The only two real complaints I have with my k20d is I want the larger clearer view finder that full frame cameras like the d700 have; I wear eye glasses and have trouble seeing the camera settings through the view finder on my APSC Pentax bodies where on the Canon / Nikon full fames bodies everything is very clear to me through the view finder. The D700 is easy to adjust to me while looking though the view finder where I almost always have to take the k20d from my eye and adjust using the top lcd panel. I'm going to have to hold one of these to see how improved the view finder is. That is going to be my make or break deal on this camera and the feature that if it's not up to snuff will eventually have me adding a second system.<br /> <br /> My other real limitation with the k20d is the xsync with studio lights and outside flash off camera, HSS off the hotshoe does not cut it for creative lighting. But this "MAY" not be an issue. Several of the older C/N cameras had electronic shutters and by using a radio trigger you could effectively get much higher sync speeds than their published ttl syncs; like in the order of 1/800 or so. So if the k-7 has an electronic shutter, just maybe it can be "tricked" into higher sync speeds with off camera manual flash.<br /> <br /> The in camera HDR processing sounds interesting to me. I've played with HRD, but the post processing and additional software is a bit a pain. If it can be done in camera that's a feature I'd occasionally use, but it's strictly a nice to have. And live view would be much more useful with an articulating LCD, but that is also just a nice to have. <br /> <br /> My last consideration is how different are the controls from the k10/ k20 if switching between cameras at an event. When shooting a wedding it's nice to have a wide plus tele or fast prime on two bodies to save seconds in lens changes for critical moments. Ideally you have two identical bodies. I gave up using my k100d in combination with my k20 because I had to think about the control differences. But the new k-7 looks more similar to the k10 / k20 so it might not be so much of an issue.<br /> <br /> Deal is I want to hold one and play with it. The problems is even though I live in one of the largest metropolitan areas in the states (Dallas / Ft. Worth), we no longer have a pro shop that carries Pentax. While I have no trouble getting my hands on Sony, Oly and C/N my Pentax gear has to be ordered and I really want to touch this first before dropping the bucks. Hopefully we'll have some quick reviews that can answer my questions. True to Pentax's heritage it looks like a solid evolutionary camera to me.</p>

<p>Yeah, IMO, the K7 is not a camera you would use with the K10/20 as a dual camera setup for travel. Likewise it's a different layout so probably not a good camera to use in conjuction with the K20D for events.</p>

<p>For instance for travel you now need duplicates of the batteries, and dual chargers. This could become annoying and defeat the advantage of the smaller K7. I'd probably pack a K100 or ist series as a backup, or toss in a small film SLR if you use FA lenses anyway.</p>

<p>Or just use Lithium AA in the K7 and forget the charger. I was hoping Pentax would keep using the same battery but the AA support should make everyone somewhat happy, even AA haters. As you will eventually forget spare batteries or accidentally pack uncharged ones (all Mike Ks negativity came to fruition for me on a trip a few weeks ago, took 3 batteries all were almost dead, but managed to still squeeze off almost 150 bad shots. No offense Mike K, it's just that you've been exclaiming the fact that this could happen, and I've been telling you it could but probably wouldn't...however, I doubt it will ever happen again. I hadn't charged my batteries since before death valley and got a few of the 6 NP400s I have mixed up, since I had the 645N I wasn't too worried either).</p>

<p>BTW, for a backcountry camera I'm really happy with the AA support, AAs are superior in extreme cold and once again all my equipment (headlamp, GPS, 2 way radios, flash) runs on AA lithiums. This saves weight since I'm not carrying spares of multiple batteries on long trips (and lithiums weight significantly less anyway). For day to day shooting and weekend trips, I'll stick with rechargable lithium ion though.</p>

<p>Roger, I find it ineterstig that the view finder is like super important to many, including myself and so I really hope Pentax did something about this...</p>

<p>An APS-C viewfinder will always be smaller than an FF, by a huge margin.</p>

<p>I have tried the O-ME53 on a K100D, and it does what it's advertised to do. Why not use the same thing on a K10D or K20D? (haven't gotten one, myself, yet..)</p>

