triblett_lungre_thurd Posted July 2, 2003 Share Posted July 2, 2003 domenico, finding good music, like art, is a measure of one's desire to uncover good things to enrich the listener's/viewer's life. and you, my friend, must be slacking. i'm not simply hopping on yer head because of yer generalizations but rather hoping to inspire you to dig a little deeper. every generation has produced wonderful art and music... you just gotta look for it. the charts, critics, curators etc. tend to play it safe and fill their pockets, galleries, that's their job. and finding the good stuff has never been easy. if yer like me, you won't like much that's handed to you anyway. i don't wish to imply that all popular music and art is trash, every now and then some good stuff gets through but if you don't mind looking around, taking a few chances, you'll find what you need. some of the best music you've ever heard, soul-stirring, original and inspiring works are being made just now. rarely if ever does it make it's way to radio nor scratch the charts... but seek and ye shall find. art too. promise, me p.s. john, where's this election you speak of? because suddenly, i feel like voting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
triblett_lungre_thurd Posted July 2, 2003 Share Posted July 2, 2003 oh yeah... pollock sucks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
domenico_foschi Posted July 3, 2003 Share Posted July 3, 2003 Triblett, i agree with you , but i have also noticed that the little quality work coming out from mainstream culture is mostly being ignored from the general public . Creative work , to be considered Art has to be honest , and doesn't have to merely scratch the surface . A good work of art can offend , challenge to exphand the perception of the viewer , challenge the reality of the viewer or listener , have a political slant , .... What i am trying to say is that a piece of work that is being accepted by the majority is likely to be lacking of the content necessary to make it a timeless piece of art . In the infamous 80's i was a 20 years old . In those years the record industry was indeed producing terrible stuff , except a few bands , like the Talking heads , Clash , Television , etc. ets. But , just because these bands were coming out from a mainstream venue , it doesn't mean it was popular music . We too often define categories too broadly , we generalize ... I don't define Art popular by its distributor , but from its caracteristics . If it doesn't challenge , for me it can go straight to the Salvation Army Store . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
domenico_foschi Posted July 3, 2003 Share Posted July 3, 2003 Pollock doesn't suck . You don't like it . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg_pratt1 Posted July 3, 2003 Share Posted July 3, 2003 Would not the original question have been better asked = Why is Bad Art so popular? The striving for conformity the need, seemingly, to drag others down to ones common level is beyound me. Ever sat in a pub for a chat with out drinking? The drinkers of the group are soon uncomfortable and soon urge one to drink something. Might art tastes follow the same logic? Music it seems follows the same trend. If it doesn't sate the immediate fashion it's rendered offensive by many. Am I right in concluding that popular art is often course, vulgar and in your face, both of content and colour. Something to energise rather than to relax. So often we hear the call from the stressed for personal peace, yet the same folk suround them selves in raucouse sounds and images. I am at loss to famthom this human trait. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg_pratt1 Posted July 3, 2003 Share Posted July 3, 2003 Would not the original question have been better asked = Why is Bad Art so popular? The striving for conformity the need, seemingly, to drag others down to ones common level is beyound me. Ever sat in a pub for a chat with out drinking? The drinkers of the group are soon uncomfortable and soon urge one to drink something. Might art tastes follow the same logic? Music it seems follows the same trend. If it doesn't sate the immediate fashion it's rendered offensive by many. Am I right in concluding that popular art is often course, vulgar and in your face, both of content and colour. Something to energise rather than to relax. So often we hear the call from the stressed for personal peace, yet the same folk suround them selves in raucouse sounds and images. I am at loss to fathom this human trait. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
triblett_lungre_thurd Posted July 3, 2003 Share Posted July 3, 2003 domenico, i'm not sure what yer complaining about? it's always been that way. we grew up in the same time... the 80's were absolutely chocked full of great music, from start to finish. it's still that way... great bands if they're incredibly lucky and tour their asses off might sell 300k copies, make a gorgeous album and get dropped by their label, that's the free-market cookie and how it crumbles. see also; wilco me p.s. and some toil away for decades until they get a morsel. see also; the flaming lips. they actually won a grammy this year domenico! can you believe it? the lips? i don't know any masses, so i can't speak for them. if you think the masses' taste sucks, then burn them a copy, send 'em a print. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
triblett_lungre_thurd Posted July 3, 2003 Share Posted July 3, 2003 as con-artistry goes, it's genius... but pollock sucks goats, me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
