how adjustable are 6x9 folder camera rangefinders?

it appears my first post dissapeared...

 

i'm considering changing the lens in an old folder 6x9 rangefinder

bellowed camera (i don't have one yet). I'm wondering how adjustable

these rangefinders are. would i be restricted to using only the same

focal length and correcting for minor differences or might there be

even more room for differences of 10-20% different focal lengths (or

even beyond). anyone care to venture a guess?

 

thanks, jon

Jon,

 

No, most rollfilm RF cameras have a fixed cam, made as part of the RF mechanism. This is NOT a guess!

 

Jerry

Jon,

 

I am familiar with the Horseman lines of folder cameras as I own one. Every Horseman lens made for these comes with a cam that needs to be snapped into the focus bed before the lens is installed. After that the rangefinder works fine. Without the ca you will have to use the ground glass.

 

Most all Horseman folder cameras can use roll film backs.

 

 

Haris

oh - i was under the impression (not from any experience) that the RF was at least somewhat adjustable. i've heard as much about the kalart and hugo meyer for the LF graphic cameras and i've heard as much about the Mamiya 6 I have. i was never under the impression that there was much adjustability (except for the hugo meyer as i remember), but that there was at least some.

Jon,

 

I suppose that I am the only one who read your question completely. You SPECIFIED an "old folder 6x9 rangefinder bellowed camera" like the

Zeiss Super Ikonta C. The others glibly came up with expensive press

type cameras like the Horseman or Graphic. This is NOT what you have.

Do not listen to them.

 

Jerry

jerry,

 

thanks for the reply. i thought something was awry. yes, i am asking the question in reference to the (at the time) extremely common and (as of now) extremely cheap folder cameras. the lenses are quite old, so i was considering upgrading the lens on one. in the likelihood that the lens i use will be a slightly (or considerably) differnt focal length from the one the camera is calibrated to, i was hoping to adjust the rangefinder to focus accurately with the new lens. i've read the rangefinders can come out of adjustment and be subsequently adjusted with the aid of a ground glass. just wondering how far one can go. do you (jerry) or anyone else have an idea of how much adjustment is possible? i suppose i could find first hand when i get one, but i wanted to know if anyone knew whether i'm dreaming too much.

The Tessar on the Ikonta and Super Ikonta is quite good and capable of excellent results.

 

I don't believe it's possible to change these lenses with a different focal length. The physical construction of the camera places the lens 10.5 centimeters from the film plane.

 

If you use a different focal length, such as 90mm for example, the lens standard must then be 90mm from the film plane. That isn't possible with a folding camera without some major work on the camera.

 

You also would need to change components in the rangefinder system. In short, making this change would be extremely difficult without doing some major reconstruction of the camera.

 

In other words, it's probably not worth it.

Jon

 

Most 6x9 folders with rangefinders have pretty reasonable lenses. Heck, even many of the non RF equiped 6x9 folders can return more than acceptable results. I'd suggest trying the camera (if you have it or it is on its way to you) first.

 

If you want an old folder which you can change the lens on, your best bet would be a 2x3 press camera. However, I don't think this is what you had in mind.

 

There was a Certo 6x6 folder that had interchangeable lenses, and there is also the 6x9 Plaubel Makina. However, both of these usually go for more than your average 6x9 folder, and you still have to use the old lenses.

 

Take a look in the classic camera forum for some examples of what the old folders can do.

 

Paul

paul,

 

thanks for the replies. i was thinking of trying the moskva, but i'm pretty sure while i'll enjoy the film size increase and different aspect ratio, i think it's going to have a hard time keeping up with my mamiya 6. i was thinking of dumping the 6 to free up some cash if i could come up with a suitable alternative.

 

i guess the consensus is - don't do it. i'm still interested in knowing how adjustable these rangefinders are. i'd imagine for example that a moskva would be adjustable by swapping a gear or two on in the front prism assembly. it would require a good bit of experimentation, and ultimately a pain to track down the right gears, but i think it could be made to work.

Jon

 

I think a good Moskva, properly adjusted will surprise you! However, some people do find them awkward to handhold in the landscape orientation.

 

You could also look at some of the better 6x6 folders, such as the Super Ikonta, Certo Six (one on ebay right now), old Mamiya 6, or Iskra - all have very good lenses. Best value for money is the Iskra.

 

Buy or borrow one first and see how you get on.

 

Paul