Leica M6 as a companion to pentax gear

Howdy all,

 

This is my first post to the Leica forum and I would like to thank

anybody who comments for their response first and foremost.

 

I currently shoot with pentax 35mm gear, and have found myself

shooting quite a bit with a couple of mx bodies (these are small,

metal, completely manual bodies) and two lenses, they are the 31mm

and 77mm limited lenses. I would like to get a camera that is

quieter than the slrs, has quick manual focus, a robust feel and,

above all, one that has outstanding optics. I can see myself

getting a 28mm and them possibly a 50mm in the future. I shoot

black and white mainly using a handheld meter - mostly street

shooting at festivals and around the town.I do have a darkroom that

I spend any spare time I can in (my wife loves the fact that she

doesn't have to deal with me all the time).

 

I would just like to know if you think that an M body would

compliment the pentax gear for this type of shooting? I briefly

used a Bronica RF but sold it, the problem being mainly a cost issue

then and the speed of the lenses. I usually shoot at f2.8 or

above. I did not mind the rangefinder at all, but I must confess

that I did not have the camera long enough to get truly used to it.

 

 

Oh yeah, btw, does anybody know where I can get my hands on a leica

camera in the western kentucky area? The shops here have canon,

nikon, and pentax, along with digital a plenty, but I have not come

across a leica yet. Thanks much.

Welcome! Murphys Camera in Lexington has a very nice used M6 Classic...jf

If you like the Pentax and don't mind the rangfinder on the M's then I can almost guarantee that you'll love an M6. Especially for street shooting. Price will be an issue. You could buy diamonds for less. But you won't beat the optics, speed of the lenses, the quietness of operation or the size.

 

Try it out and see of you can arrange to borrow a used one from a dealer or friend.

Welcome to the forum, Keith. I started with Pentax 35s many years ago and switched

to Leica Ms about 30 years ago. I credit my years in the darkroom as one reason that

my wife and I have been together for 40 years (39 of them married). I've never gotten

tired of the Leicas or the wife and both have worn well. Hope you have the same

experience.

Hi ...

 

I've been using a couple of MX's along with the Leicas for a few years now. A very complimentary combination, IMO, and they fit nicely in the Domke F-803 satchel. I like the older K lenses for the Pentax, and use the 30mm/2.8 a lot. I think you'll be very happy with the combination.

Keith, a M series camera will complement ANY slr.

 

I was at an art gallery on the weekend, with just a M and 50mm Summicron, taking the occasional available light shots (no flashes or trypods allowed), typically at 1/30th wide open, and realised that there is no 35mm SLR camera that would handle that situation as effectively.

 

For the type of shooting you are talking about, the M has no peers.

I can't speak to whether you'll enjoy the Leica or not, but I would recommend getting one online from a place like keh.com rather than settling for whatever slim pickins you can find locally. They give you 2 weeks to decide if you want to keep it.

soon you will find that your Pentaxs will compliment your leica M very well as your leica will become your first and most often used equipment. I did that with my Nikon many years ago. Welcome and prepare for lots spending ahead.

An M3 replaced my stolen Nikon kit, and I never had the urge (other than MF) to shoot SLRs again.

 

Go for it.

 

Steve

Keith,

If you are used to using a handheld meter, you should take a look at getting an M4

 

Go to www.keh.com and www.tamarkin.com (both recommended) and see what they

have.

 

You will need the extra money for lenses! 28mm Leica lenses don't come cheap!

For street shooting...consider picking up a 50mm collapsible Summicron from

www.kevincameras.com He is a REALLY meticulous dealer and will help you pick out

a good user lens.

 

jmp

Plenty of good/trust-worthy online dealers. Apart from the one's mentioned I would also check with Rich Pinto at www.photovillage.com and perhaps Don at www.donchatterton.com

 

One tends to pay a bit extra when buying from a professional dealer, but then again, you usually get a 1 year warranty, money-back guarantee etc.

 

Leica 28mm lenses are expensive, do consider the alternatives, e.g. Voigtlander and Konica Hexanon, both under $500 in mint condition. Something like a M4 would fit the ticket if you don't want built-in meter, however, a M6TTL is very nice. Personally I think the buil-in meter comes in very handy.

 

Best of luck and welcome to the madhouse!

 

Cheers,

I must confess that I am not sure whether a Pentax could complement an M 6 body for your type of shooting.

 

It might be adviseable to only use the M6 for the time it takes to get to thoroughly learn how to take your pictures with this apparatus and how it functions in detail.

 

I am certain that you will find the M6 perfect for your kind of photography together with a Summilux 50 lens or, if you prefer that focal length, a 28 Elmarit. Both are wondeful lenses.