<p>More pictures from a hands on K-7 tester:</p>

<p><a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/peter_fang/sets/72157618438434400/">http://www.flickr.com/photos/peter_fang/sets/72157618438434400/</a></p>

<p>ANYBODY got a credible price on this K-7 for USA market ???</p>

<p> I'm reading some crazy stuff, upwards of $2,000 for K-7. True the long rumoured Nikon D400 is suppose to launch at "$1999" but I also think thats an insane launch price for aps-c. Well unless nikon and canon are going to scuttle the $2369 and $2699 full frames. Maybe the days of $2000 full frame dslr are slipping away?</p>

<p>Lindy </p>

<p>2K? WOW, I paid $2200.00 (after rebate)for my D700 and I can see through it. ;-)</p>

<p>Orlando, for under $40 I should give the maginifier a try. I've thought about it before but after buying an Olympus Varimagni right angle view finder for macro stuff and finding it a real tunnel vision pain to use; I discounted using any view finder add-ons. It's not so much magnifing the image as is it getting a similar view with eye glasses as without them while looking through the view finder. If you take the camera with out eye glases and move it an inch or so from your eye you then have to tilt it up and down to see either the full capture frame or the shooting info at the bottom. Where the full frame larger view finders allow eyeglass wearers to see the whole thing at once. It's just much easier to work and compose with, so view finder improvement is a significant thing for me. It's not the 100% coverage it's the larger window. But you just talked me into it I'll give the O-ME53 a try. If it works you may have just saved me $1300 give or take on a new k-7 :) </p>

<p>Lindy,</p>

<p>Now that the K7 is here (almost) how much longer do you think your K20D is going to hold it's value?</p>

<p>Oh, and it looks like you will be happy to see the orange gasket on the kit lens. I know that was also an issue for you on the sealing. Although the sudden need for a gasket is now an issue for me (gaskets fail over time), but I'm wondering if the gaskets aren't intended to bring the sealing up another level rather than were actually needed in the first place (since the K7 claims improved sealing).</p>

<p>Not particularly exciting. Feature wise it pretty much just catches the prosumer Canon 50D that has been out for nearly a year.</p>

<p>I think the VF will be a good one, but a bit much to expect APS VFs to be the same as FF VFs. I recall years back that some pros made a big deal over the few camera models that had VFs with 100% coverage. Interestingly, some of those high-end cameras did have somewhat reduced magnification.</p>

<p>It is interesting to see the widely differing concerns as to what is important for various people.</p>

<p>Yeah, that is my idea too. Smaller bodies for easier travel kits for getting around. Can take along say the K7, K100, and a compact film body- MZ-S, or ZX-L, which can also use AAs with the little grip. I have been using AA lithiums a lot lately and not being bothered with a charger, except for the K20D. The little CR-2s take up no room. But when going to a venue where lengthy getting about is not an issue, and with bigger lenses, out comes the K20D and the PZ-1p. The controls do vary some between these models, but it has not been a bother to me. Someone said they were hoping for a super advanced form of the old *ist-D... the K7 seems to be it! I love the idea of upgrading new kit lenses to WR!</p>

<p>I think the "catch-up" improvements, plus these being added on top of the Pentax special features, then adding new special features, and pouring the whole thing into a superbly-built compact form is what makes this camera different. The sum total of what it is, taken together. Will be potentially great combined with Limited lenses!</p>

<p>what exactly is small about it? This thing weighs much the same as Canon 50D or 5D, neither of which is particularly sveldt.</p>

<p>No DSLR of any good build, of my acquaintance is truly a lightweight in my book. Not like carrying the MZ-S, let alone the ZX-L! But I have found, being a recently new owner of the K20D, that just a few ounces makes a noticeable difference. This new K7 camera weighs about the same as my K200D, which is only about one ounce more than my K100D Super. But the K20D at 4 ounces more is very notably weightier in a holster on my hip. Then there is the physical size. As to putting the K20D into a large coat pocket or a belt pouch with a small lens on it- forget that!! And yet it is smaller than the Nikon D300. But this CAN be done with my K200D and K100D models, and will also be possible with the K7.</p>

