Yet Another Lens Question

Although I really like my prime lenses I'm seeing where the Canon 70-200 zoom

would make a great sports lens. The biggest question is f/4 or f/2.8. I know

f/4 would be fast enough for afternoon football, softball, etc. Has anyone

tried shooting indoor sports such volleyball, basketball or wrestling with an

f/4 without using flash? Would ISO 1600** and f/4 be fast enough or should I

just save my pennies until I have enough to buy the f/2.8 lens? Or should I

just stick with my current prime setup (50 & 200 mm lenses) and add either the

85 f/1.8 or 100 f/2? If those two lenses I would be more inclined to go with

the 100 f/2 as the 15mm extra reach is worth losing 1/3 stop, IMO.

 

**I know there's a noise penalty when using a high ISO but some of that noise

can be removed during post processing.

Zach -

 

Even though I shoot Nikon the difference between f2.8 and F4 - F5.6 is amazing... I shoot swimming indoors where flash is frowned upon by both the athletes and coaches.

 

The 2.8 allows me to shoot at a reasonable ISO for Nikon which is around 800 or lower and still capture the action. Shooting a Canon, you can probably go to 1600 without noise issues.

 

For basketball the 85mm lens will be cool... for wrestling, since you can't get close to the action, the longer lens may be required.

 

Now I exclusively use the 70-200 2.8 vr (IS) for indoor sports. It's great because I don't have to change lenses, have the 2.8 speed, and can get close enough to get tight shots.

 

Dave

ditto to Dave... save those pennies, you'll definitely want a 2.8 if you want to shoot indoors!

As soon as you see the phrases "indoor" and "no flash" and "sports" in the same sentence, you pretty much have to consider f/2.8 to be a necessity. Big jump in price, and a big jump in light-gathering ability. Makes all the difference in the world when it comes to making use of a tolerable sports-friendly shutter speeed. The down side of the primes is that you'll find yourself juggling lenses (or bodies) right when something you most care about is happening. Resist a few dinners out, every other Vente Latte, a few movies... before you know it, you'll have that extra stop of light, and some much cleaner results. For what it's worth, you'd also be in a better position (when you ARE shooting outside), to make another modest investment and pop a good TC on that 70-200/2.8, getting yourself some extra range out of the deal later while still having the zoom flexibility.

David, Chris & Matt: Thanks for your advice. I was pretty sure the answer would be to go with the 2.8 lens so that's what I'm gonna do. I have about half of the money set aside now which is why I was considering the f/4. I may use the Bill Me Later option on B&H which would allow me to pay it off in 6 months no interest. At some point I will add a a 1.4x teleconverter.

 

David: Regarding swim meets are those hosted inside or outside? If inside are you worried about high humidity?

Obviously it depends on how well lit your venues are. Some pro arenas are bright enough to get you 1/500th at f/4, 400 ISO - about the same as the interior of a sunlit white canvas marquee. A high school venue might easily require 1600 ISO f/2 for 1/320th. You may still need fast primes for that.

If you plan on wrestling without flash, consider finding a 85mm f1.4 lens or something in that area. Trying a f2.8 lens might work but the ceiling lights would have to be very good...

Sorry to buck the trend, but if your primes are the 200/2.8 L and either the 50/1.4 or 50/1.8 then I'd go with another prime lens for indoor sports. While the 85/1.2 L would be ideal and within your longer term budget I would opt for the 100/2 as you mentioned.

 

 

You already have a 200/2.8 lens that is superior to the big expensive zoom for venues where you need the length, and you have a very fast 50 for tight indoor venues which leaves the 100/2 for school gymnasiums and places of that nature. It will be a precious stop faster than the f2.8 zoom and likely provide higher contrast and sharper images. For gyms I use an 85/1.4 and 200/2 on a 1.6x body at ISO 100 to ISO 400 depending on lighting.

 

 

As for indoor swim meets I do use flash with no problems, you just can't flash at the start of the race where the timers use a strobe. I use a 200/2 and 400/2.8 from the viewing galleries at ISO 100. The flash provides lighting for superior colours. The humidity is not a problem you just have to open all your equipment a half hour to an hour before shooting (depending on equipment temperature). Any condensation that you get will dissipate in that time. When I get home I unpack everything and let it air out for several hours again to dissipate any humidity and chlorine. I go from -10 C (in my trunk) to +24 C (in the pool) on a regular basis in the winter.

 

 

The 100/2 would leave you budget space down the road for the 300/4 L for outdoor field sports. I am assuming you have a 1.6x body.

Mark U: I'm dealing with high school gyms and stadiums so the lighting is pretty sucky. Our stadium is shared by three high school teams so you would think that between the three we could get some decent lights. One end zone is especially dark :(.

 

Gerald: My wrestling days are over and when I did wrestle I never used a flash :). (Sorry smart a$$ in me showing through). I do not plan to use flash at any of the indoor events.

 

John: My primes are the 200 2.8L and 50 1.8 II. I compared the 50mm 1.8 and 1.4 this morning and think I would be better off with the 1.4 since it has USM and the 1.8 does not. Also, thanks for the advice regarding equipment usage at a swim meet. I was concerned about fogging but I'll just plan to get to the event in plenty of time to allow the equipment to acclimate and I am using a 1.6x body (Rebel XT).

 

What I think I'm going to do is upgrade my 50mm from 1.8 to the 1.4 version and sell the 1.8 on EBay and buy the 100 f/2 and continue saving those pennies until I can get that 300 f/4 John mentioned or 40D depending on my mood at the time :).

 

Thanks again everyone, I truly do appreciate your feedback.

I agree with John. Another fast prime lens might be best for indoor sports. Although the 70-200 f2.8 is a great versatile lens, many times f2.8 isn't fast enough for the lighting in high school gyms. I shoot middle and high school basketball. My lens choice is Nikon's 85mm f1.8. Canon has this lens as well for about $350 new. There's 1.4 and 1.2 versions as well. But they're very expensive.

Zack -

 

The swim meets are both indoors and outdoors. On the outdoor ones I'm more worried about bugs = bees/wasps/hornets, etc..;-)

 

I don't worry too much about the humidity indoors. I shoot with D200's (which are sealed metal bodies) so that helps... plus I'm there for 5 - 6 hours shooting (with breaks) so it's not like the camera is stored in the pool permanently. I think I know what you mean though, I was looking at the corrosion on the lifeguard chair last night at the pool. I don't think a camera would survive long if stored in there with all of the humidity and chemicals in the air.

 

Actually my biggest fears while shooting swimming deckside are either dumping the camera or myself in the water when getting bumped by a swimmer who's late for their heat or getting the camera splashed on by the swimmer in the lane nearest me.

 

Due to the temperatures in the pool areas, I wear shoots even in the heart of the Minnesota winters. I also carry a dry towel to wipe the camera off in the case of splashes. If it goes in the pool, it becomes a business expense ;-)

 

Dave

Well lit NBA/D1 indoor arenas (lit with TV broadcast in mind) allow for 1/500 sec, f2.8, at ISO-800, no flash, and I'd use a f2.8 zoom with no problem. But if you routinely shoot indoor preps available light only, forget about f4 and go with single focal length f1.4s or somewhere there about and even that you'll most likely still need to be at ISO-1600 if without strobe.