Your Worse Ebay Nightmare?

I thought it might be useful to start a thread about your worse experience on

Ebay. Just a post like the one I have here, without arguments or

recriminations; so that we can learn from one another's mistakes and help

others to avoid being victimized.

 

I got taken for $1950 USD when I thought I was getting a deal on a D2x. Ebay

allowed the same person to sell the camera twice:

 

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=300123088315

 

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=300119130808

 

The victim of the first sale only managed to reach me and make me aware that

they too had been victimized by contacting someone else who had sold me

something, otherwise Ebay would have prevented us from sharing notes on the

scammer. Ebay seems more concerned about making it easy to sell things than in

actually protecting buyers by instituting prudent precautionary measures. In

fact, Ebay informed me that a seller could change their contact info for every

sale and I would have no way to know it. Ebay also removed information on some

questionable transactions conducted by the scammer but kept the positive

feedback intact.

 

Essentially, Ebay prevented me from protecting myself by citing privacy

considerations and then did nothing to protect me from serial scammers. Adding

insult to injury, the police in the county where I sent the money do not

consider my loss significant enough to act on and require more evidence than

the contact info and delivery confirmation to proceed with an investigation

into the person who accepted my Postal Money Orders. It will take two weeks to

get the copy of the cashed Money Orders, and I am already aware of one person

who was scammed by the same people (see the second link above); and even that

may not be enough to get the police to do anything about the scammer (assuming

they haven't taken flight by then).

 

I thought to myself that the paper trail leading right to the door of the

person who stole my money was stupid; but now realize that it wasn't as stupid

as those charged with the responsibility of enforcing the law and protecting

sellers. For me the lesson is obvious, don't buy anything worth any more than

you can afford to lose, from anyone other than an established seller like

Cameta Camera or Henry's from Ebay.

About three years ago I won an auction for an older Canon zoom lens.

I paid a couple hundred for the lens plus postage plus insurance.

When I received the package, it was basically a shoe box with a boat load of packing tape keeping it together. Inside, the lens was wrapped in a few pages of newspaper and as you might guess, the lens was broken.

The inner elements had been smashed and you could here pieces when you shook the lens.

I went to the post office, and they basically said it wasn't worth pursuing. They told me that eBay is buyer beware and that once the package is sent and delivered, insurance is hard to recover.

So I tried, and sure enough, after a couple weeks, the post office determined that the lens wasn't packaged properly and that insurance doesn't cover that.

I argued that the post office accepted this package when the guy sent it, and even insured it!

They responded that they get thousands of packages a day, and often times things slip through the cracks.

So I took a loss.

http://cgi.ebay.com/Nikon-D2X-12-4-Megapixel_W0QQitemZ140137043220QQihZ004QQcategoryZ43456QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

 

http://cgi.ebay.com/Nikon-D2X-12-4-Megapixel_W0QQitemZ140136198069QQihZ004QQcategoryZ43456QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

 

http://cgi.ebay.com/Nikon-D2X-12-4-Megapixel_W0QQitemZ140136096383QQihZ004QQcategoryZ43456QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

 

Again, it is positively disgusting to me that I can do a search and view the page and see three identical photos right there on the page with one seller with no history selling this camera, and now they are suddenly selling three of them and throwing in a difficult to find lens (with each sale) to boot. Ironically, some poor schmuck thinks they are protected by Paypal, but unless they use a credit card with it, then they are not. Even if they avoid personally being victimized, this BS ends up costing all of us (have you looked at the interest rates on your credit cards?).

When you buy from an individual amateur or pro photographer on Ebay you have to be VERY careful. Check the ratings, send several emails just to see if you get a quick response, scrutinize the pictures very thoroughly. Then don't spend more than you can afford to lose, because that is what sometimes happens. There are established stores selling on Ebay (including mine) who are professional dealers. Such places guard their reputations and ratings carefully and are usually safe to order from.

