old lens - new shutter

I own two older lenses. The one is a planar 2.8/100 in a Linhof

dedicated Compur shutter, the other is a Symmar (convertible) 5.6/180-

12/310 in the same shutter as above. This shutters have the obsolete

shutter-times 1/5, 1/10, 1/25, 1/50, 1/100 and so on.

Is it possible to change the shutter in a modern Copal? What size

(#0, #1) do they need?

The one reason why i would do that is because i think that an actual

shutter-model is more accurate and the other reason is that i want to

have on all my lenses the same shutter times and have no more

troubles with compensating when i calculate.

Yes, #1 shut be thr right size for both of them. It might be easier for you to calculate with modern shutter times but the difference isn't that big comapared to shutter tolerances.

to piggyback on this question, I have a Schneider (convertible) 240/420, and little part where the release cable attaches to the shutter has come off. I'm not sure what size the compur shutter is, but I like to replace it with a Copal. I going to box it up and send it to Woonsocket CT (SK Grimes) to find out if it can be repaired but before I do, I'm hoping somebody may know....

 

1. What size compur shutter the 240/420 is mounted in?

2. Will it go directly into a Copal?

 

TIA

Dave

As far as the 2,8-100 Zeiss planar is concerned (covers-6x9 only), the one I have is fitted to a #2 Synchro-Compur with the same series of speeds. I am not sure that it would fit on a #1. # 2 shutter sizes are discontinued in modern shutter series and f/2.8 view camera lenses are rare birds nowadays. I'm afraid that the 2,8-100 planar (or his competitor the 2.8-100 xenotar) might be too big for a #1. So if your shutter is actually a #2, an upgrade could be feasible on a #3 with special adaptor rings.

 

For the convertible symmar 180/310, if it is a #1 the upgrade is likely to be feasible without any adaptor ring.

According to Schneider (www.schneideroptics.com, always a good place to look before asking:), both the 180/5.6 Symmar and their 100mm/2.8 Xenotar were mounted in #1 shutters. So both of yours could be mounted in modern #1 shutters.

 

What makes the shutter times "obsolete"? Film sensitivity is quoted within +/- 1/6th stop, shutter times within 15%, apertures (f-stops) differ from transmission (T-stop) by anything up to 25%... Besides, these shutters don't have click-stops on the shutter speeds, do they?

I have a 180 convertible Symmar (or rather, my lab does) and it

works fine with the elements transferred to a Copal Polaroid #1

shutter. Any #1 shutter will work, but you may have to make or

buy an aperture scale.

 

The 240 Symmar was in a #2 shutter, for which there is no

modern equivalent. Shutters turn up from time to time on eBay,

but if the only problem is a missing release socket a competent

machinist can easily fit one for you. If you *must* have a new

shutter, a Copal 3 will work with suitable adaptors to hold the

lens cells, but your top speed and minimum aperture will both

be limited.

 

S.K.Grimes are universally recommended for shutter repairs and

aperture scales, and having recently dealt with them for the first

time myself, I can see why.

Ole,

both of my linhof-dedicated compur shutters have click-stops. If i take a time between two click-stops, will the shutter release with the time between these two click-stops?

Martin, this is the first time I've heard of an old shutter with clickstops. My lenses are in shutters (Compound and Compur) made between 1927 and 1980, and none of them have clickstops!

 

By the way I have found the oldest one (1927 Compound) to be the most accurate one, easily outperforming 1970's Compurs.

 

Only three times are adjustable in a CLA: 1s, 1/10 (or 1/15), and top speed. All other times just happen to fall between these, and are marked accordingly. Since the makers presumably know the shutters well, the consistency is very good; but the other times are actually not individually adjustable. So if you place the indicator between two clicks, the time will be between as well.

 

But I would advice you to have the actual speeds checked - that's a lot cheaper than two new shutters plus mounting. You could be lucky - maybe it's just the markings that are obsolete?

 

Many people have lists of the actual measured shutter times, and refer to them for exposure correction.

Martin. You cannot set intermediate speeds on a Synchro Compur, but you can compensate with intermediate apertures. Assuming that your

shutter has been perfectly calibrated to the series 1 1/2 1/5 1/10 1/25 1/50 1/100 1/200, the following correspondences can be applied

 

1/5 = 1/4 - 1/3 stop

1/10 = 1/8 - 1/3 stop

1/25 = 1/30 + 1/4 stop

1/50 = 1/60 + 1/4 stop

1/100=1/125 + 1/3 stop

1/200=1/250 + 1/3 stop

 

In black and white or color neg, you won't probably notice anything by using the closest value to the modern series of speeds 4 8 15 30 60 125 250

Thank you, folks for the answers!

Now you have convinced me not to change my compur shutters into the modern copal. It is a lot cheaper to change the lensboards only to fit the lenses on my Super Technika V 6x9.

Thanks again for the help to save my money!