 

Best of luck!

If you like the feel of the Pentax SLR body, you'll most likely be comfortable with the M body. I've used a Spotmatic for years along with my Leica M3 and they go well together. The M series is much quieter than my Pentax SLR.

I doubt you'll find the Leica M to be much quieter than your Pentaxes; even if there is a slight difference, it likely won't matter in the sort of environments you've mentioned. And contrary to some peoples' claims, I find SLRs MUCH easier and faster to focus than an M. And I also doubt that the M lenses will give better results than your Pentax glass, which is superb. I'd recommend that you spend your money on film, paper, and chemistry rather than more gear.

My M6 was a recent replacement to long-standing Pentax gear which was stolen - ME

Super, K1000 plus lenses, etc.

 

Obviously there's a big price difference but if you're thinking of it this probably isn't

an issue.

 

Otherwise, I can't ever see me going back to a 35mm SLR if that's any

recommendation.

 

Any other camera I get would be to satisfy my long-term ambition to try large format.

<p>"28mm Leica lenses don't come cheap!"</p><p>In a fit of sanity, you could always get a Cosina ("Voigtländer") 28mm lens instead.</p><p>"I usually shoot at f2.8 or above."</p><p>Cosina makes a 28/1.9.</p>

Keith -

 

It's a good question. I've dabbled with Pentax SLRs, Leica & Contax rangefinders, and the Bronica RF645, among (probably too many) others. My short answer to your question would be "sure, go for it." I never found the Leica shutter to be too much quieter than that on the Pentax MX (or the Super Program, which I found even quieter than the MX), but it is somewhat so. In the interest of complicating things more than you'd probably wanted, let me say this:

 

Think about the Contax G series. It has a spectacular 28/2.8 and 45/2 (as well a wonderful 21/2.8 and 90/2.8), it's autofocus, relatively unobtrusive, and as someone who prints his own negatives, I really appreciated the lenses' clarity and contrast.

 

The Leicas are super, for sure: quiet, great lenses, unobtrusive, robus, quiet focusing, all the things you're looking for. But you need to get used to rangefinder focusing. It's not that difficult, and once you get the hang of it (and maybe learn zone focusing / pre-focusing / other techniques) you can use it for developing-situation people photography and street photography to great end (like some of the folks here on the forum); for many, though, it's slower -- it's the old focus-and-recompose deal. Personally, if I were in your shoes, I'd think about a quieter SLR: I've been playing with an Olympus OM-2S lately that is almost as quiet as my M5, and it takes any number of small, very sharp lenses (for B&W work they have startlingly high contrast). I know you're invested in Pentax glass, and as a lover of that line of lenses it pains me to say it, but pick up an OM-2S or the like: you can focus on the ground glass, so you can focus and compose at the same time, they're quiet, robust, and you get aperture priority or manual exposure plus center-weighted or spot metering.

 

There you go, more info than you wanted, and not exactly the kind you wanted. Most importantly, have fun..

 

As an aside, how are the 31 and 77 for manual focusing? And are they as good (image-wise) as the drooling reviewers suggested?

For the range of focal lengths you describe, the Leica M system would be a

replacement rather than a complement. IMHO,the SLR becomes a

necessary complement only if you also do close-up and telephoto work. You should

rent or borrow to see if Leica M works for you, because it is a substantial switch to

make. You may decide that your Pentax system does everything you need, since you

have two outstanding lenses already.

Wow, so many very good answers and help, thanks a bunch. This forum really is one of the best that I have been on. I will check out all the online shops before purchasing, I have my homework cut out for me. I have had some very good experiences shoping at KEH.com and have had nothing to complain about. I find their rating system to be one of the best. Do their prices pretty much show the going rate for the equipment? I have decided that I am not going to do the ebay thing if and when I get down to buying a first leica camera and lens, because I just don't know enough about the gear to make a well thought out purchase, so I will probably wind up going the mailorder route. Unless something comes my way somewhat locally.

 

 

I will probably go with a 50mm for a first lens and save the 28 for a later purchase. I like 50mm as a focal length and I think would be the perfect companion lens for an M body. It is different enough from the other focal lengths that I can see using it along with the pentax lenses. I am still in the thinking justification stage of a purchase like this, so I am going to read and look at as much as I can before I commit.