I bought a few things via eBay, and consider myself lucky. I've forced myself to buy from

dealers now.

 

I got really tired of receiving ten "2nd chance offers" on the same auction I didn't "win".

I buy very little on Ebay anymore. There are limited savings on their listings compared new cameras from reliable dealers. If you want to venture into used digital cameras to save a few bucks, check out KEH. They usually check the stuff before accepting it.

Ebay is just a waste of time lately....and as you found out also a waste of money.

The really scary transactions are on high-end items: cars and so forth. When I was a motor journalist, I wrote an article about people who lost thousands on bad car deals. Sometimes the scammer would trick the victim into using an escrow service..." I always use this one, check their site." The site indeed loks legit, but of course, it's easy to put up a fake site. Next thing the poor sap knows, he's lost at least a deposit. Some people actually lost the whole purchase price, though it's hard to see how one can be that gullible. A bad deal on a lens isn't so bad compared to some of these stories.

 

Scot

Anthony this one seems to come out of left field. The guy had 81 or so positive ratings before he went the way of the "darkside". Possibly this seller's account was hijacked. I've heard of this happening via email phishing from scammers who request Ebayer's account info. When that info is gained call it game over.

 

Ebay is good for what it is. For hard to find lenses (e.g. Zuiko 35-80mm f/2.8), Ebay is your best bet. I've been lucky thus far which includes purchases of expensive lenses like Pentax 200mm f/4 macro, Canon 200mm f/1.8, and Canon 500mm f/4.5 (twice!). Eventually I sold all of these on Ebay. Would I risk buying thousands of dollars of equipment again on Ebay? Maybe, but I have a couple sellers that I know are legit from previous purchases. For everything else that is not so rare I go to KEH.

 

Bummer man, a $2K loss is rough.

Hi John, here's the deal with the feedback discrepancy. After someone hijacks the account they change the contact info -- even the name! Ebay doesn't reveal this to the buyer, which leaves you and me unable to effectively protect ourselves from the scam.

 

Ultimately we suffer because of Ebay's outright negligence when it comes to protecting buyers. Personally, I will never buy another expensive item from an individual on Ebay; if we all follow that sound advice then we end up paying more for the used gear we buy and getting less when we decide to sell it (since all transactions will end up being done with businesses that need to actually profit from the transactions).

Anthony, is there any way of finding out who this person is by name? If they live in Florida I'll be more than happy to make a few phone calls for you.

 

I use Ebay alot for truck parts. Expensive items are best paid thru an escrow service. For expensive lenses I do the same, or purchase from well established merchants via credit card. That gives you the most protection. I have a single account set up for only on-line transactions and put just enough money in to cover my purchases. Sending money orders, wire transfers, and checks leave you completely unprotected. That's like giving a complete stranger your money with the promise they'll be back shortly with your mechandise while you stand on the curb waiting. If your careful, Ebay is a very useful tool. I save, on average, 30% on new parts.

 

For camera gear I usually only buy those lenses that are discontinued and difficult to get any other way. Again, using an escrow service (preferred} or Paypal credit card for the best protection. I've found that the Japanese merchants are the best to buy from. Very honest and always slightly under-grade their gear. Matsuiyastore being one of the best.

Bought a lot on ebay, but never had a bad experience. Maybe some day my luck may change but for now I consider myself very fortunate.

Hi Jim, and thanks for the offer. There are actually two people involved (so far), one in Delaware and one here in California. I have both their putative names, and it appears there are real people inhabiting the addresses they reside in which I also have. With no real help from the police though, it is all to no avail.

 

It was undoubtedly a mistake on my part to even bid on the item. With no Paypal to use my credit card on, I was left naked at the curb (mixing metaphors to emphasis my embarrassment). After the sale I offered to cover the Paypal fees for the seller, but they feigned problems they were having with it and said they didn't trust it -- which actually didn't sound totally unreasonable to me at the time.

