doug herr Posted August 26, 2003 Share Posted August 26, 2003 Two versions of the same bird; I posted the first photo a while back, describing it as a work in progress:<CENTER><BR><IMG SRC="http://www.wildlightphoto.com/birds/coha01.jpg"><P></CENTER>The second photo:<CENTER><BR><IMG SRC="http://www.wildlightphoto.com/birds/coha02.jpg"></CENTER>I like the detail of the first version, and I prefer the composition of the 2nd. What makes the composition better for me: <P>) there's more tonal and color contrast between the hawk and background<BR>) the background isn't as busy, while still suggesting the bird's forest habitat<BR>) the rim of light from the backlighting accentuates the separation of the hawk from the background.<P>In each photo I used the old Leitz 560mm f/5.6 Telyt, Leicaflex SL and a Kodachrome film. These are both quick scans so don't judge the color quality too much from these files. My Tiltall tripod isn't as sturdy as it ought to be to handle this lens, so I think the next time I have some spare bucks it will go toward a heftier tripod (ugh!) and ball head. Shutter speeds were abysmally slow, 1/15 and 1/8 sec, respectively, so for each exposure I pre-released the SL's mirror and used the self-timer to minimize vibrations. For the 2nd photo I was glad to have a lens that doesn't flare readily.<P>I had been looking for this hawk's nest for several years and finally found it this year as the young were preparing to leave the nest. Next spring I'll know where to look.<P>Comments are always welcome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mark-j Posted August 26, 2003 Share Posted August 26, 2003 Doug: As always, your photos are stunning. I prefer the first one as the subject shows more detail. On #2, the flaring around the bird tends to wash out and override my eyes. The detail may be there, but the range of lighting levels is distracting. For 1/15 and 1/8 these subjects were remarkable motion free. Great shots and thanks for sharing them. Cheers. Mark J. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuart_richardson Posted August 26, 2003 Share Posted August 26, 2003 Nice shot. I would agree with your estimation that the first is better technically, while the second has better composition. Perhaps it is the LCD screen I have on my laptop, but I might even prefer the little one a tiny bit underexposed. I think it would deepen the colors a little bit in a way that would be pleasant. Good job finding a Cooper's hawk nest...they are not the most common hawks by any means (at least not where I am from). With a 560 mm lens and a shutter speed of 1/8, I would say your tripod is probably working quite well! The photos are very crisp! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nowhereman Posted August 26, 2003 Share Posted August 26, 2003 Doug: Magnificent photographs, as ususal. I share your views and prefer the second one for its bokeh and treatment of light: it's more interesting in being more unusual for this type of photograph. I just wish that the tip of the beak were a little bit more in profile so that it would not visiually merge into the body. I also like the colors very much -- and this is why I suppose you are using Kodachrome, in order not to get Velvia-like saturation and gaudiness and kitsch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
norman_mayersohn Posted August 26, 2003 Share Posted August 26, 2003 Terrific work, Douglas. I am in awe of your patience. Are Cooper's hawks the ones that have been observed working in pairs to run down prey (in open areas, not woodlands)? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gerry_szarek Posted August 26, 2003 Share Posted August 26, 2003 Doug, picture 2 definitely has better composition, however 1 is better technically. Some hints, get faster film to increase the shutter speed, scan the film at max resolution, then run it thru neatimage to remove the grain, this will give you the Kodakchrome look without the slow speed limitations. I actually prefer photographing Osprey, much easier, they sit on their nests in the wide open. You grab the 400mm get as close as possible, then snap away, kind of like shooting fish in a barrel. I will post a picture tonight assuming I get some time. GS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
henk Posted August 26, 2003 Share Posted August 26, 2003 Douglas, Both are excellent images by there own merits IMO. I personally prefer the second image because it works in a way that mystifies the bird of prey, it suggest ALOT about it being a predator(focus, posture and backlit lighting and thus time of day). And at the same time offers enough detail to satisfy my curiousity. The first image is much more discriptive, it shows the bird on watchout in his habitat, as such it is fine IMO. The thing that i find most important in this comparison is the fact that ive NEVER seen an image of a cooper hawk like the second image, and dozens of them like the first. The ability to really 'tell' something about a bird is what is distinctive about the original 'Douglas Herr' image, i am always eagre to see more of them simply because there is no equivalent..... Norman, The Cooper hawk predates on songbirds and the like, its natural habitat should be mainly at the edges of a forrest where songbirds feed and nest in the (berry) bushes. They are found on watchout in trees overseeing their habitat, like captured by Douglas. When taking care of their offspring they work in pairs, dont know if they 'mate for life' though. I could be wrong though, i dont live in America and never studied them so when im wrong, please someone correct me. Greetings, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