 

 

NH John, you asked about the manual focusing feel of the limited lenses. Well, they are different than the manual focusing lenses that I also own. I find I can rack the focus faster on the limiteds, there is less dampening than my 200mm M lens, so the M lens feels smoother but takes more time to focus. This is just my perception. The limited lenses are fully metal and the focusing rings are also metal, this feels different than the rubberized rings on the m lenses, and I like them both about the same. The only annoying thing about these lenses is that when you do manually focus, you can hear a slight wirring sound of the autofocus mechanism in the lens. This is a small annoyance and is really forgiven by the quality of the shots that they make. There is something about these lenses that really stand out for me, and it is not sharpness, but rather a 3D look to it. When I shoot wide open, or close to it, the subject that is in focus kind of pops out at you. Its hard to explain, and I am afraid that I do not have a scanner to show. Mabey I will get a family member to upload a few shots to show you. I do not think the reviewers are wrong about these lenses. They both are pretty darn good.

 

 

Thanks so much for all the responses.

I use Pentax slrs (ZX5n, P30t and Super Program) with the 43mm and 77mm Limited lenses. Last year I upgraded from a Canonet rf to a Leica M3 with 50mm Summicron (early 1960s vintage)

 

I thoroughly enjoy the precise feel of the M3 and it's lenses and don't find the focus to be any slower than on an slr, nor do I find it a problem to guess exposure (I use color and b&w print film, not slides) or to meter the scene once and make small adjustments as I shoot. Not a problem for you if considering an M6 but I mention it to encourage you to think about getting the 'real thing' - an M3 with a CLA (which will cost almost as much as an M6)

 

Going from 'automatic' to 'manual' operation wasn't a problem for me as I often use the Pentax in manual exposure & focus modes anyway.

 

One thing that sometimes catches me out is that the Leitz lenses rotate in the opposite direction to the Pentax lenses. To focus closer on the Leica I have to twist clockwise (viewed from the rear) but anti-clockwise on the Pentax Limited lenses.

 

This became an issue when I was using both the Pentax with the 77mm and the M3 with a Canon (adapted-LTM) 85mm in a dimly lit high school gym, trying to focus super accurately at maximum aperture and following the action on the volleyball court I would sometimes miss a shot by turning the focus the wrong way, though I got a lot better with practice. The short shutter lag of the M3 was a blessing as was the ability to see outside of the frameline to anticipate when the ball would arrive in the frame.

 

For the record I believe that Pentax's Limited lenses are even sharper, with more contrast, than my 60s Summicron (which is perfectly clean - no haze and I always use a lenshood) Sorry if that offends the Leica myth-worshippers.

 

Also the shutter quietness is another myth. While my M3 is a little quieter than my manual Pentax SLRs it is a LOT noisier than my Canonet, Olympus RC, Minox 35 (all manual wind leaf shutters) and almost on a par with my motor-wind Contax T3.

 

Another Leica myth is that it is small & unobtrusive. It is near enough the same size and weight as the Pentax Super Program and heavier than my P30 or ZX5n. If you want small, quiet & light get a Minox 35, which you can carry around all day in your pocket.

 

I'm beginning to sound like Jay's myth-busting posts but I don't want you to be disappointed when you start using a Leica. Yes, they are far too expensive by any rational analysis but they feel oh so nice to use.

 

best wishes for a Happy New Year

Anthony

 

Don't worry we are not offended, we all think this to some extent. The Leica is a myth to a large degree, but a very potent one. It is not the size itself - it is the "right" size, nor the quality - Alpas and Contaxes are superior or equal at least, nor its quietness, leaf shutters are bound to be quieter, nor perhaps even the lenses, but it is the combination of all this in one camera SYSTEM that is the secret.

I have used a Pentax Super A for a long time, since a while I also have a M3. Nowadays, I mostly use the M3 if I need different focal lengths but have to admit that the most extensively carried camera is my Minox 35: its cigarette-pack-like size is difficult to beat. The M3 in itself is not small, the main advantages for me being the ease of precise focusing in low light situations and the compact lenses: it takes up less space in my bag then the Pentax. I like it a lot :-) I did miss an integral lightmeter though, this for me being the main advantage of the M6.

 

Marcus

Well!! i used an Mx and always use Pentaxes with Leica but seldom at same time.The Leica is sharper,contrastier and way more detailed.The body is like real strong.The MX is flimsy.Yeah it bends!!

The bad part of Leica,The Pentax MX and others have way better meters!

No flare in older Super Takumar Lenses and the focus mounts do not freeze up in cold climates.I guess i will not be welcome here!

Anyway i love my Leica M3 passionately.6000rolls plus!

Since you already have the 31 and 77 Limited lenses. May I state the obvious. Buy an

LX and the 43mm Limited lens. Although in your situation I'd buy the M or A Series 50

f1.7, and have one of the sharpest wide-open standards ever made. I'd also rather

have two LX bodies (one Tri-X, the other Kodachrome) and the above lenses, than one

Leica any day. But that's just me.