Zeiss Nettar 515 Questions

This folder is strange. It has a 6x4.5 film gate, a 6x6 pressure

plate (with two red windows cut in it for the 6x4.5 format), and a

stamping inside the back that reads "ZEISS IKON FILM 6x9cm". Does

anyone know why? After looking carefully at it, I started wondering

whether Zeiss Ikon had a parts shortage and had to resort to putting

together the Nettar from spare odds and ends. Also, how old is this

camera? It has an uncoated 75mm f/4.5 Nettar-Anastigmat (and Klio

shutter), but the overall design doesn't seem pre-war either.

 

JW

I was just reading the Camera Collector section of an old Popular Photography magazine and came across a picture of a plain Zeiss Ikonta A. The Nettar 515 looks remarkably similar to the Ikonta A (minus the A's Prontor shutter and coated Novar lens). Could the Nettar possibly be a prewar or prototype version of the Ikonta A?

 

JW

 

PS: Merry Christmas and Happy Holidays to All!

Regarding the "6x9" inside the camera back, I wondered the same thing when I first looked at my Super Ikonta. However, it turns out that most or all of the Zeiss cameras using 120 film were so marked, and it seems it had to do mostly with the way the film was marketed.<br>    In the actual "What were they thinking?" department, I think the film counter on the Super Ikonta that only goes to 11 has to take the prize. Sorting out the models is a real challenge.

At the time these cameras were made, roll film was marked for 6x9 and the smaller 6x6 only. The 6x4.5 was mede to get twice as many frames on one roll as the 6x9 did - it's a medium format half-frame camera. Like the 35mm half-frame cameras, it was considered that picture quality would be barely acceptable from such small negatives ;)

The Klio shutter (as well as uncoated lenses, except very few early pre-war samples) was not used on post-war cameras. If the lens has a serial number it is possible to determine the year of manufacturing. Concerning the pressure plate, also on my 6x4.5 pre-war Ikonta it is much bigger than the film window. I think these cameras are marked with '6x9 film' because this was the format 120 film originally was designed for. To advance the film properly, the frame numbers first have to appear in the window distant from the wind knob, for the next frame, advance the film until the same number appears in the window next to the advance knob.

Hmmm...now I understand the reason for the 6x9cm marking, but how about the age? These specs might help: camera serial number (stamped on back) - F39769, penciled numbers inside camera - 32943, dealer sticker inside camera that reads - "Photo-Kino Jos. RODENSTOCK, Nachf. Optiker Wolff - Muchen-Berlin - Robraoptik", and sticker that reads "Zeiss Ikon Film" with a picture of a red/green 120 film box labeled "Panchrom". Thanks again!

 

JW

In general, it seems the cameras with Klio shutters tend to be older ... pre-WWII, but I'll check my book later.

 

Is this an original camera? By that, I mean does it appear if anyone has done any work on it? It sounds like an odd beast, sort of like a collection of disparate parts -- a "Frankenstein" Nettar.

 

The Kodak/Nagel factory was known to mix and match parts as they moved to a newer model from a previous model. It explains why there are so many variations within Retina models, such as IIIc (small c) cameras with the IIIC (big C) single-range meter, plus rewind knobs within the same model having different markings.

 

I didn't think Zeiss-Ikon resorted to this, but you never know. After all, the Nettar you have probably was assembled more than 65 years ago, so who knows what happened on the line late one night!

All the information so far has been very interesting and has definitely piqued my curiousity.

 

Well, if there had been some mixing or replacing of original parts sometime, it had to have been done by either the factory or and expert repairperson, because I could not find any signs of tampering or repairwork anywhere on the camera. Oh, and has anyone had any experience(s) with an uncoated "Nettar-Anastigmat" (as opposed to a coated "Novar-Anastigmat") 75mm f/4.5 lens? The Nettar's in the shop right now having its shutter cleaned under warrenty, so I haven't had a chance to run any film through it. Thanks again!

 

JW

According to my book, the Nettar 515/16 was made from 1938-39. The camera featured metal construction covered in leather (as usual), front-cell focusing and came with either a Nettar f/4.5 or f/6.3 lens. The 6x9 version of this camera featured a Tessar lens.

 

Is the camera marked simply 515? There usually is a "/" followed by another number.

The back is stamped "Nettar 515" - there's no /16 after it.

 

Looking closely at the back rim of the lens, I can barely make out a stamped "238.19". Could that correspond to a production date (i.e. February 19, 1938 - 2/19/38)? Thanks again for all the information - it's been very helpful.

 

JW

I have severe doubts that a) coated lenses reached the market just two years after patenting this process and b) that Tessar lenses were coated pre-war. The only coated Zeiss pre-war lenses I have heard of are the f/1.5 50mm Sonnar lenses. See

 

http://www.cameraquest.com/zconrf2.htm

 

Also, your camera might be a third-party mix-up. In a german camera collectors magazine someone published a photo of a Voigtlaender cameraa equipped with a Tessar with a turning prism assembly (which is useless on a Voigtlaender camera), obviously coming from a 6x6 Ikonta rangefinder.