henk Posted August 26, 2003 Share Posted August 26, 2003 Norman, I forgot something, some prey birds nest deeper into the forrest to prevent scaring of prey in their hunting habitat, dont know if its true for the Cooper but i suspect it can be. It depends on more factors though like population density, nesting opportunities and so on... Greetings, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
henk Posted August 26, 2003 Share Posted August 26, 2003 Douglas, I forgot about your question..... At first i thought the first image would benefit from a center-subject-crop, then i realized you probably did it this way to suggest a possible attack and movement in the direction suggested by the crop. It works for me... Closing in on the bird wouldnt work well IMO, and since it is compositionally correct i dont have any idea how to improve the crop. Greetings, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
henk Posted August 26, 2003 Share Posted August 26, 2003 "Closing in on the bird wouldnt work well IMO, and since it is compositionally correct i dont have any idea how to improve the crop." Im making a mess, this was related to the second image. Greetings, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al_kaplan1 Posted August 26, 2003 Share Posted August 26, 2003 I prefer the first image much better than the second, composition be damned! The second is somewhat flared out and the bokeh is a bit overwhelming. If you're carrying a bag with other photo gear, hanging it from the center post helps to stabilize the tripod. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tcb.photo Posted August 26, 2003 Share Posted August 26, 2003 Hi Douglas I like the first image better also. The second is nice but the sun flare is sort of distracting. Both a nicely done though Rob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doug herr Posted August 26, 2003 Author Share Posted August 26, 2003 I want to thank everyone for their comments - especially for the divergent opinions and preferences! I consider both of these works in progress because I want to combine the tecnical quality (and then some) of the first photo with the visual effects of the 2nd one. The birds have dispersed now and though I see them occasionally the next best opportunities for photos will be next spring when the nest will be the center of activity.<P> For those who haven't done much wildlife photography I should mention that photographing birds near nests should be done very carefully and with the birds' welfare foremost in mind. Too much disturbance can cause nesting failure, and predators will also follow a human's scent trail to a nest. Another factor to consider is the agressive defense of the nest by several species, including the Cooper's Hawk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ralph_barker Posted August 26, 2003 Share Posted August 26, 2003 Lovely work, as usual, Douglas. Although the first image obviously provides better documentation of the bird's physiology, I really like the mood of the second image. It gives almost a prey's-eye view of the hawk. Have you thought about taking them a plump little mouse as a nest-warming gift? ;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wingell Posted August 26, 2003 Share Posted August 26, 2003 Stunning work, Doug. I'm in Ralph's corner on these images. I love the detail and color in the first, but the mood of the second is lovely--especially the light on the tail. As for a "nestwarming" gift, perhaps a decent-sized garden snake would be nice: recently, I spotted a snake dangling from the beak of a red-tailed as it cruised above my place. Thanks for sharing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
henk Posted August 26, 2003 Share Posted August 26, 2003 LOL Ralph, how about a family-size bag of peanuts smeared with lard? Then those songbirds will fly right into the nest ;)P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gerry_szarek Posted August 26, 2003 Share Posted August 26, 2003 Doug, the great thing a picture 2 is the bird looks like it's ready to pounce on a meal! Here is a boring Osprey picture. GS<div></div> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bob l Posted August 26, 2003 Share Posted August 26, 2003 Doug, I am in envy of your work. As you know I have both the 400 & 560 and an appreciation for your patience and wildlife photography skills to capture such magnificent photo's. Both photo's are fine in their own way. Third photo will be a "show stopper". Thanks for posting your magnificent work. Bob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doug herr Posted August 26, 2003 Author Share Posted August 26, 2003 <I>Have you thought about taking them a plump little mouse as a nest-warming gift? ;-)</I><P> LOL, as it happens I was back in the area last Sunday photographing a Desert Cottontail rabbit (film heading toward the lab as I type) when one of the adult Cooper's Hawks flew into a nearby tree. I had spent about an hour gaining the rabbit's trust to where I could photograph it from less than 10 feet away,so I thought it would be bad form to flush the rabbit out for the hawk's amusement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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