 

Another thing I find particularly irksome about the way Ebay operates is that if you get squeamish about a transaction and want to back out, Ebay says you have agreed to a contract and are in some way liable for not completing the transaction. I suppose all I had to lose was my 100% positive feedback, and perhaps my Ebay privileges; in retrospect that doesn't mean anything to me now. I actually doubt I will even bother selling on Ebay anymore since there are horror stories from that end of the transactions as well.

I quit eBay after my account was hijacked. As a matter of fact, while I was dealing with them, they noticed my account was being charged several times, so I was able to have those charges erased, and my account shut down. I haven't been back since, but I still get the spoofs. I consider myself lucky.

In several years of buying & selling on Ebay, I've only had three bad experiences : one seller who was running a scam, but who did return my money; one buyer who flagrantly ignored posted shipping costs to his country then refused to pay for the item he won; and lastly the post office losing a lens I sold (I reimbursed the buyer, and the post office reimbursed me). Guess I've been lucky because 99% of my purchases and sales have gone without a hitch. I strongly encourage anybody using any auction site or unknown dealer to do their due diligence...ask questions until satisfied with the answers, use Paypal in conjunction with a credit card, and recognize that any transaction, anywhere and with anyone involves an element of risk; just do your best to minimize that risk and you can be well rewarded.

The only Dean Kawa listed on whitepages.com is in Michigan, but even if it is his account (originally), I agree with the previous people who said the account has probably been hijacked by someone else anyway.

I have bought (too) many things on Ebay . Some where great, some where deceptions. But it was worth it overall.

 

I was never victim of a 'real' scam but maybe it is because i just avoid very pricey stuff (more than $500 US) and am as carefull as possible over $200.

Anthony, I just contacted a friend of mine and he told me that you may have better luck with the FBI's IC3 cyber-crime division. My daughter dated an agent about a year ago and I think they're still friends. I'll call her in the morning and try to get more information. Too bad they're not in Florida. I may not have been able to get your money back, but I could have made life very miserable for them. Helps to have friends in the right places. From what I understand, if someone steals more than $1000.00 over the internet in a one year period, conviction can result in a 5 to 10 year prison term. I don't know if it will help, but its worth a shot. Hell, maybe a full clip ;).

Thank you again Jim, you are very kind and generous to offer. I have filed a complaint with IC3 and didn't realize the actual penalties. I would add that there is mail fraud and conspiracy also involved, if a prosecutor were so inclined, they could put someone away for a long time if they were convicted of all the charges (although they usually use the extra charges as leverage to obtain plea bargains).

 

The San Jose Police have also become involved because the other victim sent his check to an address in their bailiwick. San Jose has a High Tech Fraud Unit that specializes in investigating these nefarious schemes.

 

There is an expression that "It helps to have friends in high places" which derives from having a "friend in court", dating back to royal courts and the influence that came from them; but sometimes it helps to have friends in low places too -- where's Tony Soprano when you need him? Anyway, I'll continue to be a schmuck and play by the rules, I just hope the system does better by all of us in the end than it has done by me so far.

ebay email policy sucks. Occasionally i use ebay for specific items from small shops over seas but generally I avoid ebay mostly because of ebay's policy and treatment of 'innocent' buyer.

I have bought on E-Bay quite a lot and only had a problem when I sold on E-Bay. My items

were hit by fraudsters who tried to get me to send the goods to a far off country when the E-

Bayer's address was a UK one. I was also told that the goods had been paid for on PayPal - a

phoney PayPal set up!

 

It's best to buy from an established dealer with a sound record E-Bay or other.

Actually my two worst experiences were with articles I was selling. First was a Rolleiflex (automat.) I bought at a flea market for $50. I was so thrilled to hold one in my hands that I didn't look at it closely enough. I put a roll of B&W film through it, had it processed at a drugstore, thought they looked OK, and advertised it on EBay. It went for $80. However the buyer took it to a Rollei expert who found several expensive lens issues so I sent the money back and told the buyer to use it for a door stop. The other was a Canonet QL17 GIII which I put a roll of color film through and advertised it on EBay. Just before the sale closing date (but after several bids were submitted) I discovered some oil on the shutter blades and noticed a bit of shutter lag so I had to withdraw it (very embarrasing) and relist it as a parts and repair camera. (It still sold for more than I paid for it.)