<p>Actually Geoff, it pretty much matches the E3, which if you remember anything I've written for a year is pretty much a model camera for me. And no offense but I'd rather have an E3 than a 50D. If Pentax is going to produce a me too camera as some people (including myself) have said, why not a BETTER E3? Better in terms of image quality of course. The rest of the E3 seems about as sorted out as possible.</p>

<p>Thus, other than the VERY VERY VERY disappointing flash sync this is pretty much the camera I've been asking for. <br /> <br /> Javier said it best, we are a bunch of babies. I didn't get my sync speed so I started crying like a spoiled 3 year old. The worst part was the rest of the camera is my wish list.</p>

<p>I'm curious though, what were you hoping for? I mean you know why I was (am ever so slightly) disappointed, but why are you so disappointed? What did you expect?</p>

<p>As far as the weight, well, the stainless chassis is heavy, and while magnesium might weigh less than plastic (i don't know), the chasis isn't the lightest material. Stainless is durable, but fairly heavy compared to some other metals. The upside is it's fairly inexpensive and that is also important. I suppose in a perfect world it would be a titanium or magnesium or maybe ceramic chassis but then in a perfect world I don't have to go to work to pay bills, too bad the world isn't perfect.</p>

<p>I'm with Michael on this size issue, the K10D was a nice size IMO, but if the controls were properly laid out could have been a bit smaller like the ist D was. There is a major difference between the K10/20 and the ist D, so if the K7 is sized closer to the ist D it will be very portable when it's feature set is factored in.</p>

<p> </p>

<p>E3 has been bouncing around, now its $1250, heres specs link:</p>

<p><a href="http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/526362-REG/Olympus_262010_E_3_SLR_Digital_Camera.html">http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/526362-REG/Olympus_262010_E_3_SLR_Digital_Camera.html</a></p>

<p>And 50D has gone up since the holidays to $1200, specs link:</p>

<p><a href="http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/580462-REG/Canon_2807B006_EOS_50D_SLR_Digital.html">http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/580462-REG/Canon_2807B006_EOS_50D_SLR_Digital.html</a></p>

<p>& Heres the reason why K-7 could launch higher than anticipated. Recently Nikon punched up their D300 to $1700. Kinda funny story , a friend bought his over a year ago new for $1350. Count the days or weeks before D400 replacement launches for $2000.</p>

<p><a href="http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/518489-REG/Nikon_25432_D300_SLR_Digital_Camera.html">http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/518489-REG/Nikon_25432_D300_SLR_Digital_Camera.html</a></p>

<p>Nice to see the weather seal gasket. So lets guess 50-200 WR lens launches at $350 plus or less than $350? I'll guess $350, so it and K-7 could start for more coin than Javiers D700 full frame, which has already proven to be weathersealed on the antartic trip that killed off so many 5DII. But we'll all know in a day and 8 hours if official specs include usa pricing.</p>

<p>Will K20D drop in value, why not every dslr become about worthless in 3 years or so. K20D announced on 1-23-2008. Dude its almost 16 months old !</p>

<p>K20D is about half way to being just another $250 dslr on used market.</p>

<p>;^(</p>

<p>Haha Lindy, I was just proving my point when you were criticizing the K10D price drop (actually less than the K20D loss of value from release BTW). My point of course was the K20D was only holding it's own because there was no successor. Perhaps this time Pentax will keep the K20D in the lineup rather than cancel it. I always thought the K10D should have remained, especially considering the K20D really wasn't that much better. but had enough features that the two really wouldn't compete with each other.</p>

<p>I'd have had K100D/Km, K200D, K10D, K20D. With $450, $650, $750, $1000 price points. I'd have upgraded the K10D firmware as well and renamed it the K10DS. But hey, I only manage camera companies from my recliner, I'm sure there is a reason all this logic wouldn't have worked in the real world.</p>

<p>I will disagree with one thing though, I am VERY VERY doubtful the K7 will be anywhere near the price of a D700 body. And if you want to add lenses into the cost I am doubtful the K7 and a weather sealed kit lens will cost anywhere near the D700 and a sealed lens. I'm guessing if the E3 sells for $1250, the K7 will debut above that but settle around $1000.</p>