domenico_foschi Posted July 3, 2003 Share Posted July 3, 2003 What complain ? I am not complaining , i was only answering to John's question . Remember ? John...... Question...... ? Trust me , in my little world i am surrounded , of the things i llke , i have no reason to complain in this matter . domenico www.dfoschisite.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nicholas_f._jones Posted July 3, 2003 Share Posted July 3, 2003 Greetings, Sorry it�s taken me so long to jump in on this one, but I�ve got a day job � My grandmother embroidered dresser scarves and pillow cases using kits with the pattern printed in blue on the cloth and the colors of floss assigned by the instructions. My parents painted by the numbers and proudly hung their finished work around the house. They had a nice collection of store-bought spun glass figurines, � until my brother and I were playing catch in the house as weren't supposed to do, and I threw the ball high over my brother�s head � �Honor thy father and thy mother.� My best friend on my street in LA not only loved Elvis (I can still remember him showing me that vinyl album cover with the King in a gold suit �50 million fans can�t be wrong� etc.)�but he did his best to look like Elvis, pompadour and all, and he had musical talent, and eventually joined a band playing sax, marimba, keyboards, singing, you name it � My parents played in family band, Hawaiian stuff that would be called luau music, Don Ho "Tiny Bubbles" style. My dad played electric bass, my mother uke, my uncle dreadnought acoustic guitar, and a family friend, the leader, lap steel. �The first thing I remember knowin� was a lonesome whistle blowin� �� (I grew up right next to the train tracks) � and a steel guitar. So I became a lifelong traditional and country & western music lover. Photography? My dad was a pro�studio portrait photographer, using a 5x7 on a tripod until he discovered Mamiya MF. I remember so fondly that early trip to Yosemite. Ansel Adams, � man, he took good pictures! No one was asking whether it was �good� or �bad� art, or whether it was art at all. My mother, god bless her, also appreciated classical music (she was a very good player of light classics on the piano) and French impressionistic painting. She somehow transmitted to us the distinction between �good� and �bad� music. This notion was totally out of sync with the culture we were all living in, but no matter. � I can still remember when the local rock band played an assembly at my high school (early 1960�s). When we all got back to the band room, the music director had a real problem on his hands, � we all loved the band, but this was not �good� music � The turning point for me came when Andy Warhol hit. I must have found about Pop Art from Time magazine. Up in my attic bedroom I started my own museum of cast-off found-art collectibles. The Andy of the time boxes (can�t remember what they�re called, and I should since I work in Pittsburgh, Andy�s home and location of the Warhol museum) � and very much in the style of Walker Evans. So I'd made my choice. The other night we went to a flute recital down at CMU. Second chair in the Pittsburgh SO played the Gaubert Fantasie better than I�ve ever heard the flute played in my entire life (it�s my instrument, too). Finally, I think I�ve reached a point where I�m not so worried any more whether it�s �good� or �bad��. Why do we all beat ourselves up on this obsolete, unnecessary, and often divisive distinction? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matthew_stanton2 Posted July 3, 2003 Share Posted July 3, 2003 Me, Pollock may or may not have sucked goats but your argument as to how and why he sucked goats is a little thin on the ground. Not Me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
triblett_lungre_thurd Posted July 4, 2003 Share Posted July 4, 2003 ok matt, i'll bite. how's this? it's splattered paint, me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matthew_stanton1 Posted July 4, 2003 Share Posted July 4, 2003 Thanks Tribblet, Your rigorous evaluation of an artist's motivations has been of great benefit. Matt ( no he's not my favourite artist ) Stanton Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
triblett_lungre_thurd Posted July 4, 2003 Share Posted July 4, 2003 ironic ain't it, matt? i used precisely the same exact amount of rigor and ingenuity to construct my argument as.... you guessed it, me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
triblett_lungre_thurd Posted July 4, 2003 Share Posted July 4, 2003 and, i'll hazard to point out that my elucidations are of similar benefit as.... you guessed it, me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matthew_stanton2 Posted July 5, 2003 Share Posted July 5, 2003 Tribblet, Of course the percieved irony actually only exists if one accepts your premise that Pollocks art is devoid of semantic value. As such I may be the only one here who begs to differ... If you like it or not Pollock's work was informed by a number of philosophical & metaphysical concerns. The most profound influence on many artists of this era was existentialism but Pollock's paintings also explored American Indian philosophies as well as Taoism and Animism. If one looks at the progression of his art from the earlier figurative/ totemic work to the more well known action paintings the evolution of his visual language makes sense. To consider context It also parallels the evolution of more fluid musical forms in the same era ie: jazz and poetic forms ie: Beat Poetry. I consider these to be all valid forms of creative expression but you may not ...so where does this leave us? Do you want to know this?.. perhaps not ...do I want to say any more on this topic.. not really ..I would rather be ranting on about an artist I really love. yours goatsuckingly, MAtt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robert_a._zeichner1 Posted July 6, 2003 Share Posted July 6, 2003 This should about do it. http://www.jinwicked.com/artihate/kinkade.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
triblett_lungre_thurd Posted July 8, 2003 Share Posted July 8, 2003 um matt, which jazz? bird bleep-bloop-haven't-had-a-lesson-sounds-like-a-compressor-glued-to-a-sax-mouthpiece Parker? feh! which beat? jack-today-i'm-gonna-type-with-only-my-left-hand Kerouac? he's yers, you can keep the overhyped, half-wit windbag. quit spouting the rhetoric, boy, i got off the turnip truck last week, not yesterday. gimme rod mckuen over them sucks any time, me p.s. i kinda like hunke though... that old queen was good. p.p.s. re; pollock... yes, sold as such. but i can do that with one of my doodoo logs too. explain it with fitty-cent art school terms and after i die it goes on permanent display at the whit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matthew_stanton2 Posted July 11, 2003 Share Posted July 11, 2003 Tribblet, When did you last sell one of your "doo doo logs" ? Did you get the price you were hoping for? I think it would look great as a permanent installation next to Duchamp's upside down urinal! Matt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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