My worst experience, several years ago, was buying a 250mm lens for the Mamiya C330 I had back then. The seller looked legit and the price was good, so I went for it. When it arrived, it seemed to be in excellent condition - nice, clear glass, shutter function normal, hardly a mark on it. Then I tried the aperture lever, and found it to be very rough and tight and it seemed to get rougher the more I played with it. Finally, with the diaphragm wide open, it and the lever parted company altogether. I was fairly certain that I hadn't broken it and that it wasn't something that happened overnight. I contacted the seller, who seemed apologetic about it. I made a deal with him to refund $100 of the purchase price and I would keep the lens, thinking at the time that I could get it repaired. Wrong! Apparently, replecement parts for that lens don't exist anymore, without cannibalizing another one. The seller did refund the $100, but I'm still stuck with this.......I don't know what to call it, doorstop, paperweight, bric-a-brac, lurking somewhere in a box I never unpacked after our last move. That was my last major purchase on Ebay. All my used lenses bought since then have been from KEH.

 

By the way......anybody want to buy a slightly used Mamiya 250mm lens, cheap?

No problem Anthony. As soon as my girl calls me back I'll pass on any additional information, if any, that may help. Keep up the pressure. If they happen to migrate down this way let me know.

Anthony -- FBI's IC3 cyber-crime division does seem to work. My husband filed a complaint about an item he'd bought and never received ... at about the same time a dozen or so other people suddenly had a problem with the seller. My husband was contacted by the local police in the town where the payments were sent, but since it was in the mid-West and we're on the east coast, and since the item in question only cost about $75, it wasn't worth our while to make the necessary personal appearance to file a formal complaint.

 

As for eBay not protecting sellers, it's part of their whole schtick that they are only the "intermediary" in the transaction, and the buyers and sellers need to "work things out" themselves. I'd have a much easier time buying that if all eBay charged sellers was a fee to list items, but they also get a percentage of the final sale item. To me, that should create more of an obligation on their part to protect the buyers. But at the end of the day, it's the sellers who pay eBay its billions every year, so frankly, eBay just doesn't seem to care about people who get ripped off by folks who have learned to game eBay's system like this. It's a disgrace, and I can't wait for the day when someone is able to find a way to make eBay take more responsibility.

Hi,

 

I too consider that I have been lucky at eBay (thanks god!) except for the loss of an item ~100.00 euros. I have bought very high end gear Including a F2 High Speed and sold high end gear as well like 70-200/VR, 200/4 AF, Mint F3T (champagne) & brand new F3HP etc.

 

In general I contact the buyer by email then couple of phone calls to get the feel before paying for expensive gear from private buyers. Obviously Cameta camera are too safe and excellent. I always PayPal with credit card and get them to ship with tracking or for very high end stuff FedEx.

 

I have come across extremely nice & honest private eBayers (user ID n.i.k.o.n - Jose from Texas, USA; user id nikon-cameras - Meinhard from Munich, Germany) who sets standard. I have even bought things from them even outside eBay ranging from shoes (Macy's did not ship to Australia so he bought it & shipped it for me!) to collectible cameras. Matsuiyastore (eBay sotre) - Noriaki, Japan is the same.

 

But I have seen too many scammers. My eBay Noct-Nikkor lens photos come up all the time every few weeks and I have reported to eBay at least 3 times and then the auction get cancelled.

 

Overall I too agree that if you cannot afford to bear the loss probably should not buy it from private eBayers. Also if you can get it from the local camerastore for a reasonably higher price get it from them instead. Obviously this is not possible for rare items where eBay is probably the best.