<p>If the K20D never dropped much below $750 I don't see a metal body (more costly to produce) selling for less than $1000. But at $1000-1250 this camera sounds like a good deal. Pentax stuff is always released way above where it settles. I mean the 35mm DA was released at $599 IIRC and it now can be picked up for $290-350 pretty often. It's only 1 year old! Same with the 50-135mm debuted at $1000, settled below $700.</p>

<p>Of course I've been wrong before, but that is what makes life interesting.</p>

<p>Justin<br>

I am not dissappointed at all in the feature set. Its an incremental improvement of the K20D which is good. I was a bit surpised at some posts that described this as a ground breaking camera. Its feature set is comparable to the prosumer Canikon models.<br>

If it keeps the price point of the K20D at about $700 in six months it should be a big seller.<br>

I am not sure why this is a K7D instead of a K30D. Presumably the single digit number is supposed to mean its another level up from the K20D, but the main difference just seems to be the metal body and uprated shutter speed.</p>

 

<p>The feature set is comparable to the 40D / 50D... but with in-body stabilization and weather-proofing in a smaller form-factor (40D / 50D is almost the same size as K20D).</p>

<p>If the price is identical to the 50D people should be all over it... but Pentax doesn't have Anna Kournikova or whoever it is to flog this camera..</p>

<p>Geoff, the K-7 was not called "K30D" because it's a new concept for a camera. The specs are an improvement over the K30D, but the body is very different. Pentax have not been very clear about whether they intend to put out a K30D with a larger body (than the K-7) in the Autumn or if the K-7 will become their flagship from now on. It's Pentax, so who knows!? :-)</p>

 

<p>Reading this discussion, I'm rather relieved. It seems like most of the upgrades are of more interest to advanced shooters and marginal in terms of my hunt & peck shooting style so I can take a leisurely approach to upgrading--<em>how</em> leisurely really depends on how much the viewfinder is improved. </p>

<p> I have to say, btw, that the video option does interest me--for sports coaching purposes.</p>

<p>I'm with Geoff on this, though:</p>

<blockquote>

<p>I am not sure why this is a K7D instead of a K30D.</p>

</blockquote>

<p> </p>

<p>2 more days. It does look quite nice spec wise but this is one body I want to handle B4 buying and I want to see it side by side with a K20. The sensor and VF are of interest to me.<br>

The dollar is very weak and that means the price will be high. :-)</p>

 

<p>Les L, by comparison to Euro and many other currencies the dollar is STRONG, amazingly so considering the ultra-low US interest rates. When interest rates eventually rise in the US (when real estate prices convincingly begin to rise...maybe 2010) the dollar will strengthen even more, making many imports even cheaper...it'll be a good time not to be a US auto manufacturer.</p>

<p>To another point: K20D is a LOT better than K10D... FAR higher detail resolution, lower noise, higher useful ISO, pc plug, and various subtleties. Looking only at tiny prints (eg letter size) and posts online, K20D's superiority isn't as obvious...<br>

My only beef with K20D (I need another) is weight (same as Canon F1!) and B&W moire. B&W moire reduces detail resolution to less than film's potential if one post-processes to reduce it.</p>

<p>From the Flicker link posted by Lindy:<br>

</p>

Aperture control in movie mode

 

<br />

 

Contrast detection and face detection AF in live view and movie mode

<br />

EV compensation during movie mode

 

 

<p>Weight comparison:</p>

<p>K2000 - 20.8 oz w/lithium batteries<br>

K100DS - 22.8 oz w/battery <br>

K200D - 24.3 oz w/lithium batteries<br>

K7 - 26.5 oz w/battery (according to rumours)<br>

K20D - 28.2 oz w/battery</p>

<p>I'm surpised there is disappointment on these specs - talk amongst Sony photog's is that it looks great.</p>

<p>Thanks for the inside intelligence, Rich. Now please go back to the Sony forums and spread some misinformation. Tell them the Pentax forum is not filled with a bunch of whiney babies and that we're all really ecstatic with the new camera and cannot wait to put in our orders. Tell them we're banging at the doors of Pentax Colorado so we don't have to wait 24 hours to buy the new camera.</p>

<p>Or you can tell them the truth: The we're a big bunch of morons and that a few weeks from now we'll all be defending what a ground-breaking camera the K-7 really is :-)</p>